Confirmed with Link: Alexis Lafreniere Signs Extension [7Y/7.45M AAV]

[LORDE]

I have to say it but you are just plain wrong, if you replaced any of those guys with laf and even if the rangers PP dropped to 15th in the league he’d still put up 10-15 points on the Pp

I think the NYR PP would indeed drop... significantly.

His goal on PP2 tonight taken into consideration.

He's not a PP guy

Not yet.

But I'll reiterate that hes been great this season & was again tonight.

He's NOT better than Bread, Tro or Z & it isn't close... especially on the PP

 

[bhamill]

I think the NYR PP would indeed drop... significantly.

His goal on PP2 tonight taken into consideration.

He's not a PP guy

Not yet.

But I'll reiterate that hes been great this season & was again tonight.

He's NOT better than Bread, Tro or Z & it isn't close... especially on the PP

It tough to argue that we should be messing with PP1. That's the long and short of it.

HOWEVER, it may be worth playing with PP1 and getting Laf integrated on it when we are up later in games. It's an investment. If we have a 4-2 lead with 10 left in the game, that kind of thing. Maybe that PP won't score as much, PROBABLY won't, but as long as we are still winning the games, it's a move I would make. Get him on it, get him used to it, let him develop his role on it. If nothing else it hopefully gives us options for when PP1 inevitably hits a cold patch.
Really though it's not a huge deal. Guy is still early in his D+4 and he is still developing his overall game and finding his way. This is the way the management and coaches have chosen to bring him along, owing to the fact that we are far from a bottom feeder team. It'll come at some point or another.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

It tough to argue that we should be messing with PP1. That's the long and short of it.

HOWEVER, it may be worth playing with PP1 and getting Laf integrated on it when we are up later in games. It's an investment. If we have a 4-2 lead with 10 left in the game, that kind of thing. Maybe that PP won't score as much, PROBABLY won't, but as long as we are still winning the games, it's a move I would make. Get him on it, get him used to it, let him develop his role on it. If nothing else it hopefully gives us options for when PP1 inevitably hits a cold patch.
Really though it's not a huge deal. Guy is still early in his D+4 and he is still developing his overall game and finding his way. This is the way the management and coaches have chosen to bring him along, owing to the fact that we are far from a bottom feeder team. It'll come at some point or another.

This. Get him into PP1 if we are up 2 goals or more. I think you need to start doing that. It will not impact the chemistry at all.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

I think the NYR PP would indeed drop... significantly.

His goal on PP2 tonight taken into consideration.

He's not a PP guy

Not yet.

But I'll reiterate that hes been great this season & was again tonight.

He's NOT better than Bread, Tro or Z & it isn't close... especially on the PP

There’s no reason he wouldn’t be good on PP1. Obviously he is not a polished power play guy yet…he’s never gotten consistent power play minutes in his career and the ones he gets aren’t with anyone good in what is usually the last 30 seconds of a power play. NYR PP1 could integrate you and still score

 

[GlasgowNewYorkRanger]

Posting as the GDT was closed, but Alexis Lafanjob is one of the best ever @Machinehead :-P

 

[Machinehead]

You'd be crazy to touch the top PP in the league to put anybody on it, Lafreniere or otherwise.

Laf has been an effective player this year. That's what I care about. I couldn't care less about impressing the main boards with his raw totals.

 

[DanielBrassard]

It’s never been about point totals with him as machinehead noted, and there’s no doubt he’s a much more effective player offensively this season. Is he going to be what we wanted him to be? I doubt it at this point but he’s a very good complimentary scorer at the least.

 

[Profet]

I just wish we had a LW spot for him... Because right now we're playing 2 LW's and a center on the second line. And I don't mean 2 players that are natural LWs... I mena positionally... We're literally playing with 2 wingers on the left boards and a center....

And I'm pretty sure the league has the book on that as you can see everyone drift to that side of the ice as that line tries to move through the neutral zone.

 

[TopShelfSnipes]

I just wish we had a LW spot for him... Because right now we're playing 2 LW's and a center on the second line. And I don't mean 2 players that are natural LWs... I mena positionally... We're literally playing with 2 wingers on the left boards and a center....

And I'm pretty sure the league has the book on that as you can see everyone drift to that side of the ice as that line tries to move through the neutral zone.

The irony of this, however, is that Laf's best zone entries this season have been when he gets the puck in the neutral zone or his own end with speed, is moving his feet, and stickhandles over the blueline. He's very deceptive when he does this, and his best zone entries have been on the right side of the ice since he seems to be more willing to go to the middle of the ice on that side, whereas strong side he'll go to the boards more.

IMO this is a coaching and experience issue, not a skill ceiling issue.

