Player Discussion Alex DeBrincat

[Pierre from Orleans]

It's not just Cat. It's all the kids in this league. Look what's happening in Winnipeg. Look at how everyone wanted out of Columbus for so many years.

These kids act like they truly deserve tens of millions of dollars a year for playing a game. They all need a reality check. They are damned lucky to be in a position to play a game for a living and set themselves up for their great grandkids to be financially secure for life.

To be fair if fans don't pay a premium to watch them they wouldn't be paid so much and it's not as if they didnt work hard and sacrifice to get to where they are.

I do understand your sentiment however.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Or when making trades Target players with term or RFAs that you know will sign with you before you pay assets for them.

100%. And until the pen hits the paper, the same really applies to Chychrun. I hate a player having 2 years left, it's friggin no mans land. 3 years, fair enough, you can deal with it. Anything less is a big risk IMO.

EDIT: It should be noted that I would do the Chychrun trade 1000 times out of a 1000, but still.

 

[chaser17]

It's not just Cat. It's all the kids in this league. Look what's happening in Winnipeg. Look at how everyone wanted out of Columbus for so many years.

These kids act like they truly deserve tens of millions of dollars a year for playing a game. They all need a reality check. They are damned lucky to be in a position to play a game for a living and set themselves up for their great grandkids to be financially secure for life.

They're all spoiled and entitled having grown up in the era where parents and coaches who utilize tough love and brutal honesty no longer exist. Debrincat and Dubois haven't proven to be consistent enough to demand 9M+ per year let alone trying to force a sign and trade to a team of their choosing while still under RFA status.

 

[bicboi64]

They're all spoiled and entitled having grown up in the era where parents and coaches who utilize tough love and brutal honesty no longer exist. Debrincat and Dubois haven't proven to be consistent enough to demand 9M+ per year let alone trying to force a sign and trade to a team of their choosing while still under RFA status.

I think there's a clear distinction between Cat and PLD.

PLD actively gave up during a game, its why he got benched. That's just unprofessional. Cat has never done that and is more of a professional.

I think its fair for a player to not want to play in a certain area due to finances or family, but as long as they don't give up on the ice, its 'fine'. I remember when Nash wanted out of Columbus, he made it clear that he will do whatever it takes to win games on a nightly basis with the BJs, but is open to being moved as long as it benefits both sides. That's what a professional does and it seems Cat is doing that. He's not demanding a trade and by all accounts will show up and put in the work if we sign him to a 1 year deal.

 

[SpezDispenser]

What's the optimum package from detroit on a sign and trade?

 

[bicboi64]

What's the optimum package from detroit on a sign and trade?

Cat signed 8 years @$8.7 million avv (matches Larkin), for the 17th overall, Kubalik and Rasmussen.

We get a middle 6 winger for a year and a prospect with size who can play on our 3rd line but has potential to play on the 2nd in Rasmussen. I really want Rasmussen off the wings

 

[SpezDispenser]

Cat signed 8 years @$8.7 million avv (matches Larkin), for the 17th overall, Kubalik and Rasmussen.

We get a middle 6 winger for a year and a prospect with size who can play on our 3rd line but has potential to play on the 2nd in Rasmussen. I really want Rasmussen off the wings

Would be a very solid return.

 

[SENStastic]

Cat signed 8 years @$8.7 million avv (matches Larkin), for the 17th overall, Kubalik and Rasmussen.

We get a middle 6 winger for a year and a prospect with size who can play on our 3rd line but has potential to play on the 2nd in Rasmussen. I really want Rasmussen off the wings

That would be a solid return if possible, but how realistic is it? That package is arguably the same if not better than what we gave up to get him, I'd be surprised if we landed that much value back.

 

[SpezDispenser]

That would be a solid return if possible, but how realistic is it? That package is arguably the same if not better than what we gave up to get him, I'd be surprised if we landed that much value back.

The thing is...it only takes two teams to be fighting for him for the price to escalate.

He'd be doing us a major solid by agreeing to negotiate an extension with certain teams on his list.

 

[SENStastic]

The thing is...it only takes two teams to be fighting for him for the price to escalate.

He'd be doing us a major solid by agreeing to negotiate an extension with certain teams on his list.

Thats true, but it's also the best case scenario for us. Yzerman is a very schrewd manager and doesn't strike me as someone that will engage in a bidding war unless he starts getting desperate all the sudden for some reason. He just sold off a bunch of asset last tdl just cause he didn't feel like his team was good enough to remain in the playoff hunt despite being right in the mix with Ottawa. Doesn't seem he's in much of a hurry even with them not making the playoffs in long time.

