Confirmed with Link: All-Purpose Coyotes Arena Talk: [Update] Land Auction Cancelled, Meruelo waiving ownership rights.

[Jamieh]

I think what I'm most looking forward to, if they win the auction and this all comes to fruition, that now I can go and comment on other teams and taunt "well atleast my owner didn't need public funds to play in an arena".

Might want to wait at least until the Coyotes stop being on the receiving end of Revenue Sharing.

 

[awfulwaffle]

Might want to wait at least until the Coyotes stop being on the receiving end of Revenue Sharing.

That's dumb, because there's going to be multiple teams every year that take revenue sharing.

 

[Jamieh]

That's dumb, because there's going to be multiple teams every year that take revenue sharing.

Seems odd to make fun of teams who used public money for arena when you get a share of their revenue in some cases? But hey you do you I guess?

 

[Sinurgy]

I don't care what the haters think now and i don't care what they think if this actually happens. They can kick rocks no matter the scenario. Instead I'm more excited about the possibility of finally having hockey stability in the AZ and should it come to fruition I'm going to focus on celebrating and joy rather than use energy gloating.

They say the opposite of love is hate but it's not, the opposite of love is apathy, and I don't care about the haters at all.

 

[awfulwaffle]

Seems odd to make fun of teams who used public money for arena when you get a share of their revenue in some cases? But hey you do you I guess?

I'm not going to go into this, because some markets have lucrative local TV deals, compared to the Coyotes that have crap ratings. There are plenty of other reasons that go into a team's finances than just gate revenue.

If anything, that's an even bigger flex if AM is spending $$(cap friendly doesn't have us last), able to pay for your own arena and district, and still be able to survive the losses the team might incur because of the small $ amount received from tv contracts and such.

Not to mention, the $ received from revenue sharing is probably less than the $ received by other owners from municipalities for their stadiums. The Jets needed municipality assistance, and they got revenue sharing.

 

[LittlePipes]

My dream: Bettman standing on carpet at Mullet center ice at the end of the last Mullet game, handing Lord Stanleys Cup to Clayton Keller, with photos of the next seasons arena on the jumbotron. And I’m stuck wondering whether to laugh or cry.

 

[Llewzaher]

The draft party could be a fun one this year.

I had hope for an Ishbia or tribe plan if this fails but SLC is likely going to be it. Which shouldn't surprise anyone except for Jakey.
I think we're going to win the auction, but I'm quite concerned with XG talking about relocation already. The optics on this by ownership is lacking confidence, especially on the day the auction date is declared.

Could some residential investor come in and decide to throw in a small youth indoor hockey rink as an addon and out bid? Or does it have to be an NHl size arena?

Also is this arena AM is building in competition with other arenas in the PHX area for concerts and events etc?

 

[Jamieh]

I'm not going to go into this, because some markets have lucrative local TV deals, compared to the Coyotes that have crap ratings. There are plenty of other reasons that go into a team's finances than just gate revenue.

If anything, that's an even bigger flex if AM is spending $$(cap friendly doesn't have us last), able to pay for your own arena and district, and still be able to survive the losses the team might incur because of the small $ amount received from tv contracts and such.

Not to mention, the $ received from revenue sharing is probably less than the $ received by other owners from municipalities for their stadiums. The Jets needed municipality assistance, and they got revenue sharing.

I don't th8nk the Jets "needed" financial assistance from City? They just happen to take advantage if a place where an arena was needed and sport is number 1. You do know Jets Owner is one of the richest owners in sports right??

 

[TheLegend]

Might want to wait at least until the Coyotes stop being on the receiving end of Revenue Sharing.

Didn’t slow Jets fans down after it came out they got RS over a spell… many of them are still in denial over it too.

Trolls are going to be trolls. Was just reading the same 15 year old “Yoteisms” from Donk assed posters on the mains yesterday.

 

[Jamieh]

Could some residential investor come in and decide to throw in a small youth indoor hockey rink as an addon and out bid? Or does it have to be an NHl size arena?

Also is this arena AM is building in competition with other arenas in the PHX area for concerts and events etc?

