Value of: Alexis Lafreniere & Kaapo Kakko

[TGWL]

I'd be comfortable offering VGK and Florida 1sts this year but not much more for the combo. Maybe add Laaksonen.

Would honestly rather remove Kakko from the deal altogether and just wheel with Laf.

It's a deep draft with an opportunity to draft some guys that haven't absolutely fallen flat on their faces thus far.

No, thanks. Rangers are in a position where 1st round picks should be considered a bonus. They can't trade off assets and wait around for 1st pick players to be developed/ruined/even make the NHL.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Nobody considers Buch developed in the KHL. Did anybody watch his first 2 seasons with NYR? He was a player who progressed after being drafted and the hype was there for him joining our organization but he absolutely was not nearly the player he is now when he came over.

Buch played 178 KHL games before coming to NHL and he was fairly productive in NHL right away and only spent 4 games in AHL.

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

Don't let anyone bullshit you. Each and every NHL fanbase overhypes their prospects, the only difference is that some fanbases just have louder voices due to sheer numbers.

We are all the same decaying organic matter. As fans, we both completely suck and completely rule at the same time.

Not all fan-bases overhype their players to the same extent. Tbh it's dumb to even debate. & That's not even the point. It's how overhyping prospects in general leads to disappointments. Didn't realize it'd take this many responses and f***'ing up my like/post ratio in the process to make this point.

Keep up the good fight, TheGreenTBer-- all fan-bases suck.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I'd be comfortable offering VGK and Florida 1sts this year but not much more for the combo. Maybe add Laaksonen.

Would honestly rather remove Kakko from the deal altogether and just wheel with Laf.

It's a deep draft with an opportunity to draft some guys that haven't absolutely fallen flat on their faces thus far.

Bookmarked.

You do realize that Cozens, who is a draft older than Lafreniere and the same as Kakko, has averaged two less points per 82 games than Lafreniere and one more than Kakko in their NHL careers.

Meanwhile, you’ll make every excuse available for Cozens, while you tell us a 1OA and 2OA are only worth late firsts because they are doing what all their peers are doing.

Some of you need to think about what you say before it. The mob mentality is leading to so many of you trying to say things that are going to look terrible in a few years.

 

[TGWL]

Buch played 178 KHL games before coming to NHL and he was fairly productive in NHL right away and only spent 4 games in AHL.

He's a much different player now than we get became an NHL regular. He became an actual 2 way-player with us.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Yes, but Fox is under team control for the next 8 seasons... Draisaitl can leave in UFA in 4 years

Oh dang, four years? that's nothing! Better toss away the 2nd best player in the league for a couple magic beans

 

[unicornpig]

Oh dang, four years? that's nothing! Better toss away the 2nd best player in the league for a couple magic beans

magic beans that are looking like they wont even sprout

 

[Zach716]

Bookmarked.

You do realize that Cozens, who is a draft older than Lafreniere and the same as Kakko, has averaged two less points per 82 games than Lafreniere and one more than Kakko in their NHL careers.

Meanwhile, you’ll make every excuse available for Cozens, while you tell us a 1OA and 2OA are only worth late firsts because they are doing what all their peers are doing.

Some of you need to think about what you say before it. The mob mentality is leading to so many of you trying to say things that are going to look terrible in a few years.

Bookmark it, but I wouldn't be all that offended if someone offered 2 firsts and a potential top-4 D prospect for Cozens? Would I take it, probably not but it isn't far off from value for a hopefully potential great 2C or low end 1C with solid 2way play who by all accounts is great in the room, sticks up for teammates on the ice and is a possible future captain. But Cozens wasn't drafted with the mass thought of being a potential superstar in this league and falling on expectations so far.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Bookmark it, but I wouldn't be all that offended if someone offered 2 firsts and a potential top-4 D prospect for Cozens? Would I take it, probably not but it isn't far off from value for a hopefully potential great 2C or low end 1C with solid 2way play who by all accounts is great in the room, sticks up for teammates on the ice and is a possible future captain. But Cozens wasn't drafted with the mass thought of being a potential superstar in this league and falling on expectations so far.