 

[DrEasy]

For sure. I didn't mean to fault them, it's just a perspective thing from someone who isn't wealthy. As I said, I'm actually incredibly jealous they even have that option.

From my seat, I just can't imagine why having as much as possible is the priority when you're already living lavishly, but I'm sure when you're in that position it's very different.

I also find it relates to the chance you give your team to win in a cap environment. They all talk about winning, but very few would sacrifice individually to fit x,y or z in under the cap. The money is #1, winning #2.

These guys are competitive and have an ego: they tie their worth to the value of their contract. When Fiala signs for whatever, DBC wants to sign at least for that much. It's not that different in regular workplaces: you see a co-worker who gets a promotion and you don't, even though you put up as much work or more, you're going to be pissed even if your current salary is very decent. Just human nature.

 

[bicboi64]

That would be a solid return if possible, but how realistic is it? That package is arguably the same if not better than what we gave up to get him, I'd be surprised if we landed that much value back.

Oh I doubt it happens.

Honestly I expect something underwhelming af like the 2 highest of Detroits' seconds, Berggren. I'm aiming low to avoid disappointment lol

 

[Ouroboros]

Cat signed 8 years @$8.7 million avv (matches Larkin), for the 17th overall, Kubalik and Rasmussen.

We get a middle 6 winger for a year and a prospect with size who can play on our 3rd line but has potential to play on the 2nd in Rasmussen. I really want Rasmussen off the wings

I don't think there is any scenario where we can get Rasmussen. Detroit just don't have a lot of functional size and snarl in their lineup, and they can't really afford to give any of it up.

When you look at what Detroit has a lot of - both on their team and in their prospect pool - it's primarily small skill. Raymond, Berggren, Fabbri, Buchelnikov, Lombardi, James, Neiderbach, Mastrosimone, Doucet. So this is the area where they are probably comfortable subtracting from in order to get a proven, high-end small skill player.

So I could see maybe something like Berggren + 17. It would be really nice to get a third piece [maybe one of their 2nd rounders] but not sure it's doable. If the Sens are taking back an older roster player with less control then I would definitely be hoping for the third piece.

 

[SantosHalper]

I don't think there is any scenario where we can get Rasmussen. Detroit just don't have a lot of functional size and snarl in their lineup, and they can't really afford to give any of it up.

Yes, sir.

Red Wings brass has already said that Red Wings needs to become bigger and tougher to play against, trading Ras would be exactly the opposite. And since Bertuzzi was traded, Ras become even more valuable for Detroit. Top-6 winger, bottom-6 center/winger, offensive role, shutdown role, PP & PK units, extremely valuable utility player for Detroit.

This season Ras also started to use his size properly and Red Wings were in the wild card spot race firmly before Ras got injured, it was all downhill after that. Larkin has also praised Rasmussen's leadership qualities, i wouldn't be surprised if Ras wears "A" within a year.

So yeah, Rasmussen is not going to get traded for DeBrincat.

 

[Beech]

Yes, sir.

Red Wings brass has already said that Red Wings needs to become bigger and tougher to play against, trading Ras would be exactly the opposite. And since Bertuzzi was traded, Ras become even more valuable for Detroit. Top-6 winger, bottom-6 center/winger, offensive role, shutdown role, PP & PK units, extremely valuable utility player for Detroit.

This season Ras also started to use his size properly and Red Wings were in the wild card spot race firmly before Ras got injured, it was all downhill after that. Larkin has also praised Rasmussen's leadership qualities, i wouldn't be surprised if Ras wears "A" within a year.

So yeah, Rasmussen is not going to get traded for DeBrincat.

you seem surprised that Ottawa fans are offering two fives for a ten. And we don't even have the dignity to throw in a second round pick.

 

[bert]

I really don’t get this. In all the 2018 WJC team discussion there is only 1 thing we know as fact - John Doe #1 had consensual sex with the woman as she has clearly stated in her statements.

Just telling you what I'm hearing. I have 0 confidence he will be playing any time soon. Along with a few others.

 

[JD1]

ELC guys are always buying in, it's their only choice for another 5 years.

Soon to be UFA's is a whole different story.

It was an extremely risky trade, with a very high likelihood of backfire. Pierre took the chance.

That looks to be coming to fruition.

The Sens are a team that needs assurances when trading for guys like DBC. They aren't a So-Cal, or Florida team. The hope to convince someone to stay is not a route the Sens can take, as they are not a desirable place for guys entering that UFA age.

I think we need to ease up on the hyperbole

Extremely risky

What's the worst case scenario here? DeBrincat gets moved at this season's deadline for multiple draft picks and we get 140 games played from him in a Sens uni?