Personally I think this "Auction" is set up in favor of the Coyotes, no concern about competition for me.

Didn’t slow Jets fans down after it came out they got RS over a spell… many of them are still in denial over it too.

Trolls are going to be trolls. Was just reading the same 15 year old “Yoteisms” from Donk assed posters on the mains yesterday.

It seems when some posters here write about other Cities, Players, etc it's all OK because there are only a few and "they started it".

 

[Edenjung]

Man all of this crazy news has been dropping while I'm traveling. Feels good that we will finally have clarity.

I feel you. Just catching back on.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Could some residential investor come in and decide to throw in a small youth indoor hockey rink as an addon and out bid? Or does it have to be an NHl size arena?

The cost proposition for bidding on 100 acres of land at that per-acre price point just to put up a small indoor hockey rink to meet the minimum land use requirements is simply ridiculous. It's not even worth thinking about. Even the biggest NHL trolls with the biggest bankrolls wouldn't dream of throwing away that many millions of dollars just to block the Coyotes from building a new barn, and anyone wanting to build a youth hockey rink is already facing the prospect of low revenues.

Also is this arena AM is building in competition with other arenas in the PHX area for concerts and events etc?

It will be a direct competitor to Footprint Center and Desert Diamond Arena, yes. But its proximity to Scottsdale Airport, as well as the surrounding area amenities and the facility's own design, are going to be significant pluses and make it more appealing than older, less friendly and aesthetic venues like the other two arenas.

I don't th8nk the Jets "needed" financial assistance from City? They just happen to take advantage if a place where an arena was needed and sport is number 1. You do know Jets Owner is one of the richest owners in sports right??

They absolutely do need the financial assistance from the city because they don't have a corporate support base nearly big and active enough to offset the ownership's cost of operations. And yes, Chipman and TNSE could easily just absorb all of the annual losses, but why would they want to if they can convince the city and provincial governments to pay subsidies because they believe hockey is a birthright?

 

[Jamieh]

The cost proposition for bidding on 100 acres of land at that per-acre price point just to put up a small indoor hockey rink to meet the minimum land use requirements is simply ridiculous. It's not even worth thinking about. Even the biggest NHL trolls with the biggest bankrolls wouldn't dream of throwing away that many millions of dollars just to block the Coyotes from building a new barn, and anyone wanting to build a youth hockey rink is already facing the prospect of low revenues.



It will be a direct competitor to Footprint Center and Desert Diamond Arena, yes. But its proximity to Scottsdale Airport, as well as the surrounding area amenities and the facility's own design, are going to be significant pluses and make it more appealing than older, less friendly and aesthetic venues like the other two arenas.



They absolutely do need the financial assistance from the city because they don't have a corporate support base nearly big and active enough to offset the ownership's finances. And yes, Chipman and TNSE could easily just absorb all of the annual losses, but why would they want to if they can convince the city and provincial governments to pay subsidies because they believe hockey is a birthright?

So they don't need it?? Just like I wrote.

 

[TheLegend]

Personally I think this "Auction" is set up in favor of the Coyotes, no concern about competition for me.

78% of all the auctions since 2017 have been 1 bid auctions. I suppose the state was in cahoots with all them too??

It seems when some posters here write about other Cities, Players, etc it's all OK because there are only a few and "they started it".

Didn’t they?

Ever read the MakeItSeven website Balsillie set up when he was trying to poach the Yotes.

I did.

I personally watched them talk and plan on going into AZ Republic’s website daily and disrupt the message areas by spamming them. Then openly boast about it.

And then when Glendale decides to spend $25 million to keep the Coyotes here they plotted to go into Atlanta’s hosting pages and to the same thing, only this time they pretended to be Coyotes fans trolling them.

There are posters I know who are still on HF who maintained trolling accounts on Twitter when it grew in popularity and did the same.

 

[Jamieh]

78% of all the auctions since 2017 have been 1 bid auctions. I suppose the state was in cahoots with all them too??


Didn’t they?

