Value of: Alexis Lafreniere & Kaapo Kakko

[Caps8112]

If you're the Rangers, would you give up Lafreniere and Kaako for Draisaitl?

New York's top 6
Panarin - Draisaitl - Kreider
Kravtsov/Chytil - Zibanejad - Strome

Edmonton's top 6
Hyman - McDavid - Puljujarvi
Lafreniere - RNH - Kaako

if the rangers were offered that they would be insane not to take it.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Why? The other team's top D and Forward line are matching up against Panarin, Zibanejad, etc. If anything, Lafrieniere and Kakko should be able to take advantage of that. Anton Lundell isn't playing on the top line in Florida and is performing well, etc. Kakko is in his 3rd season and has 0 points in 9 games this year -- ZERO. Lucas Raymond in Detroit has 3x as many points as Lafreniere and he's a rookie. Are Lafreniere and Kakko just getting paid to watch Panarin and Zibanejad like fans? Or are they expected to produce?

If you’re expecting miracles from Laffy when playing on the 4th line with a bum like Reaves and an AHL’er in Gauthier, that’s on you. As for Kakko, he’s snakebite and could’ve had 2 pts yesterday if it wasn’t for Knight.

I’d take Laffy on the Devils in a heartbeat!

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

R-E-L-A-X.

These kids are still very young, give them at least 2-3 full years before giving up on them.

 

[Svechhammer]

Rangers might have to move at least one of them. I know that sounds crazy, but after the Fox contract, they have $50m tied up in 6 players until the summer of 2026 (Panarin, Kreider, Zibanejad, Trouba, Fox, Shesterkin). Right now they have $30m in cap space to fill out 17 roster spots, which is going to become increasingly difficult when Kakko comes off his ELC after this season and Lafreniere comes off his ELC after next. You figure they're probably going to ask for something like the Svechnikov contract (8x7.75) so you're looking at trying to get them into the fold at somewhere between $12m-16m combined, leaving around $15m to fill out the remaining 15 roster spots on the team.

At a certain point, they literally cannot afford them without moving one of the other big contracts.

 

[voxel]

You figure they're probably going to ask for something like the Svechnikov contract (8x7.75)

They'd be lucky to get Jesse Puljujarvi like contract.. just kidding.

Maybe $2M/yr with their current performance. No way would Rangers sign them to $7.75M/year deals.

 

[Draiskull]

Rangers might have to move at least one of them. I know that sounds crazy, but after the Fox contract, they have $50m tied up in 6 players until the summer of 2026 (Panarin, Kreider, Zibanejad, Trouba, Fox, Shesterkin). Right now they have $30m in cap space to fill out 17 roster spots, which is going to become increasingly difficult when Kakko comes off his ELC after this season and Lafreniere comes off his ELC after next. You figure they're probably going to ask for something like the Svechnikov contract (8x7.75) so you're looking at trying to get them into the fold at somewhere between $12m-16m combined, leaving around $15m to fill out the remaining 15 roster spots on the team.

At a certain point, they literally cannot afford them without moving one of the other big contracts.

How can Kakko possibly command anything close to 7M per after the kind of seasons he has had thus far. If anything keeping a struggling Kakko and Laf around if just what a cap strapped NYR team needs short term til they open up some cap.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

can we lock this up?

People are discussing how much McDonald's workers make in New York compared to Calgary. I don't know what that has to do with Kakko and Lafreniere.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

R-E-L-A-X.

These kids are still very young, give them at least 2-3 full years before giving up on them.

Rangers fans haven't given up on them.

It's fans of other teams that are attempting these way over the top dunks that if someone bookmarked are going to look pretty bad in a few years. But people are going to say stupid things on the internet and be part of the mob mentality when they don't even understand the issues at play.

Thats part of why I don't understand why @EdJovanovski made this thread. I think he's a good poster, but what are you trying to do? You knew exactly what was going to happen that it was just going to be incessant over the top attempts to one up the prior dunk attempt. Obviously there are problems with how these guys are developing and Rangers fans shouldn't be happy about that, but when you try to air the problems for everyone to see, including a lot that don't even understand the issues at play, this is what you get.