What's the best case? Idk, maybe he signs for 8 years at a decent cap hit.

What might happen? Sign and trade. We get a couple of decent assets that are in the lineup in 23-24 for a 7th, a 39th and a 2024 3rd rounder with no guarantee at all that the latter two ever play NHL hockey

We acquired a guy with two years of team control for draft capital. This isn't a destination city. You're not going to get a DeBrincat calibre player rushing here to sign a 7 year Ufa contract at 25 years old. So if you don't take shots like this one now and again with the hope the player likes it, you're kinda f***ed and you're 100% dependent on the draft to get quality.

So as much as people want to twist this to paint the GM as a bumbling idiot...he got a top line player for draft capital and in this market that's what you might have to do sometimes

This isn't Vegas where every player is hoping to land here

 

[Micklebot]

I think we need to ease up on the hyperbole

Extremely risky

What's the worst case scenario here? DeBrincat gets moved at this season's deadline for multiple draft picks and we get 140 games played from him in a Sens uni?

What's the best case? Idk, maybe he signs for 8 years at a decent cap hit.

What might happen? Sign and trade. We get a couple of decent assets that are in the lineup in 23-24 for a 7th, a 39th and a 2024 3rd rounder with no guarantee at all that the latter two ever play NHL hockey

We acquired a guy with two years of team control for draft capital. This isn't a destination city. You're not going to get a DeBrincat calibre player rushing here to sign a 7 year Ufa contract at 25 years old. So if you don't take shots like this one now and again with the hope the player likes it, you're kinda f***ed and you're 100% dependent on the draft to get quality.

So as much as people want to twist this to paint the GM as a bumbling idiot...he got a top line player for draft capital and in this market that's what you might have to do sometimes

This isn't Vegas where every player is hoping to land here

Worst case is probably that we opt not to trade him at the deadline because we're in the mix for the playoffs, and our GM thinks his job is on the line if we miss.

I'm in the wait and see camp, the damage likely won't be franchise altering but to Bondra's point, the risk that it would be a net negative was fairly high, even if that negative wasn't a big deal.

We rolled the dice, it happens. I see the potential upside as having been worth it.

 

[JD1]

Worst case is probably that we opt not to trade him at the deadline because we're in the mix for the playoffs, and our GM thinks his job is on the line if we miss.

I'm in the wait and see camp, the damage likely won't be franchise altering but to Bondra's point, the risk that it would be a net negative was fairly high, even if that negative wasn't a big deal.

We rolled the dice, it happens. I see the potential upside as having been worth it.

I don't see the losing the job angle at next year's tdl. Andlauer will be in control at that point and if it comes to that, he'll have a say in keeping the player for a potential playoff appearance in his first year.

If this ends up as a sign and trade, do you think it ends up a net negative? We're going to recoup NHL players. Likely two. For a 7oa and a couple of hopes and prayers.

 

[Micklebot]

If this ends up as a sign and trade, do you think it ends up a net negative? We're going to recoup NHL players. Likely two. For a 7oa and a couple of hopes and prayers.

We don't have a lot of leverage, so probably. DeBrincat might as well have a full NMC, and 7 OA, 39 OA and a 3rd is a pretty big haul, more than we forgot Stone imo.

 

[BankStreetParade]

I'm kind of surprised he doesn't want to stay. The personality he shows indicates someone who is quiet, unassuming, uninterested in partying and nightlife, looking for space. I'd also imagine it would be hard for him to say a negative word about the locker room, his teammates, the way he's been treated by the coaching staff, etc. Why wouldn't Ottawa be near the top of the list?

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

I'm kind of surprised he doesn't want to stay. The personality he shows indicates someone who is quiet, unassuming, uninterested in partying and nightlife, looking for space. I'd also imagine it would be hard for him to say a negative word about the locker room, his teammates, the way he's been treated by the coaching staff, etc. Why wouldn't Ottawa be near the top of the list?

He probably just hates potholes.

 

[Sens Vader]

I do like the idea of targeting Rasmussen from Detroit

I think he has some more upside and can okay C/LW

 

[Cosmix]

This trade is gonna have to knock my socks off to not view the original trade as a massive swing and a miss by Dorion.

Could challenge the Zibby trade!

 

[jbeck5]

While this is true, if the Sens are taking Debrincat to arbitration, it signals the end of his time in Ottawa. Arbitration can ruin a player-organization relationship. If they were negotiating a long-term contract, they wouldn’t ruin that relationship over a potential 15% pay cut.

I agree with how things have been in Ottawa recently.

But there was a time where going to arbitration in Ottawa wasn't the end. It was just an option in case they couldn't find a multi year deal beforehand.