Ever read the MakeItSeven website Balsillie set up when he was trying to poach the Yotes.

I did.

I personally watched them talk and plan on going into AZ Republic’s website daily and disrupt the message areas by spamming them. Then openly boast about it.

And then when Glendale decides to spend $25 million to keep the Coyotes here they plotted to go into Atlanta’s hosting pages and to the same thing, only this time they pretended to be Coyotes fans trolling them.

There are posters I know who are still on HF who maintained trolling accounts on Twitter when it grew in popularity and did the same.

I didn't mean it as a bad thing in regards to Auction. I simply meant the City knows what they want and the Coyotes are the best bet to provide that.

Edit: forgot to add that I don't go reading cesspool bs from children. If you want to fill your boots.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

Here are all the notices attached to the auction.

Auction Notice (PDF,10 pages) - Contains all the details of the auction including qualifications, and requirements.

https://land.az.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/53-124365%20notice.pdf

Auction Flyer (PDF, 1 page)

https://land.az.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/53-124365_flyer.pdf

Phase 1 ESA (PDF, 325 pages) (Note: Looks like same as the original 200 acre study)

https://land.az.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/53-124365%20phase1.pdf

ALTA/NSPS Land Title Survey (PDF, 6 pages)

https://land.az.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/53-124365%20alta.pdf

City of Phoenix Infrastructure Letter (PDF, 10 pages)

https://land.az.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/53-124365%20City%20of%20Phoenix%20Infrastructure%20Letter.pdf

Thanks, quite the read. Speedie & Associates put a lot of work in here and I haven't read in full (and may not LOL). Some takes:
After all this the Meruelo group gets no mineral rights, not a big deal hereabouts, but DAMN.
Coyote luck will most likely increase the likelihood of artifacts and or human remains ten fold!
Looks to me like the property extends north beyond the current renderings.
I and most likely the Meruelo group am/are looking forward to the completion of the IGA of the rawhide and PRFCP..... not interested in a Calgary like event.
Finally a question. After a quick read it appears easements are required for utilities along roads yet to exist, I would think that traffic studies will mandate the extension of the Thompson Peak/Deer Valley roads, at least within the district. There was some mention of 64th St. easements, do you think an at least partial extension of 64th St (to a Deer Valley extension )is in the cards? If so, it would be sweet for ingress and egress.... at least until surrounding area develops.

 

[awfulwaffle]

So they don't need it?? Just like I wrote.

So why did they take it then? Why didn't they say "no thanks, we're going to help the community out by absorbing all the costs ourselves", like AM is trying to do and attempted to do with TED?

 

[TheLegend]

Thanks, quite the read. Speedie & Associates put a lot of work in here and I haven't read in full (and may not LOL). Some takes:
After all this the Meruelo group gets no mineral rights, not a big deal hereabouts, but DAMN.
Coyote luck will most likely increase the likelihood of artifacts and or human remains ten fold!
Looks to me like the property extends north beyond the current renderings.
I and most likely the Meruelo group am/are looking forward to the completion of the IGA of the rawhide and PRFCP..... not interested in a Calgary like event.
Finally a question. After a quick read it appears easements are required for utilities along roads yet to exist, I would think that traffic studies will mandate the extension of the Thompson Peak/Deer Valley roads, at least within the district. There was some mention of 64th St. easements, do you think an at least partial extension of 64th St is in the cards? If so, it would be sweet for ingress and egress.... at least until surrounding area develops.

Outside of Coyote luck I haven’t the foggiest idea about the rest of it.

Mainly because I haven’t had the time.

 

[Jamieh]

So why did they take it then? Why didn't they say "no thanks, we're going to help the community out by absorbing all the costs ourselves", like AM is trying to do and attempted to do with TED?

Do you seriously believe AM wouldn't be trying to get Govt money if there was any appetite to supply it? Seriously? And you do know the arena in Winnipeg was built long before the Jets right? The operating subsidy is from several sources such as an entertainment tàx...remember that as I suspect The Coyotes will be getting it as well.

