Player Discussion Alexis Lafrenière

[bouds]

He f***ing sucks, they can bin him, he's depreciated all of his value for the most part, has little salvage value, he's a scratch off at best at this stage.

I mean when Gallant was here, he had no problem running Schneider out there even though the kid didn't look great at times, because the kid put in the work. Everyone, including Gallant, says Schneider grinds every day, eats right, and takes care of his business. We don't hear any of that when it comes to Laf, just the opposite at this point.

For the life of me I don't understand why we care at this stage, he hasn't shown a thing, he's a bottom six player on most nights, borderline 2nd liner on a good day.

 

[UnSandvich]

3. to 3.5
every dollar over is overpayment.
He creates nothing.
Almost every point he has was created by someone else.
And hes talented enough to cash in.

I'd be surprised if he makes 3. Downright shocked if it's 3.5.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I'd be surprised if he makes 3. Downright shocked if it's 3.5.

Kakko got 2.1 coming off 18 points in 43 games
Laf had 39 points in 81 games

I'd say similar production, so could be a very close deal.
The bigger thing will be making sure that laf/kakko/key are on deals that end on different years, so cap increases can go towards their next raises.

 

[mike14]

He f***ing sucks, they can bin him, he's depreciated all of his value for the most part, has little salvage value, he's a scratch off at best at this stage.

I mean when Gallant was here, he had no problem running Schneider out there even though the kid didn't look great at times, because the kid put in the work. Everyone, including Gallant, says Schneider grinds every day, eats right, and takes care of his business. We don't hear any of that when it comes to Laf, just the opposite at this point.

For the life of me I don't understand why we care at this stage, he hasn't shown a thing, he's a bottom six player on most nights, borderline 2nd liner on a good day.

To be fair GG ran Laf out there a lot too.
For the talk of scratchings and benchings, Laf only missed 1 game, played the 5th most 5v5 for forwards (with a fair gap between him and 6th), and only played 8 games where his total TOI was under 13 mins. And even the season before he was 6th for 5v5 ice time and only missed 2 games.

Laf gets used at 5v5, so either the coaching staff felt that unfit, unmotivated Laf was a better option than over half our forwards, or it's all a bit overblown...

 

[UnSandvich]

Kakko got 2.1 coming off 18 points in 43 games
Laf had 39 points in 81 games

I'd say similar production, so could be a very close deal.
The bigger thing will be making sure that laf/kakko/key are on deals that end on different years, so cap increases can go towards their next raises.

Agree on the latter. I think it'll be in the 2.75-2.8 range personally.

 

[IDvsEGO]

To be fair GG ran Laf out there a lot too.
For the talk of scratchings and benchings, Laf only missed 1 game, played the 5th most 5v5 for forwards (with a fair gap between him and 6th), and only played 8 games where his total TOI was under 13 mins. And even the season before he was 6th for 5v5 ice time and only missed 2 games.

Laf gets used at 5v5, so either the coaching staff felt that unfit, unmotivated Laf was a better option than over half our forwards, or it's all a bit overblown...

The problem with GG and the kids this year wasn't even strength ice time.
The kids got it, and clearly GG knew the kids deserved it.
The problem was that he let the "vets" get away with stuff, that the kids never did. The vets had control of their own ice time, and the kids suffered for it.
Think about how long it took gallant to pull kakko from Mika and Kreider, even though at the start of the season that line was flat out dominant.
Think about how long it took him to separate panarin and trocheck who looked terrible together (and then he barely gave panarin any time with chytil).
Think about how long he stuck with kreider and mika, even though CK regressed pretty hard this year.

The kids saw there were two different standards.
Yeah laf and kakko and chytil all got their 5v5 time.
But the situations matter too. He rarely trusted them in a tight game. He never played matchups with his forwards at home, so the kids couldn't feast on a 3rd pair defense.

 

[duhmetreE]

You're making up scenarios that haven't played out very much. Lafreniere has hit with purpose, the Lafreniere hate has to ease up, people pick apart anything positive thats said about him. The narrative of him being slow is played out as well.

I often get the impression that Laffy throws violent WWE hits. Where he purposefully misses the guy. Can’t really explain it. It’s like when you and your friend were wrestling growing up. You try to sell it more than actually inflicting harm.

He does stick up for his teammates though.

