Boston Bruins All Bruins Free Agent/Trade Rumours and Proposals III

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

The draft age was challenged back in the WHA days. Im no lawyer but doubt it will ever go older than 18 again.

the age first started coming down with a couple exceptional challenges. there were some 18 year olds asking why they couldn't get a chance to earn a living.

various places in usa and Canada have right to work legislation

the problem was... monopolys are a bit against the laws too... and sports leagues always walked a fine line reguards to their legality on that grounds

if I remember right off the top of my head... it was tom McCarthy in 1979 that got the rules dropped to 18? he was going to turn 19 in july that year if I see my numbers right. im not 100% sure it was his court case but this was also the year gretzky entered the nhl

it made the news big time the year before when birmington of the wha signed a whole group of 18 year olds and of course gretzky also joined wha.

taking all these high profile 18 year olds is probably what convinced the nhl to absorb the wha and kill the competition... but killing the competition also created a combind monoloply concern.

im going mostly off memory here so forgive me if I got the names wrong but for those interested this is basically what the story was...

wha opened warfare on nhl… knowing that they wanted to force a merger imho... succeeded... but then following the merger nhl got into right to work legislation trouble and were legally compelled to lower the age limit

they wouldn't be able to break the law and impose a 19 draft now unless they got special exception from a lot of sources. at the very least they would need to prove that 18 year olds can earn a living from hockey in other places besides the nhl.

what I could possibly see in the future... is the creation of a development league {like arena football} where its owned by the nhl and near ready kids can go play a higher level of competion. this would make scouting a bit easier... allow kids to be paid less money until they prove themselves more.

the downside is that it would really cripple major junior in Canada as all the good 18/19 year olds would be in this new league

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Zacha gets you Grezelcyk in return, not Krug.

6'3 215 pound 21 year old center drafted 6th overall...

I bet new jersey fans are going to love your take

 

[KnightofBoston]

Did Rask refuse to share his hoagie with hacks one time or what?

 

[GloryDaze4877]

6'3 215 pound 21 year old center drafted 6th overall...

I bet new jersey fans are going to love your take

What do his measurements and draft position have to do with the return? Zacha has been a disappointment, based on where he was picked.

Based on that rationale, we might be able to get Yakupov for Krug...

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

What do his measurements and draft position have to do with the return? Zacha has been a disappointment, based on where he was picked.

Based on that rationale, we might be able to get Yakupov for Krug...

you make a great point... but not one that has much to do with mine... but yes I see where you were going with that... well done

 

[GloryDaze4877]

you make a great point... but not one that has much to do with mine... but yes I see where you were going with that... well done

It has everything to do with what you said, which was that Zacha should be considered an adequate return for Krug because he was drafted 6th overall and has some size.

The Yakupov part was sarcasm. The overall point...draft position has nothing to do with value once a player is in the league...is a valid one.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

It has everything to do with what you said, which was that Zacha should be considered an adequate return for Krug because he was drafted 6th overall and has some size.

The Yakupov part was sarcasm. The overall point...draft position has nothing to do with value once a player is in the league...is a valid one.

but 21 year old 6'3 kids that are being brought along slowly and still have a lot of fans... do reflect a lot of value from their starting point

if you start high... and depreciate slowly... you remain high

as opposed to starting low and never climbing
or starting high and free falling into the depths

you dragged out a great example for the point you wanted to make which has nothing to do with my point

zacha remains a very valued prospect... I say prospect because hes 21. I say valued becauses hes a 6'3 center that goes in excess of 210

6'3 210 pounders that are loaded with talent and are only 21... are still given tons of value as prospects... most people think these big guys don't start to get their act together until around 23

as opposed to small goal scoring wingers who often have peaked by 23 and are headed down hill

its just how prospect evaluators differ big center grading from small winger grading and dmen and goalies are the same... takes longer before their starting value starts to fall.

big forwards... dmen… goalies... all hold their value longer than small wingers do

 

[pkunit]

Markstrom/Halak tandem isn't taking the Bruins anywhere. Talbot + Nurse would be a great haul for Tuukka, but I don't see Edmonton doing that. Goalies never get traded for this kind of value.

You're absolutely right!

I'd roll the dice on both deals. I'm a Rask guy, but he's never "taken us anywhere either"...

