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Player Discussion Alexis Lafrenière

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SA16 said:
Can I ask why you don't understand the difference between even strength play and 5v5 play?

The fact that you wrote a huge post without even double checking that the original post said "5v5 ice time" is concerning.

I mean if you want to consider OT and 4v4 play and EVERY even strength situation as you stated that's fine but you do you man.
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Is 5 on 5 any more relevant than even strength? Is there a reason to omit 4 on 4 and 3 on 3 when talking about usage?
 
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Raspewtin said:
yeah but the issue is he does this more often than he doesn't. it starts to feel like a feature and not a bug.
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Yeah he still definitely does that way more than he does moving his feet. He's still young so I'm holding out hope it's just a matter of him maturing and understanding it needs to happen every single game for him to be successful.
 
SnowblindNYR said:
If we're using usage as a proxy for coach's trust why would there be a reason to omit 3 on 3 and 4 on 4?
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Because it serves a preferred narrative. In reality it’s a subjective choice to focus only on 5v5 rather than ALL even strength play. There isnt the hike in scoring that comes with power play time, but it’s still a different style of play, the more room on the ice more scoring chances.
 
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bhamill said:
I’ll take 8 “non flashy” goals in 15 games over 6 “flashy” ones. He HAS offensive skill. I personally care about results, not how the player LOOKS getting them.
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Aside from a full summer of power skating drills, I also feel like he doesn't try to do any of the flashy things he did in juniors because he's being coached not to. He seldom tries anything fancy almost like he's too afraid, probably being too careful because he doesn't wanna get benched. He's pretty much being coached to be the gritty, get in front of the net, grinder type of player. We've all seen his draft highlights, this was not how he played aside from finishing his checks. It's really only recently that I've seen more flashes of the juniors version of Laffy.
 
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JCMac23 said:
Aside from a full summer of power skating drills, I also feel like he doesn't try to do any of the flashy things he did in juniors because he's being coached not to. He seldom tries anything fancy almost like he's too afraid, probably being too careful because he doesn't wanna get benched. He's pretty much being coached to be the gritty, get in front of the net, grinder type of player. We've all seen his draft highlights, this was not how he played aside from finishing his checks. It's really only recently that I've seen more flashes of the juniors version of Laffy.
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He’s always been a skill/physical hybrid but his game wasn’t based on flashiness. His usage has definitely been a factor in his development arc. He’s been getting more responsibility and recently more power play time and that does wonders for confidence which translates into scoring. He’s still just a D+3 player. He’s going to have ups and downs; what you look for is for the ups to be higher and more prolonged and the downs to be shorter and less horrific. Haha. And he seems on that path to me. I can easily see him being THE guy on this team by the time he is 24. I know we all wish our 1OA was there already, but it is what it is. He came into a situation most 1OA players dont deal with, having stars ahead of him on the depth chart and blocked from meaningful power play time and responsibility. If you look at his D+1 vs Jack Hughes’ D+1, Laf’s was easily better. Hughes got different usage though, more responsibility, and was kept on the pp and got big minutes despite his mistakes and growing pains. I’m not saying Laf would have the same numbers as Hughes, I’m saying his OWN development would have accelerated. There aren’t really a lot of comparables looking at Lafreniere’s post draft circumstances as a 1OA, looking at usage, roster depth and COVID conditions.
 
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I dont know if it's instinctual but I never worried/worry about Laffy.

He will be a good/great player for a long time.

I've been indifferent on Chytil and Kakko though
 
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bhamill said:
I’ll take 8 “non flashy” goals in 15 games over 6 “flashy” ones. He HAS offensive skill. I personally care about results, not how the player LOOKS getting them.
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But flashy skill generally generates more goals. Ergo I wish he had some of it.
 
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JCMac23 said:
Aside from a full summer of power skating drills, I also feel like he doesn't try to do any of the flashy things he did in juniors because he's being coached not to. He seldom tries anything fancy almost like he's too afraid, probably being too careful because he doesn't wanna get benched. He's pretty much being coached to be the gritty, get in front of the net, grinder type of player. We've all seen his draft highlights, this was not how he played aside from finishing his checks. It's really only recently that I've seen more flashes of the juniors version of Laffy.
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As an organization, we have a very long, storied, and unfortunate history of doing this to pretty much any young wiz who joins us.
 
