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Aho or Matthews (including contracts)

Aho or Matthews including contracts

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ijuka said:
Depends on what it's used for? This poll isn't even about the Canes - reading comprehension.
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You’re the one with the poor reading comprehension.

Read over all my posts that you’ve been replying to.

Also, the question is for you.
It’s not a poll question. I’m not asking everyone in this thread.
Just you because you keep replying to me.

If the player fits in your team cap space then the contract has no value Really.

For a team like the Canes that can fit either player, who would you have?

It’s not a hard question.

If a Team can’t fit Matthews you’d have to go with Aho. For a team that can fit Matthews they’ll go with Matthews.

So I’m asking YOU ijuka.
What would you do?

Is that easier to understand?
 
Keanu Reeves said:
Matthews would fetch more on Free Agency than Aho would.

What matters is what a GM is willing to give to have that player on their team and what cap space does he want remaining.

Hell, Skinner got more than Aho.
Maybe Aho should have held out longer.
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The poll simply asks Aho (8.454M x 5 years) or Matthews (11.634M x 5 years)
There is no universe fictional or reality based that Matthews is 3.18M better or is worth 27.3% more than Aho.

That was awful contract that Dubas got taken to the cleaners on.
 
Matthews is a better player than Aho, and not a single team in the NHL would take Aho before Matthews.

But what does that matter? Canes got Aho in the 2nd round and are laughing all the way to the bank.

People on HFboards get too wrapped up over numbers for superstar players.

Matthews gets paid what he does because at his age, he's one of the best goal scorers over the last 20 years.
 
LakeLivin said:
Reimer was a contract-dump trade between the Canes and Panthers. Including him in a "value" hypothetical makes no sense, lol. But just for fun I'll play: who would you rather have, Aho, Slavin, and TVR OR Matthews and Zaitsev? (both packages about $16.1m)
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Keanu Reeves said:
Point

Your head

Also, Zaitsev is gone.

The point I’m making is both Matthews and Aho fit in the Canes cap space.
So the Cap space saved by having Aho instead of Matthews is pointless. For example Canes have cap space for a salary dump in Reimer.

Sorry about your reading comprehension.
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Well. I'd say my problem isn't as much with reading comprehension as it is with your logic (or lack thereof, lol). You used a bad example trying to illustrate a point and I shot back with another one. And after using McElhinney (now with TB) in your example, you're going to criticism me for using Zaitsev in mine? :huh:

As far as your point, I'll try to address it seriously taking into account your subsequent responses and without being overly snide. I hear what you're trying to say above. But what I think you're missing is that in today's NHL, cap space does have value. Both tangible and with respect to what a team can or can't do with it's roster moving forward. Prime example of the first: Canes just got the Leafs 1st round pick in exchange for . . . cap space! Canes essentially got Teravainen in exchange for cap space, as well.

Right now, given the players the Canes still need to sign, they couldn't fit Matthews contract under the cap. But that's a moot point to the original hypothetical question, imo. If the Canes could magically switch players, and considered Matthews a better net "value", they could trade a player like Dzingel or Haula and go with a league minimum salary replacement.
 
Why does Matthews make 3 mill more than Aho? ... Simple. GOAL SCORING.

Matthews would have started his career with 3 straight 40 or more goal seasons to start his career. And Aho barely managed 30 this year. Let that sink in.

Goals, imo, mean a lot more in contact negotiations when PPG are close. At the end of the day, are you willing to pay 3 million dollars more for the guy who'll score 10-15 more goals a season, if healthy? I think I would be.
 
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The Winter Soldier said:
The poll simply asks Aho (8.454M x 5 years) or Matthews (11.634M x 5 years)
There is no universe fictional or reality based that Matthews is 3.18M better or is worth 27.3% more than Aho.

That was awful contract that Dubas got taken to the cleaners on.
Click to expand...

Dubas didn't get taken to the cleaners.

It's Hilarious that you are willing to offer sheet Marner with 41sts and a 10.5M+Contract, yet think Dubas got taken to the cleaners with Matthews signing a 11.6M.

The Winter Soldier said:
I would be all for this. As long as we sign Barzal. The next 5-7 years with Barzal and Marner spearheading the core. You would have 2 elite offensive drivers on 2 lines for their primes. It would make the Isles contenders with their Defence as soon as next season. 4 first rd picks with the Isles making the playoffs, and really they should if you add Marner to the #1GA team in the NHL would be 20+31 picks. Not a big price when you look at how first rd picks were traded for 600K of capspace. I would be all for this. But a lot of things have to happen for it to take place. Namely presenting an offer, player signing it, and team not matching it. None are sure things.
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Regarding Aho and there's no Universe that Matthews is 3.18M better.
It's pointless. What matters is who can fit in your teams cap space.

Aho caved. Signed a deal with Montreal which was less his worth.
Even the Canes GM was surprised that Aho didn't get more.
There will be RFA's who aren't better than Aho like Laine, but will sign for a larger price tag. We'll see. No other RFA caved yet.

Now since you are in favour of the NYI losing 41sts and signing Marner to a 10.5M+ contract.
I'm sure you would be in favour of NYI doing the same if Matthews was an RFA.
 
In what world is a guy who scored at a 0.5 GPG (111 in 212 games) not better than a guy who barely managed 30 goals and a PPG season? I don't get it, at all. If Matthews was healthy he would have challenged for the rocket(at least be top 5) every single season he played. This is like the twilight zone. Makes no damn sense. Aho is great player on a very good contract, especially in a few years, valuing his contract going forward is more than understandable but to say he's the better player is just plain wrong.
 