I'd probably trade Rask before Krug just because Krug is entering his prime IMO, and Rask has probably topped off. Not to mention Rask should give a better return.

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

You're absolutely right!

I'd roll the dice on both deals. I'm a Rask guy, but he's never "taken us anywhere either"...

I'd probably trade Rask before Krug just because Krug is entering his prime IMO, and Rask has probably topped off. Not to mention Rask should give a better return.

Rask a better return than Torey Krug?

You would be sorely mistaken.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Markstrom/Halak tandem isn't taking the Bruins anywhere. Talbot + Nurse would be a great haul for Tuukka, but I don't see Edmonton doing that. Goalies never get traded for this kind of value.

agreed goalies haven't historically had this value... but every time I use the past to predict the future im always reminded it only takes 1 exception to establish an exception to the rules

im not opposed to listening to offers on rask and if one made sense... im not opposed to pulling the trigger

I do feel hes easily a top 10 goalie based on his great consistentcy. I also feel he has potential to get hot at playoff time and carry us. but at his cap hit, I do think we have to keep our mind open if we have potential to get more depth in the position as a lower cost.

I probably would be looking to trade a couple of our surplus kid forwards/dmen for a good looking goalie prospect sometime in the near future

 

[pkunit]

Rask a better return than Torey Krug?

You would be sorely mistaken.

I'm not sure but if you're shopping both I expect a top 5 goalie is more valuable than a top 30 Defender who is under 5'10.

 

[Rumpy]

but 21 year old 6'3 kids that are being brought along slowly and still have a lot of fans... do reflect a lot of value from their starting point

if you start high... and depreciate slowly... you remain high

as opposed to starting low and never climbing
or starting high and free falling into the depths

you dragged out a great example for the point you wanted to make which has nothing to do with my point

zacha remains a very valued prospect... I say prospect because hes 21. I say valued becauses hes a 6'3 center that goes in excess of 210

6'3 210 pounders that are loaded with talent and are only 21... are still given tons of value as prospects... most people think these big guys don't start to get their act together until around 23

as opposed to small goal scoring wingers who often have peaked by 23 and are headed down hill

its just how prospect evaluators differ big center grading from small winger grading and dmen and goalies are the same... takes longer before their starting value starts to fall.

big forwards... dmen… goalies... all hold their value longer than small wingers do

People on HF boards being logical and objective in July. I’ve seen it all now ...

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

I'm not sure but if you're shopping both I expect a top 5 goalie is more valuable than a top 30 Defender who is under 5'10.

the guys in question... may bare out your idea

but historically goalies just aren't worth a lot... I point to Patrick roy as example A when he was dealt. but as we go through the list of 30 year hall of fame goalies that were dealt we will see almost no value returned.

for years the standard trade for a good goalie was a second round pick. guys like dominek hasek, mike dunham, js gigure, and countless others of that era were dealt for the second round pick

grant fuhr and andy moog and bill ranford and Curtis joseph were moved without much return

im largely just mentioning the greatest goalies of their time... to illustrate how seldom a goalie fetches back value

recently we saw that guys like cory Schneider and martin jones were worth first round picks... and there were other goalies... the Russian kid in Colorado... a couple others

I would say that value is going up for good kid backup goalies on cheap contracts. but im not sure it reflects the value for veterns

marc andre fleury was a recent vet that fetched no return. mike smith. they couldn't trade steve mason. cam ward wilted on the vine. the guys in dallas had no value. im not sure about ben bishop.

is rask in a class above these guys? to me he is... but I just find very little evidence from the past that anyone is willing to trade anything for a starting goalie over the age of 30 on a multiyear contract at north of 4 mill...

id expect krug to have way more trade value. flawed dmen have been fetching back first line forwards lately

 

[maxl7]

id expect krug to have way more trade value. flawed dmen have been fetching back first line forwards lately

If Adam Larsson can return Taylor Hall, Torey Krug better get you prime Mike Bossy, Gordie Howe, and the Ghost of Rocket Richard.

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

If Adam Larsson can return Taylor Hall, Torey Krug better get you prime Mike Bossy, Gordie Howe, and the Ghost of Rocket Richard.

Need to remember the CHIARELLI FACTOR on this one.