You’ve moved the goalposts. You said that you would trade what probably amounts to two late firsts and maybe an average prospect for two players picked 1st and 2nd overall. This is not about whether you may take Cozens over that package. You said both players, not one, and seemingly you are suggesting that’s not a fair offer for Cozens but it is for both Lafreniere and Kakko.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Starting to see why Ray Ferraro said people overrate and have unrealistic expectations of CHL prospects who score big numbers

it’s not a difficult league to score in.

For players who do it at 19/20 sure. It’s very hard to put up the numbers he did at 16-18.

 

[Trojans86]

if the rangers were offered that they would be insane not to take it.

I kind of like it for Edmonton. Gives them cost controlled depth and all of the sudden Edmonton has an elite young core. They could probably get the rangers to throw in a 1st to even out value.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Not all fan-bases overhype their players to the same extent. Tbh it's dumb to even debate. & That's not even the point. It's how overhyping prospects in general leads to disappointments. Didn't realize it'd take this many responses and f***'ing up my like/post ratio in the process to make this point.

Keep up the good fight, TheGreenTBer-- all fan-bases suck.

Oh there's no fight. I don't even watch the NHL anymore. To be honest I was actually trying to defend you in my post, but now I'm gathering that you and I do actually have very different opinions on this issue so I'll let it go. Sorry for hijacking.

 

[Boxscore]

Caufield and our lottery pick for Lafreniere.

Believe it or not, the Rangers should jump on a Caufield+ for Lafreniere offer if possible. The Habs, not so much. Lafreniere in Montreal would be Drouin 2.0. You think there's a little pressure on Lafreniere in NYC, could you imagine him not living up to expectations in Montreal? Montreal would be a disaster for him. As for Caufield on the Rags, I think he'd be a monster -- he's a pure sniper and the other team's best D couldn't even think of matching up against him. Caufield is perfect for New York.

Even better... just do a straight Lafreniere and Kravtsov/Chytil for Caufield and Suzuki swapperoni.

 

[Perennial]

magic beans that are looking like they wont even sprout

Draisaitl had something like 2 goals, 9 points in 37 games as a 19 year old...

I wonder how many people were saying the same thing about him at the time

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Draisaitl had something like 2 goals, 9 points in 37 games as a 19 year old...

I wonder how many people were saying the same thing about him at the time

Edmonton takes every ounce of risk in this deal and pushes back their window 3 years at minimum, if it ever even opens. It's complete nonsense for us. You trade two guys doing nothing for you right now and replace them with an absolutely elite talent on a sweetheart deal.

This is like wanting you guys to take Puljujarvi and Yamamoto for Panarin, except the difference is Puljujarvi is actually playing really well.

 

[unicornpig]

Draisaitl had something like 2 goals, 9 points in 37 games as a 19 year old...

I wonder how many people were saying the same thing about him at the time

Kakko is in his 3 season and laf in his 2nd with nothing to show lol

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

Oh there's no fight. I don't even watch the NHL anymore. To be honest I was actually trying to defend you in my post, but now I'm gathering that you and I do actually have very different opinions on this issue so I'll let it go. Sorry for hijacking.

Lol. Na it was a stupid post with little context/ no tone and I own up to it, as far as a package of Lefrieniere and Kappo, one should consider how NYR develops talent and that is not a diss at the Rangers, just look objectively at their results at developing players that they've drafted.
I think both players have the potential to be elite with the right coaching/development. Lefrienere clearly needed more time at a lower level to adjust to NHL speed and expand his game.
I see a lot of potential in AF. Good hands, good shot, good offensive IQ. NYR should hold onto him. Has more value long-term than a trade short-term IMO and no GM is going to throw the wagon at them seeing their stats. Good luck Rangers fans.

 

[Miz]

Kakko is in his 3 season and laf in his 2nd with nothing to show lol

That's kinda misleading. Kakko's first and second seasons were cut short due to covid. Lafreniere's first was shorter due to covid. Kakko's played a total of 123 nhl games. Which totals about a season and a half of games. Lafreniere has played about 70 games total. They're both 20 years old. I'm sure they'll have plenty to show for it down the road. Unfortunately, patience isn't in any fanboys vocab when it comes to high end prospects.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

That's kinda misleading. Kakko's first and second seasons were cut short due to covid. Lafreniere's first was shorter due to covid. Kakko's played a total of 123 nhl games. Which totals about a season and a half of games. Lafreniere has played about 70 games total. There both 20 years old. I'm sure they'll have plenty to show for it down the road. Unfortunately, patience isn't in any fanboys vocab when it comes to high end prospects.