 

[bernmeister]

Rangers might have to move at least one of them. I know that sounds crazy, but after the Fox contract, they have $50m tied up in 6 players until the summer of 2026 (Panarin, Kreider, Zibanejad, Trouba, Fox, Shesterkin). Right now they have $30m in cap space to fill out 17 roster spots, which is going to become increasingly difficult when Kakko comes off his ELC after this season and Lafreniere comes off his ELC after next. You figure they're probably going to ask for something like the Svechnikov contract (8x7.75) so you're looking at trying to get them into the fold at somewhere between $12m-16m combined, leaving around $15m to fill out the remaining 15 roster spots on the team.

At a certain point, they literally cannot afford them without moving one of the other big contracts.

no worries
Strome 4.5 and Geo 2.425 sold high now to max return; even if retained they are expiring
add 750k do not renew McKegg
add 1.5 Hank buyout off the books
Hajek will be dealt by then another .874

ballpark that fully covers Fox
there will be a small increase in cap
deal Kinkaid for a late pick = .825 more promote Huska

we likely deal Krav+ Jones+ for picks
= savings + do not have to give them raises

there are a couple of additional lesser guys

so all together
we CAN squeeze out what we need and get LaF/Kakko/Blais on a bridge

then the ? is how fast will we be able to move Trouba, and replace all/most of his 8m w/elc Schneider...

technically he can hold us up 3 full seasons including this, but I think in exchange for various concessions including trying to accomodate his choice of relocation, he gives us a small break.
So forget this year.
? is if he agrees to go following season or the one after.

Howev, we should be able to hold out.
The emergency plan can include relocating Lindgren to 4th line LW, and recovering salary there
OR
selling high on Lindgren and replacing w/elc Robertson

conclusion: a tight squeeze, but doable

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

pretty good video about Laf and problematic development:

This guy's videos are trash, legit doesn't know what he's talking about.

 

[YP44]

As a package or individual trades
Need: elite young center with lots of speed

I would deal QB from LA. Doubt the rangers would take it though

 

[Adele Dazeem]

Is this like a 2 for 1 deal?

 

[EdJovanovski]

This guy's videos are trash, legit doesn't know what he's talking about.

Even just his way of talking is so abrasive and not smooth flowing, he’d be unwatchable to me even if he were knowledgeable. He talks about all these prospects and gives his rankings when he knows damn well he doesn’t watch all these various junior & European leagues lmao. Pretty sure I remember him saying he started watching hockey like a year before starting his channel too.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Even just his way of talking is so abrasive and not smooth flowing, he’d be unwatchable to me even if he were knowledgeable. He talks about all these prospects and gives his rankings when he knows damn well he doesn’t watch all these various junior & European leagues lmao. Pretty sure I remember him saying he started watching hockey like a year before starting his channel too.

Yeah that's pretty believable lol

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

He was the #1 overall pick. How do you not have expectations?

To crown him "prince", being passed the torch, before even playing a preseason game. Yeah every player has expectations. But to allude that he's on par with Lundqvist as the new "Prince" of the city to be is pretty foolish for a 18 year old kid who's never played a game in the NHL.

I posted same pic in the other Alexis thread not to be a d**k about it trust me I like the player but just to show how overhyping prospects like this, (the new king of the city after Lundqvist) only leads to disappointments and people must temper expectations before crowing a new "king of the city".

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

To crown him "prince", being passed the torch, before even playing a preseason game. Yeah every player has expectations. But to allude that he's on par with Lundqvist as the new "Prince" of the city to be is pretty foolish for a 18 year old kid who's never played a game in the NHL.

I posted same pic in the other Alexis thread not to be a d**k about it trust me I like the player but just to show how overhyping prospects like this, (the new king of the city after Lundqvist) only leads to disappointments and people must temper expectations before crowing a new "king of the city".

Again man you just cannot let yourself get wound up by a New York Post headline, they are professional wind-up merchants.

Any player drafted #1OA to a New York team is going to get a headline like that, it's really not a statement on Laf.

