Post-Game Talk: # 50 | Maple Leafs 1 at FLYERS 2 | Thursday, January 26, 2017

[BackWithaVengeance]

I think PP2 looked better tonight than it has in years.

It's not the first time in the last couple of games they seem to be better than the first PP unit.

 

[Fragmuffin]

I dont get to watch a lot of Flyers games this season, so I was really surprised by COusins' play.

Not that i thought he was a bad player, but he was amazing tonight in zone entries. Really displayed good vision, puckhandling and could find and exploit the gaps in the opponents lines.


Also, for all the songs that are sung about Matthews I thought Nylander was their best player. He just never looks tentative, always drives the play with incredible speed and determination.

 

[BillDineen]

Great game by the Couturier line. Cousins generated a lot of chances.

AMac was strong this game. Have to give him his props.

It is nickpicking, but the 4th line generated a ozone faceoff with about 6:30 to go and Hak keeps them out there instead of putting out a offensive line. That is just stupidity. Of course, the 4th line got the goal later, so Hak will do it again.

... and Couturier in front of the net is his best place on PP2 IMO. That unit looked good.

Also, sad that we didn't end up with Zaitsev after years of rumors. He and Provorov would be dynamite.

 

[Bobby Orr's Knees]

Great game by the Couturier line. Cousins generated a lot of chances.

AMac was strong this game. Have to give him his props.

... and Couturier in front of the net is his best place on PP2 IMO. That unit looked good.

Also, sad that we didn't end up with Zaitsev after years of rumors. He and Provorov would be dynamite.

Good game. AMac actually looked like an NHL D last night. Provy was shaky to start, but then figured things out. Real shame we didn't get Zaitsev. He is everything I though he would be, and more.

 

[kelmitchell]

Some thoughts:

Hakstol is going to defend the 4th line because he has no one else to throw out there, and he needs to rotate them in to keep his other lines fresh - this team plays best when it's aggressive but that wears down the legs because they're not that fast overall so they have to push it. And PEB and VdV have been solid on the PK given the shaky goaltending behind them, better than some of the people we've thrown out there, MacDonald however . . .

Cousins played the best game I can remember as a Flyer, he's really blossoming playing LW with Couts, I think it's a synergy thing, Couts is physical and defensively responsible, Cousins is niftier offensively.

Luby is a 4th line guy until he develops a lot more polish offensively, like the hustle and speed, but come on, that was a turn around and fire shot that he got lucky on.

Neuvirth wasn't great, but like Mason the night before, he was good enough, and a little lucky (puck hitting the post, puck bouncing over the net).

When the goalies play well, this is a playoff team - however, I'm not going to believe it until March, they've broken our hearts before.

I thought luby had NO offensive skills and never shows flashes.....

 

[kelmitchell]

I loved that rant hahaha I had that on while watching the game, I wish they'd give him free speech on tv

 

[BritainStix]

I loved that rant hahaha I had that on while watching the game, I wish they'd give him free speech on tv

He had a couple of those rants over the year. They were a joy to listen too.

 

[Appleyard]

Speaking of PP2... PP2 next year should be soooo fun:

Couturier
Konecny - Lindblom
Provorov - Sanheim


I know Lindblom is good at net-front too... but he is also really good on the half-wall, and with his passing and shot may be better utilised there and drifting into slot.

I mean, I really think the old ~2008-11 PP set-up would work well for that unit... giving the option for two guys net-front at times.

 

[Bobby Orr's Knees]

Crosby man.... Such a talent, but a total dick. Hard to respect a guy like that.

 

[Cootsfanclub]

Speaking of PP2... PP2 next year should be soooo fun:

Couturier
Konecny - Lindblom
Provorov - Sanheim


I know Lindblom is good at net-front too... but he is also really good on the half-wall, and with his passing and shot may be better utilised there and drifting into slot.

I mean, I really think the old ~2008-11 PP set-up would work well for that unit... giving the option for two guys net-front at times.

You don't think Lindblom will need some AHL time adjusting to NA ice? I do think his game would lend itself to NA well though.

 

[Striiker]

Some thoughts:

Hakstol is going to defend the 4th line because he has no one else to throw out there, and he needs to rotate them in to keep his other lines fresh - this team plays best when it's aggressive but that wears down the legs because they're not that fast overall so they have to push it. And PEB and VdV have been solid on the PK given the shaky goaltending behind them, better than some of the people we've thrown out there, MacDonald however . . .