RW is an adjustment, but when he gets it - and there's nothing that says he won't - it's going to open up a lot more possibilities for him off the rush, in playmaking, and in the offensive zone that just won't be there when he plays strong side. It opens him up for one timers when he gets better about getting open in traffic. It lets him exploit the triple threat position off the rush to freeze D and goalies before deciding whether to shoot, pass, or deke. It allows him to see the whole ice and decide whether or not to pass from his forehand or backhand when he tries to set up a play (instead of being limited to passing on his forehand strong side). It allows him to use his elite backhand as a weapon away from the middle of the ice.

The more I see of him, the more I think his ceiling is much higher as an RW than as a LW at this level. His continued success at LW would rely on him developing elite speed or strength, which I don't see happening. His game has always been more about high hockey IQ, elite passing through traffic, and a blend of mobility and pace wth quick hands, and the willingness to go to tough areas or play physical when needed. If he can improve his wristshot, snapper, and learn to rip the occasional clapper when he has time, he will be well on his way to being an 80 point player once he finally starts seeing top line usage.

 

[Profet]

The irony of this, however, is that Laf's best zone entries this season have been when he gets the puck in the neutral zone or his own end with speed, is moving his feet, and stickhandles over the blueline. He's very deceptive when he does this, and his best zone entries have been on the right side of the ice since he seems to be more willing to go to the middle of the ice on that side, whereas strong side he'll go to the boards more.

I mean... Is that ironic?

You're saying his best zone entries are when he controls the puck through the neutral zone with speed....

Um yeah. That's literally every player in the NHL.

The fact that we're at Christmas and he can't figure out left/right wing positioning scares the crap out of me.

 

[TopShelfSnipes]

I mean... Is that ironic?

You're saying his best zone entries are when he controls the puck through the neutral zone with speed....

Um yeah. That's literally every player in the NHL.

The fact that we're at Christmas and he can't figure out left/right wing positioning scares the crap out of me.

Sorry, that was bad phrasing on my part. Had two thoughts, smashed them together, and it didn't quite come out right. I'm tired, haha.

What I meant to say is that the ironic part was that his best zone entries (referring to him carrying the puck in, not him enternig without the puck) have been on the right side.

IMO (just from eye test) his left side zone entries have been much more standard and boilerplate, and less exciting/high danger.

I conflated that with the observation that his moving of the feet and attacking the neutral zone tends to precede these better zone entries, hence the bad syntax in my previous post.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I just wish we had a LW spot for him... Because right now we're playing 2 LW's and a center on the second line. And I don't mean 2 players that are natural LWs... I mena positionally... We're literally playing with 2 wingers on the left boards and a center....

And I'm pretty sure the league has the book on that as you can see everyone drift to that side of the ice as that line tries to move through the neutral zone.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Panarin originally a RW?

 

[Profet]

Sorry, that was bad phrasing on my part. Had two thoughts, smashed them together, and it didn't quite come out right. I'm tired, haha.

What I meant to say is that the ironic part was that his best zone entries (referring to him carrying the puck in, not him enternig without the puck) have been on the right side.

IMO (just from eye test) his left side zone entries have been much more standard and boilerplate, and less exciting/high danger.

I conflated that with the observation that his moving of the feet and attacking the neutral zone tends to precede these better zone entries, hence the bad syntax in my previous post.

I agree. When he actually sticks to the right boards he looks very good entering the zone. Much better than his hallmark left side zone entry of curling back and attempting a cross ice pass to a waiting defender.

But I've seen far too much of him and Panarin literally fighting each other for possession on the left wing boards.

It's beyond stupid to see in an NHL game.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Panarin originally a RW?

Recently Panarin seems to drift more the center and RW boards when he sees Laf out of position on the LW boards. That said, this isn't by design, they still line up for faceoffs with Laf playing RW and Panarin playing LW.

Forcing Panarin out of position because someone else is out of position isn't a recipe for a structured breakout.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Recently Panarin seems to drift more the center and RW boards when he sees Laf out of position on the LW boards. That said, this isn't by design, they still line up for faceoffs with Laf playing RW and Panarin playing LW.

Forcing Panarin out of position because someone else is out of position isn't a recipe for a structured breakout.

I wasn't speaking of this year....I seem to recall seeing or reading that Panny is/was actually a RW playing the left side.

 

[JimmyG89]

7 points in his last 8 games and was very noticeable tonight.

Feel like he had something to prove. Bedard coming here brings a lot of hype. There were a bunch of Hawks fans tonight. It happened with Byfield when they've played the Kings.

He's also finally getting rewarded for his playmaking unlike earlier in the year.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Still on pace for over 50 points. Didn't have much puck luck with passing earlier in the year, could easily see him getting to 55 points. Crazy with no PP1 minutes either.

 

[TopShelfSnipes]

Laf was amazing tonight and I liked that he was better in position through the neutral zone on breakouts. He still ended up at both sides of the ice at times, but when he's more active on the right side and when he attacks the blueline on the right side with speed, he can drive some impressive zone entries.

His use of the triple threat position right before the assist to Panarin is why I hold that RW will be better for him in the long run once he figures it all out. It will open up all kinds of possibilities to him and let him face the whole play in a way that LW won't.