I’d love for him to start taking his career a little more serious and play more angry.

 

[bouds]

To be fair GG ran Laf out there a lot too.
For the talk of scratchings and benchings, Laf only missed 1 game, played the 5th most 5v5 for forwards (with a fair gap between him and 6th), and only played 8 games where his total TOI was under 13 mins. And even the season before he was 6th for 5v5 ice time and only missed 2 games.

Laf gets used at 5v5, so either the coaching staff felt that unfit, unmotivated Laf was a better option than over half our forwards, or it's all a bit overblown...

Exactly, Laf got plenty of run, he got PP time as well in the last quarter of the season at least. He's had plenty of opportunities, but unfortunately hasn't done much. Just tired of the excuses, he just hasn't produced, nothing else you can do. Maybe one day the light goes on and he explodes, maybe one day I win the lotto, hey you never know....lol

 

[IDvsEGO]

Exactly, Laf got plenty of run, he got PP time as well in the last quarter of the season at least. He's had plenty of opportunities, but unfortunately hasn't done much. Just tired of the excuses, he just hasn't produced, nothing else you can do. Maybe one day the light goes on and he explodes, maybe one day I win the lotto, hey you never know....lol

He hasn't produced? who had a better year laf or CK?

 

[Chaels Arms]

The problem with GG and the kids this year wasn't even strength ice time.
The kids got it, and clearly GG knew the kids deserved it.
The problem was that he let the "vets" get away with stuff, that the kids never did. The vets had control of their own ice time, and the kids suffered for it.
Think about how long it took gallant to pull kakko from Mika and Kreider, even though at the start of the season that line was flat out dominant.
Think about how long it took him to separate panarin and trocheck who looked terrible together (and then he barely gave panarin any time with chytil).
Think about how long he stuck with kreider and mika, even though CK regressed pretty hard this year.

The kids saw there were two different standards.
Yeah laf and kakko and chytil all got their 5v5 time.
But the situations matter too. He rarely trusted them in a tight game. He never played matchups with his forwards at home, so the kids couldn't feast on a 3rd pair defense.

I think this was part of the helmet throwing frustration from Trouba. That happened at a moment in time where the 1st unit was sucking up almost the entire 2 minutes of every PP and not doing anything.

 

[leetch99]

Which kid do the Rangers trade first.... Schneider-Laf-Kakko-Miller ? It is the Ranger way .

 

[IDvsEGO]

Which kid do the Rangers trade first.... Schneider-Laf-Kakko-Miller ? It is the Ranger way .

Kreider was never moved. Mika came here as a kid.

None of them.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

This thread is hilarious

 

[McRanger92]

Which kid do the Rangers trade first.... Schneider-Laf-Kakko-Miller ? It is the Ranger way .

Hopefully none but if we do I hope there’s a reason behind it and not just “I give up”. This fanbase hasn’t had a worthwhile prospect debut as a 20 year old in many years before the rebuild. So it’s no wonder we don’t know what development at the NHL level looks like. Patience will pay off

 

[UnSandvich]

I often get the impression that Laffy throws violent WWE hits. Where he purposefully misses the guy. Can’t really explain it. It’s like when you and your friend were wrestling growing up. You try to sell it more than actually inflicting harm.

He does stick up for his teammates though.

I’d love for him to start taking his career a little more serious and play more angry.

Nah, i don't think that's the case. I think it's been more of the "Tanner Glass Special", where it's more hitting for the sake of hitting, as opposed to hitting to drive play/possession

 

[LORDE]

Get drafted #1 overall to a top team @ 19 yrs of age

A team that treats its players like Kings.

Sit back, relax & enjoy.

I wouldn't give him a raise at all.

(Maybe a marginal one because he's just kinda "there")

 

[IDvsEGO]

Get drafted #1 overall to a top team @ 19 yrs of age

A team that treats its players like Kings.

Sit back, relax & enjoy.

I wouldn't give him a raise at all.

(Maybe a marginal one because he's just kinda "there")

So you’d pay a 40 pt player at 5v5 league minimum?
Like I get the dislike, everyone expected Laf to come in and put up 100 pts his rookie year, and he didn’t.

But to say he hasn’t shown he can be capable of more? To say he’s not a top 6 guy at least?

 

[Ruggs225]

I for one am really excited for him this year. I think between covid and two horrific coaches that he takes a big leap this year.