Rangers in 7 said:
Here I’ll try again…

wrong….typical
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You're entitled to disagree with my opinion, but 31 other fan bases think he's not performing according to expectations... and they're right. The longer he stays here, the less we'll be able to get in return. We needed a game-changing star forward. That player's name is Tim Stützle.

When we drafted Lafrenière, I said there's no way we could screw this up. We didn't. Lafrenière did.
 
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Megustaelhockey said:
You're entitled to disagree with my opinion, but 31 other fan bases think he's not performing according to expectations... and they're right. The longer he stays here, the less we'll be able to get in return. We needed a game-changing star forward. That player's name is Tim Stützle.

When we drafted Lafrenière, I said there's no way we could screw this up. We didn't. Lafrenière did.
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It’s the org. We didn’t miss on two can’t miss players in a row.
 
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mas0764 said:
But flashy skill generally generates more goals. Ergo I wish he had some of it.
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Not sure this is actually true, but this certainly doesn’t change what I said. I don’t care if a player LOOKS flashy or not while he gets results.

Megustaelhockey said:
Trade him this summer while he still has SOME value. He's not what we thought we were getting, and keeping him will accomplish nothing.
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Awful take that will age even more badly. Hahaha.
 
bhamill said:
Not sure this is actually true, but this certainly doesn’t change what I said. I don’t care if a player LOOKS flashy or not while he gets results.


Awful take that will age even more badly. Hahaha.
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Can't wait to be proven wrong. So far, he hasn't been able to cut it in this league.
 
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bhamill said:
Not sure this is actually true, but this certainly doesn’t change what I said. I don’t care if a player LOOKS flashy or not while he gets results.


Awful take that will age even more badly. Hahaha.
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agree with the sentiment on dont care how it gets done if it gets done. skill and flashy more often than not go hand in hand, but theres obviously different skillsets. theres a lot of flash thats useless skill, like nik zherdev had a ton of skill/flash, but i dont care how many guys you deke if you end up in the corner or throwing no look passes to nobody.

its crazy that people dont think laf doesnt have skill and doesnt have some flash. he just doesnt use it constantly just to use it. like laf is easily one of the best passers on the team. hes gotten scewed outta more assists by chytil than kakko than is almost believable dishing them cross ice wide open looks. he also has some nasty hands one on one hes shown at times - that will continue to show more frequently as he gets more confident and is less deferential, is probably top 3 on the team in his ability to control any kind of pass / loose puck consistently while on the move or stopped, can get pucks off his stick quickly on either side of the ice off the pass. like he does a lot of things at a very high level, hes just efficient with where he uses his flash - a good part of that was he defers too much, esp when his confidence is down and his instinct is to pass which he leans into too much sometimes. like today he put on 2 filthy moves gaining the zone then sold the shot before putting a cross ice pass on kanes tape for the one timer in the 3rd. the skill is there, anyone who says otherwise just doesnt know hockey very well. it doesnt happen overnight for everyone, doesnt mean its not there. bet buf is happy they didnt get rid of tage, bos with debrusk, car with necas etc etc....on the other side theres teams like ott who gave up on mika sooooo....lets just dial it back with the trade him idiocy around here - this isnt to you personally to be clear, general statement.
 
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Laf hasn’t performed to his draft status, but he’s still a good player, and I wouldn’t give up on him just yet.

Sometimes I hear the impatience and I wonder how many fans remember the dark ages.
 
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If we didn’t have Zibanejad, Panarin and Kreider putting up big seasons the last 3 years to put us in a playoff position then I think everyone would be patient and be okay with the baby steps. But Fox being a Norris off the bat, Igor being a Vezina off the bat now everyone is dying for the kids to catch up because they think we have a short window.
 
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Chytilmania said:
If we didn’t have Zibanejad, Panarin and Kreider putting up big seasons the last 3 years to put us in a playoff position then I think everyone would be patient and be okay with the baby steps. But Fox being a Norris off the bat, Igor being a Vezina off the bat now everyone is dying for the kids to catch up because they think we have a short window.
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Expecting a first overall to perform and look the part before three years has past is not a high expectation at all
 
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Megustaelhockey said:
Is he meeting your expectations? Be honest.
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So cutting it, means meeting your expectation? Hahahaha. The guy is an NHLer. He’s scoring 0.5ppg, is 9th on a team with Panarin, Zib, Taresenko, Kane and Fox on it... I don’t think “cutting it” means what you think it does.
 
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