Cousins played the best game I can remember as a Flyer, he's really blossoming playing LW with Couts, I think it's a synergy thing, Couts is physical and defensively responsible, Cousins is niftier offensively.

Luby is a 4th line guy until he develops a lot more polish offensively, like the hustle and speed, but come on, that was a turn around and fire shot that he got lucky on.

Neuvirth wasn't great, but like Mason the night before, he was good enough, and a little lucky (puck hitting the post, puck bouncing over the net).

When the goalies play well, this is a playoff team - however, I'm not going to believe it until March, they've broken our hearts before.

You keep acting like Hakstol only uses the 4th line because he has to, which very obviously isn't the case.



He truly and honestly believes that they're good players who help the team. If he didn't they wouldn't be his 1st PK unit or used at the end of close games.

Giroux, Couturier, Read, Raffl, and Simmonds are all clearly better PKers. He has plenty of alternatives if he was smart enough to use them.

There's also a giant gap between being being forced I play them and the amount of non-provoked praise he gives them. He could very easily be diplomatic and just say a bunch of cliches, but he goes far out of his was to praise them all the time.

But hey, feel free to keep saying this stupid **** over and over, I know you will, but it's still going to be incorrect every single time.

 

[Appleyard]

You don't think Lindblom will need some AHL time adjusting to NA ice? I do think his game would lend itself to NA well though.

He jumped into the AHL last year and was probably the Phantoms best player straight away.

I imagine by the end of camp he is pretty well adjusted.

And he might finish the season in the AHL again... though it depends on how his team do. If they go deep (~semis) doubt he comes to AHL and instead might play for Sweden.

SHL schedule:
Regular season end: March 9th
Play-offs start: ~March 11th
QF over: ~March 28th
SF over: ~April 14th
Final over: ~April 27th

AHL schedule:
Regular season end: April 15th
Play-offs start: ~April 18th
Division semis over: ~April 29th
Division finals over: ~May 14th
Conference finals over: ~May 30th
Final over: ~June 15th

Sweden international schedule:
vs Hungary: April 3rd
vs Austria: April 5th
vs Austria: April 6th
vs Latvia: April 14th
vs Latvia: April 15th
vs Russia: April 27th
vs Czech: April 29th
vs Finald: April 30th
World Champs: May 5th-21st


If Brynäs went out in the QF for example I imagine he comes to North America... plays last few weeks of regular season then play-offs.

But if they went out in SF or Final can simply imagine him joining up with National team, playing EHT maybe (27th-30th April) then World Champs.

 

[deadhead]

Giroux was horrible on the PK last year, near the bottom of the league in goals allowed per 60 minutes.
Simmonds and Couts are used on the PK.

However, PK takes a lot of energy out of forwards, so you have to weigh PK minutes v their ES minutes, and in the case of Simmonds, PP minutes. When you use VdV and PEB on the PK, it doesn't worry you to have them miss an ES shift or two.

 

[Striiker]

Yeah, I'm not worried about those two missing a shift at 5v5... what worries me is those two playing on the PK as much as they do. There's no excuse for them being the top pair. And it shows that Hakstol has a delusional view of their abilities, which was the original point.

 

[BernieParent]

Giroux was horrible on the PK last year, near the bottom of the league in goals allowed per 60 minutes.
Simmonds and Couts are used on the PK.

However, PK takes a lot of energy out of forwards, so you have to weigh PK minutes v their ES minutes, and in the case of Simmonds, PP minutes. When you use VdV and PEB on the PK, it doesn't worry you to have them miss an ES shift or two.

Your point is fair about not burning out Simmonds, or Giroux for that matter, with too much PK time considering that they are on PP1. Couturier would be a lesser concern, being on PP2. That still leaves options, though, such as Read or Lyubimov with Bellemare. It's beyond conceivable that the braintrust see Bellemare and VandeVelde game after game as the PK1 / late-game shutdown forwards and come away satisfied with their own-zone defense.

 

[Curufinwe]

Forget G, he's already playing 19 minutes a night. Read and Lyubimov are the guys who should be PKing more.

 

[Magua]

Okay, Giroux was not "horrible" on the PK. That's just a blatant mistruth. He's a damned good PKer. Giroux's stats last year are going to be skewed because he saw the majority of his time with maybe the worst PKer ever, Ryan White. Look at Laughton's excellent PK stats.....that was who Giroux spent most of the rest of his time with. Years of data say Giroux is an elite PKer.