Shhhh, you're not allowed to add context to the scenario with these facts.

Kakko (20 years old, 123 career games) and Lafreniere (20 years old, career games) are both busts and are not going to progress any further as players at the NHL level.

(sarcasm)

 

[Boxscore]

Kakko (20 years old, 123 career games) and Lafreniere (20 years old, career games) are both busts and are not going to progress any further as players at the NHL level.

Kakko and Lafreniere will likely progress further in the NHL -- if not, then yes, they will be among the worst busts in NHL history lol. I think there's very little doubt that they will grow into better players, the question is: will they every live up to their billing? I think that's highly unlikely at this point, considering Lafreniere was considered a "generational talent" and Kakko a future 40 goal scorer who was compared to some of the greatest forward prospects to ever come out of Finland.

Lafreniere ending up a 30-35-65 guy would be a disappointment. Anything less than that will be considered a massive disappointment for a player supposed to be among the best prospects of his generation. Kakko ending up a 25-30-55 guy would also be a huge disappointment for a 2nd overall pick who was labelled "elite."

Like I said, more worrisome than the lack of stats, is the lack of "oh wow, I see it" flashes of brilliance. Nothing wows you about either of these guys.

 

[bernmeister]

Kakko and Lafreniere will likely progress further in the NHL -- if not, then yes, they will be among the worst busts in NHL history lol. I think there's very little doubt that they will grow into better players, the question is: will they every live up to their billing? I think that's highly unlikely at this point, considering Lafreniere was considered a "generational talent" and Kakko a future 40 goal scorer who was compared to some of the greatest forward prospects to ever come out of Finland.

Lafreniere ending up a 30-35-65 guy would be a disappointment. Anything less than that will be considered a massive disappointment for a player supposed to be among the best prospects of his generation. Kakko ending up a 25-30-55 guy would also be a huge disappointment for a 2nd overall pick who was labelled "elite."

don't recall exact verbatim
\but
scouting report said
LaF is
most complete
or whatever to that effect prospect with upside
not counting generationals McD, Matthews,
since MacKinnon.

We are not moving him and if at all not early or cheap.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Lol. Na it was a stupid post with little context/ no tone and I own up to it, as far as a package of Lefrieniere and Kappo, one should consider how NYR develops talent and that is not a diss at the Rangers, just look objectively at their results at developing players that they've drafted.
I think both players have the potential to be elite with the right coaching/development. Lefrienere clearly needed more time at a lower level to adjust to NHL speed and expand his game.
I see a lot of potential in AF. Good hands, good shot, good offensive IQ. NYR should hold onto him. Has more value long-term than a trade short-term IMO and no GM is going to throw the wagon at them seeing their stats. Good luck Rangers fans.

Thanks for explaining. Not a Rangers fan FWIW but I do appreciate the response.

 

[Caps8112]

I kind of like it for Edmonton. Gives them cost controlled depth and all of the sudden Edmonton has an elite young core. They could probably get the rangers to throw in a 1st to even out value.

If the 2 rangers pan out, which they might, but you know what you have with the oiler

 

[Panthaz89]

Bookmarked.

You do realize that Cozens, who is a draft older than Lafreniere and the same as Kakko, has averaged two less points per 82 games than Lafreniere and one more than Kakko in their NHL careers.

Meanwhile, you’ll make every excuse available for Cozens, while you tell us a 1OA and 2OA are only worth late firsts because they are doing what all their peers are doing.

Some of you need to think about what you say before it. The mob mentality is leading to so many of you trying to say things that are going to look terrible in a few years.

Cozens does way more than generate points when he is on the ice and isn't invisible by any means and is one of the players that will actually fight for his team.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Cozens does way more than generate points when he is on the ice and isn't invisible by any means and is one of the players that will actually fight for his team.

I didn't criticize him. I like Cozens.