 

[Dough72]

Starting to see why Ray Ferraro said people overrate and have unrealistic expectations of CHL prospects who score big numbers

it’s not a difficult league to score in.

I don't know where that quote came from but there must be some context missing. Beause that quote in isolation makes it sound like drafting players from the CHL is a bad idea in general since pretty much all of them come with "big numbers". I can't imagine anyone with even a speck of NHL knowledge would actually say that considering the CHL's absolutely amazing history of producing NHL players.

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

Again man you just cannot let yourself get wound up by a New York Post headline, they are professional wind-up merchants.

Any player drafted #1OA to a New York team is going to get a headline like that, it's really not a statement on Laf.

Not just New York teams overhype their players. Applies more than just NYC. No matter what city, if you immediately compare a #1 who has never even played an NHL preseason game to one of the greatest players in their history, that's overhyping. It needs to stop. I say this as someone who overhyped my team's own prospects before. I am guilty of my past.

But the image is so powerful because it so perfectly exemplifies and is emblematic of the disappointment of a #1 not meeting expectations; and the lunacy of these great expectations we place to players, especially picked high, that leads to disappointment. As for Laf as a player, I'm sure he'll eventually figure it out.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

This guy's videos are trash, legit doesn't know what he's talking about.

Fact is Rangers suck at developing forward prospects. If considering Buchnevich was developed in KHL, the last forward that Rangers developed into a good player is JT Miller and it almost failed as he put up only 10 points in his first 56 NHL games and 33 in his first 114 games. And if he did not put up good numbers in AHL they wouldn't have been as patient with him.

 

[Habs Halifax]

R-E-L-A-X.

These kids are still very young, give them at least 2-3 full years before giving up on them.

If the Habs drafted them and they were disappointing like that early, we would not be allowed to say what you just said on HF boards .

And for the record, I agree with you.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Fact is Rangers suck at developing forward prospects. If considering Buchnevich was developed in KHL, the last forward that Rangers developed into a good player is JT Miller and it almost failed as he put up only 10 points in his first 56 NHL games and 33 in his first 114 games. And if he did not put up good numbers in AHL they wouldn't have been as patient with him.

Facts are not every top 10 pick turns into stars. Some shine right away and some blossom in the 25+ years. Some others bust. Reality all teams go through... Even the genius Yzerman drafted Drouin

 

[Habs Halifax]

Caufield and our lottery pick for Lafreniere.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Not just New York teams overhype their players. Applies more than just NYC. No matter what city, if you immediately compare a #1 who has never even played an NHL preseason game to one of the greatest players in their history, that's overhyping. It needs to stop. I say this as someone who overhyped my team's own prospects before. I am guilty of my past.

But the image is so powerful because it so perfectly exemplifies and is emblematic of the disappointment of a #1 not meeting expectations; and the lunacy of these great expectations we place to players, especially picked high, that leads to disappointment. As for Laf as a player, I'm sure he'll eventually figure it out.

Don't let anyone bullshit you. Each and every NHL fanbase overhypes their prospects, the only difference is that some fanbases just have louder voices due to sheer numbers.

We are all the same decaying organic matter. As fans, we both completely suck and completely rule at the same time.

 

[TGWL]

Fact is Rangers suck at developing forward prospects. If considering Buchnevich was developed in KHL, the last forward that Rangers developed into a good player is JT Miller and it almost failed as he put up only 10 points in his first 56 NHL games and 33 in his first 114 games. And if he did not put up good numbers in AHL they wouldn't have been as patient with him.

Nobody considers Buch developed in the KHL. Did anybody watch his first 2 seasons with NYR? He was a player who progressed after being drafted and the hype was there for him joining our organization but he absolutely was not nearly the player he is now when he came over.

 

[Zach716]

I'd be comfortable offering VGK and Florida 1sts this year but not much more for the combo. Maybe add Laaksonen.

Would honestly rather remove Kakko from the deal altogether and just wheel with Laf.

It's a deep draft with an opportunity to draft some guys that haven't absolutely fallen flat on their faces thus far.