 

[Gonzothe7thDman]

If Adam Larsson can return Taylor Hall, Torey Krug better get you prime Mike Bossy, Gordie Howe, and the Ghost of Rocket Richard.

Martin Erat returned Filip Forsberg. Those are the outlier trades that can't be used to judge future values.

 

[TCB]

If Adam Larsson can return Taylor Hall, Torey Krug better get you prime Mike Bossy, Gordie Howe, and the Ghost of Rocket Richard.

The problem with is. There's only one Peter Chiarelli out there but who knows maybe he will part with Draisaitl next.

 

[maxl7]

Martin Erat returned Filip Forsberg. Those are the outlier trades that can't be used to judge future values.

People still defend the Hall for Larsson swap as if it was some gutsy and necessary move, though. The Forsberg for Erat swap is a little bit different because of the optics of it being a deadline move, and if you don't win the cup and the player wasn't lights out the entire playoff run, it's seen as a failure. I'm not defending the trade, just saying the expectations on the results of the acquired player are different than an offseason swap.

 

[don]

I don't believe he is available. If the Bruins were to move him there are 3 possible scenarios.

1) Strong second line winger, preferably a RH shot who has a physical edge to his game.

2) young 2way 3rd line center who can develop into a top 6 center

3) younger 2way defenseman , basically a scenario where Krug is traded with a prospect to get a #2 defenseman

For me, he only goes West. I don't want him burning us later. I've been trying to trade him for a couple of years now.......and catching hell for it because most didn't/wouldn't understand my reasoning. I agree with your scenarios but would add "with size" to all of them.

 

[BruinDust]

For me, he only goes West. I don't want him burning us later. I've been trying to trade him for a couple of years now.......and catching hell for it because most didn't/wouldn't understand my reasoning. I agree with your scenarios but would add "with size" to all of them.

How about get the best return you can, whatever division that other team happens to play in.

Who gives a crap about him "burning them" later?

Yes, let's rule out dealing Krug to half the league because he might score a goal against the Bruins.

Jeez.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

People still defend the Hall for Larsson swap as if it was some gutsy and necessary move, though. The Forsberg for Erat swap is a little bit different because of the optics of it being a deadline move, and if you don't win the cup and the player wasn't lights out the entire playoff run, it's seen as a failure. I'm not defending the trade, just saying the expectations on the results of the acquired player are different than an offseason swap.

Subban for Weber
Florida letting Vegas take Marchessault so that they'd also take Reilly Smith in a trade.

 

[DKH]

If you’re trading Krug I would be looking for Dylan Larkin or Sean Couturier. This would be in line with the Larson - Hall deal.

I’d even offer him for Seguin providing Seguin does like the Toronto 3 kids are rumored to do and take a team friendly deal

Marchand- Bergeron-Seguin
DeBrusk- Krejci- Pastrnak

This would be a good deal for Don Sweeney

 

[don]

How about get the best return you can, whatever division that other team happens to play in.

Who gives a crap about him "burning them" later?

Yes, let's rule out dealing Krug to half the league because he might score a goal against the Bruins.

Jeez.

If I remember correctly, you were one of the most vocal against trading Krug when I proposed it.

 

[bme44]

If you’re trading Krug I would be looking for Dylan Larkin or Sean Couturier. This would be in line with the Larson - Hall deal.

I’d even offer him for Seguin providing Seguin does like the Toronto 3 kids are rumored to do and take a team friendly deal

Marchand- Bergeron-Seguin
DeBrusk- Krejci- Pastrnak

This would be a good deal for Don Sweeney

Dylan Larkin Or Sean Couturier is the kind of return I would love to see. Would certainly add for Couturier. He is one of my favorite Players. I do not think he is available

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

For me, he only goes West. I don't want him burning us later. I've been trying to trade him for a couple of years now.......and catching hell for it because most didn't/wouldn't understand my reasoning. I agree with your scenarios but would add "with size" to all of them.

Even though it probably doesn't happen, hypothetically speaking, you wouldn't trade Krug+ for Artemi Panarin? He doesn't fit either that you're looking for:

1.) Columbus is in the East
2.) Panarin is not a winger with size

It has nothing to do with you trying to trade him. It's usually the return you ask for...It's always woefully bad value for the player.