Since all leaf fans are pointing to goal scoring, is there ANY other area of the game were Matthews is better than Aho?
 
Matthews has one of the worst contracts in the league. Equal contracts I ignore his bad injury history and pick Matthews, but with the disgusting overpay it’s aho all day and twice 4pm/7est Saturday.
 
Harhis said:
Since all leaf fans are pointing to goal scoring, is there ANY other area of the game were Matthews is better than Aho?
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The thing is, goal scoring isn't something that Matthews is just "better" at than Aho; Matthews has been in elite company since he came into the league. The guy is second in even strength goals despite missing 30 games more than anyone in the top 5. He is only behind Ovechkin in GPG since he entered in the league. This guy is getting ridiculously underrated around here.

This is what people from Marner's camp or Aho's camp can't understand when it comes to them making Matthews money. Those guys have superstar numbers, but Matthews has goal scoring numbers that puts him with the best in the league. Goal scoring is the big premium in the league.
 
Keanu Reeves said:
You’re the one with the poor reading comprehension.

Read over all my posts that you’ve been replying to.

Also, the question is for you.
It’s not a poll question. I’m not asking everyone in this thread.
Just you because you keep replying to me.

If the player fits in your team cap space then the contract has no value Really.

For a team like the Canes that can fit either player, who would you have?

It’s not a hard question.

If a Team can’t fit Matthews you’d have to go with Aho. For a team that can fit Matthews they’ll go with Matthews.

So I’m asking YOU ijuka.
What would you do?

Is that easier to understand?
Click to expand...


So would you rather have McDavid at 40 million a year if your team can fit him under the cap or Matthews At 11? What would you do?
 
The Beyonder said:
The thing is, goal scoring isn't something that Matthews is just "better" at than Aho; Matthews has been in elite company since he came into the league. The guy is second in even strength goals despite missing 30 games more than anyone in the top 5. He is only behind Ovechkin in GPG since he entered in the league. This guy is getting ridiculously underrated around here.

This is what people from Marner's camp or Aho's camp can't understand when it comes to them making Matthews money. Those guys have superstar numbers, but Matthews has goal scoring numbers that puts him with the best in the league. Goal scoring is the big premium in the league.
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So if hypotetichly Leafs score 50 goals while Matthews is on the ice and Matthews gets 30+10, and Canes score 80 goals when Aho is on the ice and Aho gets 15+45 Matthews is better? Because HE scored more goals. It is still a team game.
 
Keanu Reeves said:
If a Team can’t fit Matthews you’d have to go with Aho. For a team that can fit Matthews they’ll go with Matthews.

So I’m asking YOU ijuka.
What would you do?

Is that easier to understand?
Click to expand...
I'd go with Aho and with the extra cap space, take some assets from a team with cap trouble by taking up some salary from them, if I really can't make a significant upgrade to my roster with it - an example being a first round pick in exchange for taking Marleau's salary. That's what I'd do.

I don't get how that's relevant to this poll, though? Cap space has a value, and the GM obviously has to make use of it. In the same way, having McDavid on your team isn't of much use if you send him down to AHL, or healthy scratch him. Those decisions are completely irrelevant to the innate value of the players or their contracts.
 
Aho was one of the main reasons Carolina made the ECF, even without contracts I'll take the guy who's shown he can step up when games matter.
 
McVespa99 said:
So would you rather have McDavid at 40 million a year if your team can fit him under the cap or Matthews At 11? What would you do?
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Unfortunately for McDavid that’s not his market value.
Try to use a little bit of common sense.
Now if McDavid was an RFA would he be with more than the 12.5M in today’s market?
Absolutely.
Now, if the Leafs didn’t sign JT could they make room for McDavid?
Yeah they can.
Nylander would have to go.
So the Leafs would have McDavid, Matthews and Marner.

Would losing out on JT and losing Nylander be worth having McDavid.
Yeah.
 
Keanu Reeves said:
Unfortunately for McDavid that’s not his market value.
Try to use a little bit of common sense.
Now if McDavid was an RFA would he be with more than the 12.5M in today’s market?
Absolutely.
Now, if the Leafs didn’t sign JT could they make room for McDavid?
Yeah they can.
Nylander would have to go.
So the Leafs would have McDavid, Matthews and Marner.

Would losing out on JT and losing Nylander be worth having McDavid.
Yeah.
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Neither is 11.6 for Matthews.
 
Keanu Reeves said:
If Jakub Voracek is worth signing a 8.25M contract in 2015 & Kevin Hayes is worth signing 7.12M in 2019
The Matthews contract signed in 2019 is a bargain.
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Those are two of the worst comparisons you could use for Matthews and his contract. You might as well start comparing goaltenders to him.
 
The Beyonder said:
Why does Matthews make 3 mill more than Aho? ... Simple. GOAL SCORING.

Matthews would have started his career with 3 straight 40 or more goal seasons to start his career. And Aho barely managed 30 this year. Let that sink in.

Goals, imo, mean a lot more in contact negotiations when PPG are close. At the end of the day, are you willing to pay 3 million dollars more for the guy who'll score 10-15 more goals a season, if healthy? I think I would be.
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So if he didn't do something 2 out of 3 seasons because he keeps getting injured, he should get credit for doing that thing and we should accept it as a positive?

You're knocking Aho for barely scoring 30(something he did in real life) and praising Matthews for something he could have, but did not do, in the same sentence. And that is what makes Matthews worth 3 million dollars?

Kinda sounds like Aho improves every year and Matthews gets hurt every year. Is that what you pay the extra 3 mill for?
 
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