Gallant in particular was the absolute worst thing to ever happen to him and kakko. I honestly dont believe there could be a worse coach for them. And thats not hyperbole. Gallant gave zero feedback and had no clue about x’s and o’s, put laff on his off wing then up and down the lineup, no structure for the team at all. I really feel that it was the most horrific situation imaginable for these two and laff in particular.

Lavs is a much better coach than gallant and its not even close. Hopefully we get some good assistants to go along.

Feeling like it can be a good year for our young three.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I for one am really excited for him this year. I think between covid and two horrific coaches that he takes a big leap this year.

Gallant in particular was the absolute worst thing to ever happen to him and kakko. I honestly dont believe there could be a worse coach for them. And thats not hyperbole. Gallant gave zero feedback and had no clue about x’s and o’s, put laff on his off wing then up and down the lineup, no structure for the team at all. I really feel that it was the most horrific situation imaginable for these two and laff in particular.

Lavs is a much better coach than gallant and its not even close. Hopefully we get some good assistants to go along.

Feeling like it can be a good year for our young three.

Laf is a different coach, better is to be seen.
It was well reported he refused to give kids time in Washington even tho they were clearly ready for it.

Now Laf and Kakko are 3/4 year vets so it might be less an issue but we’re also expecting Othmann to make the team?

 

[duhmetreE]

The Laffy hate is becoming hyperbolic

 

[mas0764]

The Laffy hate is becoming hyperbolic

It's disappointed expectations, which, yes, fair enough, he's disappointed, and some of it is indeed apparently his own fault. Too many rumblings of him not working hard enough to be completely untrue.

The org has also let him down as they've let down their other three top 10 forward picks.

That being said the board is ready to pencil Kakko into the top 6 long term.

Laf had ONE less point. And he's a year behind Kakko in terms of NHL experience.

If Lafreniere has a similar 0.8 ppg jump this year like Kakko did from year 3 to year 4, he will be at nearly 0.6 ppg with no PP time. He's gonna turn into a useful player.

Whether he is elite enough to be what we need is another question.

 

[alkurtz]

Haven't we learned yet that you just don't trade younger players until we are absolutely positive that they are not going to develop?

Are we sure about Laf yet? I'm not close to having reached the conclusion. He is only 21.

Yes, he is a disappointment. Yes, he might never develop into the franchise great winger we envisioned. But, then again, maybe he will. It is more likely that he will become a solid winger. Hey, even now, he is an adequate 3rd line winger who likely, at minimum, will be a 50 point winger next season.

He is most definitely worth gambling on for the next 2 or 3 years with a bridge contract. If, after that time, we are convinced, and we might be, that he will never develop, then, on only then, do you trade him.

Yes, a lot of this is on him and his conditioning and improving his skating. But a lot of this, now, at this point, is on the Rangers putting him in a situation where he can develop. That means higher in the lineup and PP time. He seems to suffer from a lack of confidence when he doesn't produce and play. Again, he is only 21 and is this all that unusual? I'm curious to see what his off season conditioning program looks like...that will not be known until training camp. That will be telling.

Trading him is about the dumbest idea that I have heard in a bit. Gamble on him and let's see what we have.

 

[duhmetreE]

Nah, i don't think that's the case. I think it's been more of the "Tanner Glass Special", where it's more hitting for the sake of hitting, as opposed to hitting to drive play/possession

I dont know... I've never seen a player like him... where he lines up the opposing player, comes in with a lot of speed/force and slams into the boards either just in front, or right behind the player. You can say he's too slow but he does it in front of the opposing play often too. It's odd. It's like he's 'play fighting'.

He has what it takes to be a 'Elon Musks' Sam Bennett. He may look like a 40 year old but I do not think he has mentally matured yet. In one season he will take a major leap. I don't know if it's this one coming up or the one to follow.

 

[Ruggs225]

Laf is a different coach, better is to be seen.
It was well reported he refused to give kids time in Washington even tho they were clearly ready for it.

Now Laf and Kakko are 3/4 year vets so it might be less an issue but we’re also expecting Othmann to make the team?

I think Othmann should spend most of the year in the AHL.

 

[duhmetreE]

I think Othmann should spend most of the year in the AHL.

whatever would be best for Othmann, I'd expect the opposite to happen.