 

[cobra427]

A couple of points for me:

It seems like this is grade "A" land being in the heart of the north Scottsdale area. I would think many other developers would have interest in this land for other projects. It wouldn't surprise me if competition showed up.

XG saying relocation is next if this doesn't go through, is kind of hail merry window dressing. I think he is trying to put some pressure on Phoenix to pick the Coyotes in an auction, but no town in the Phoenix market has ever cared or responded like they have to keep a team here.

I don't think its the NHL saying this spot or we move, I think it is more the Coyotes trying to put pressure on the NHL to help them in some way. I still don't think the NHL moves the team if this auction fails.

I hope they win the bid and this saga of uncertainty is over.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

So they don't need it?? Just like I wrote.

They do need it, because if they didn't have it, Chipman wouldn't have the team there, no matter how rich he is.

 

[AZDesertKnight]

A couple of points for me:

It seems like this is grade "A" land being in the heart of the north Scottsdale area. I would think many other developers would have interest in this land for other projects. It wouldn't surprise me if competition showed up.

XG saying relocation is next if this doesn't go through, is kind of hail merry window dressing. I think he is trying to put some pressure on Phoenix to pick the Coyotes in an auction, but no town in the Phoenix market has ever cared or responded like they have to keep a team here.

I don't think its the NHL saying this spot or we move, I think it is more the Coyotes trying to put pressure on the NHL to help them in some way. I still don't think the NHL moves the team if this auction fails.

I hope they win the bid and this saga of uncertainty is over.

Also, XG would prefer an outside market buyer because that's more $$$ to the Meruelo group. But I have faith they'll get it done.

 

[BlazingBlueAnt]

A couple of points for me:

It seems like this is grade "A" land being in the heart of the north Scottsdale area. I would think many other developers would have interest in this land for other projects. It wouldn't surprise me if competition showed up.

XG saying relocation is next if this doesn't go through, is kind of hail merry window dressing. I think he is trying to put some pressure on Phoenix to pick the Coyotes in an auction, but no town in the Phoenix market has ever cared or responded like they have to keep a team here.

I don't think its the NHL saying this spot or we move, I think it is more the Coyotes trying to put pressure on the NHL to help them in some way. I still don't think the NHL moves the team if this auction fails.

I hope they win the bid and this saga of uncertainty is over.

I'd 100% believe the NHL is saying it's here or relo. They don't' want to deal with this debacle anymore.

The only positive is the A's are doing their best to make this not look as ridiculous as it is.

 

[Jagged Ice]

A couple of points for me:

It seems like this is grade "A" land being in the heart of the north Scottsdale area. I would think many other developers would have interest in this land for other projects. It wouldn't surprise me if competition showed up.

XG saying relocation is next if this doesn't go through, is kind of hail merry window dressing. I think he is trying to put some pressure on Phoenix to pick the Coyotes in an auction, but no town in the Phoenix market has ever cared or responded like they have to keep a team here.

I don't think its the NHL saying this spot or we move, I think it is more the Coyotes trying to put pressure on the NHL to help them in some way. I still don't think the NHL moves the team if this auction fails.

I hope they win the bid and this saga of uncertainty is over.

Amen! And I hope you're right. Sinurgy made the same point earlier. XG's statement was very direct by selling this as a no-brainer. We're going to build it, we'll pay for everything. Give us your blessing or peace out.
If it's rejected somehow, maybe Ishbia gets a turn at it, renovates Footprint and moves them downtown. My hope at least, but the league might say no more for Arizona. Try again in ten years with expansion.

I'd 100% believe the NHL is saying it's here or relo. They don't' want to deal with this debacle anymore.

The only positive is the A's are doing their best to make this not look as ridiculous as it is.

Regarding the A's, are you talking about them playing in that 9000 capacity stadium?

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Coyote luck will most likely increase the likelihood of artifacts and or human remains ten fold!

First shovels in the ground wind up unlocking the mysteries of why the Hohokam disappeared c.14th century or whenever. Turns out their ancient canal patterns are a clue to the location of a burial site that, when unearthed, unleashes the True Apocalypse.

Which, of course, means we don't get our arena.