If he elevates the wrister from the low circle hi-glove on Mrazek, he's easily got a goal and a 2-point night.

Could've easily had another assist or two in there as well.

 

[OthmannOut]

My thoughts are the narrative of Laf being a bust is turning into a Laf is a good player but underwhelming for a first overall narrative, which will then slowly change into the league-wide narrative that Laf is underrated.

Also, I don't give too much credence to points, especially without Laf being stapled on the PP1, but it's clear he is snakebit considering how well he has produced chances. This last point streak is nice to see but I feel like he should have ten more points. He's getting there though.

 

[mas0764]

His playmaking is both picking up and being rewarded more often, however, his hot shooting has cooled off and he can't buy a goal despite putting himself in position for Grade-A chances. He could have had two goals last night easy.

I hate to keep going back to this but at what point does he warrant a look on power play 1 instead of Trocheck?

 

[NYR Viper]

His playmaking is both picking up and being rewarded more often, however, his hot shooting has cooled off and he can't buy a goal despite putting himself in position for Grade-A chances. He could have had two goals last night easy.

I hate to keep going back to this but at what point does he warrant a look on power play 1 instead of Trocheck?

I mean Trochek has 36 points in 37 games and has 13 points on the PP. I don't think he is coming off

 

[mas0764]

I mean Trochek has 36 points in 37 games and has 13 points on the PP. I don't think he is coming off

Yeah but Trocheck is by all accounts the least productive player on PP1. I'm not saying he's bad at it, but I do wonder how much the PP is affected if he's taken off.

He has the fewest goals on the PP of anyone on the first unit other than Fox (who is the assist-generator). He has the fewest assists on the PP of anyone on the first unit other than Kreider (who is the tip-in scorer).

Take away his PP production and Laf's PP production and their EV production is very similar.

And with the quality of passing we've been seeing from Laf lately - just how he's been making some real eye-opening passes - do you swap it out for a bit just to see?

I realize underlying metrics have said Laf sucks on the PP and I realize you don't want PP1 to stop being elite, but.....

1) You can switch back if it has a big negative effect, and
2) There IS a benefit to a player like Lafreniere becoming effective as a PP performer besides just stat padding, and for that he needs a shot.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

I posted about this earlier in the year but I think its a good time for an update

Laffy has the same or more even strength points than Malkin, Kadri, RNH, Buch, Aho, Kopitar, Tavares, etc. He's on that level. All of those dudes get consistent PP time.

Hes on pace to break 50 points. Cant really expect him to get 65-70 mainly even strength when only 15% of his points come via the PP.
If he breaks 55 EVP hell be top 50 in the NHL in that category, with some top names. To get there hell need to surpass 60 points for the season.

70 EVP is top 20. Hes not at that level because he needs to finish his chances more. The positive thing is he is getting tons of chances

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

Yeah but Trocheck is by all accounts the least productive player on PP1. I'm not saying he's bad at it, but I do wonder how much the PP is affected if he's taken off.

He has the fewest goals on the PP of anyone on the first unit other than Fox (who is the assist-generator). He has the fewest assists on the PP of anyone on the first unit other than Kreider (who is the tip-in scorer).

Take away his PP production and Laf's PP production and their EV production is very similar.

And with the quality of passing we've been seeing from Laf lately - just how he's been making some real eye-opening passes - do you swap it out for a bit just to see?

I realize underlying metrics have said Laf sucks on the PP and I realize you don't want PP1 to stop being elite, but.....

1) You can switch back if it has a big negative effect, and
2) There IS a benefit to a player like Lafreniere becoming effective as a PP performer besides just stat padding, and for that he needs a shot.

Trocheck is top 50 in the league 5on5 with 60 EVP the past season and a half. He and Mika both had 40 EVP last season. (Chytil had 35) I don't think we give him enough credit, he is by many standards an elite player. But I also think the PP has a boosting effect 5on5 for a lot of players like him.

A skilled player could easily go a stretch of 4 or 5 games without a point with no top PP time. If you are on a very successful unit like Trocheck is, yes, you are part of it, but you could be gifted goals and assists just by being on the ice. That helps breaks droughts and helps the pysche carrying into the 5 on 5 play. There is no way to measure this of course, but it definitely counts for "production momentum" imo

 

[OthmannOut]

I hate to keep going back to this but at what point does he warrant a look on power play 1 instead of Trocheck?

absolutely not. PP1 is dimes.

 

[will1066]

Sorry, but keep the power play as-is. Set pieces on the power play work differently than 5 on 5 play. Laf would need to know where to be positioned at all times in relation to the other 4 guys. He would need to know how to enter the zone and set up with those guys. It's not the same as passing off the rush while entering the zone and pushing back opposing D. Example, Zibanejad positions himself down low at the goal line and Trocheck knows right away what the play is, attacks the net, takes the Zib feed with a bang bang sling shot that results in the Kreider goal. Those guys are locked in. You don't need to mess with that.