Also, on the subject, they absolutely have been using Giroux more on the PK since the break. It's not a big role, but Hakstol/Lappy were stubborn about it this year never ever using him. Now he will take the d-zone face-offs on his strong side as a FOGO guy (and of course he wins them), and in long PKs even get a "4th" unit shift or a shift if, say, Coots is in the box. It's the right choice, and it's not like no PK time early yielded any magical increase in 5v5 play and the PK still sucks.

 

[kudymen]

My plan for tonight was to watch the game in the evening. I am 15 seconds in and AMac is there with a horrible turnover already. Clockwork

 

[Rebels57]

On the first shift of the game, MacDonald retrieved a puck in the corner, looked up right a Leaf and passed the puck right onto his stick. He is damn fortunate that didnt result in a goal. Brutal play. The rest of the game he was *fine* by his standards.

I agree with all commending Cousins. He was terrific.

 

[kelmitchell]

Okay, Giroux was not "horrible" on the PK. That's just a blatant mistruth. He's a damned good PKer. Giroux's stats last year are going to be skewed because he saw the majority of his time with maybe the worst PKer ever, Ryan White. Look at Laughton's excellent PK stats.....that was who Giroux spent most of the rest of his time with. Years of data say Giroux is an elite PKer.

Also, on the subject, they absolutely have been using Giroux more on the PK since the break. It's not a big role, but Hakstol/Lappy were stubborn about it this year never ever using him. Now he will take the d-zone face-offs on his strong side as a FOGO guy (and of course he wins them), and in long PKs even get a "4th" unit shift or a shift if, say, Coots is in the box. It's the right choice, and it's not like no PK time early yielded any magical increase in 5v5 play and the PK still sucks.

Deadhead has been pulling **** out of his ass as of late

 

[deadhead]

Okay, Giroux was not "horrible" on the PK. That's just a blatant mistruth. He's a damned good PKer. Giroux's stats last year are going to be skewed because he saw the majority of his time with maybe the worst PKer ever, Ryan White. Look at Laughton's excellent PK stats.....that was who Giroux spent most of the rest of his time with. Years of data say Giroux is an elite PKer.

Also, on the subject, they absolutely have been using Giroux more on the PK since the break. It's not a big role, but Hakstol/Lappy were stubborn about it this year never ever using him. Now he will take the d-zone face-offs on his strong side as a FOGO guy (and of course he wins them), and in long PKs even get a "4th" unit shift or a shift if, say, Coots is in the box. It's the right choice, and it's not like no PK time early yielded any magical increase in 5v5 play and the PK still sucks.

The proper term is "alternative facts." Get with the program.

Giroux's ice time needs to be limited, he's starting to slow down, a tired Giroux is a menace to the neighborhood.

Luby isn't used on the PK for the same reason Konecny wasn't used on the 3x3 until recently, don't want inexperienced players in positions to make mistakes - not that veterans don't make those mistakes, but they've made enough not to dwell on them (well, except Mase, I guess). I suspect Luby will be groomed for that role in the future.

Read I'm not sure why, same with Weise, they have the speed and the skills to be good PKs, but maybe Hakstol is just more comfortable with his boys right now. VdV and PEB are in the middle of the pack leaguewise, and that in front of some shaky goaltending, so it's not like they're a huge liablity (like White).

Which kids are being used on the PK in Allentown, that might provide some clues going forward.

 

[Curufinwe]

On Hockey Central today the analyst said the Leafs were completely outplayed all night long. I thought it was more even than that, but it was interesting to hear a Toronto perspective.

 

[Gert B Frobe]

Forget G, he's already playing 19 minutes a night. Read and Lyubimov are the guys who should be PKing more.

this is good

 

[joez86]

Cousins has always impressed me with his vision. It is no mystery, to me, how he has made it this far, and I think there is still some room for some growth with his game, especially if surrounded by guys with a knack for getting open in high danger areas.

Wish he'd stop missing seemingly every time when leading off in the shootout, though. Minor issue, though, all things considered.

 

[Delete99991]

On the first shift of the game, MacDonald retrieved a puck in the corner, looked up right a Leaf and passed the puck right onto his stick. He is damn fortunate that didnt result in a goal. Brutal play. The rest of the game he was *fine* by his standards.

I agree with all commending Cousins. He was terrific.

Yes, farmer has some bad first shifts. This was one of em.

Couturier was a little better in this one. Giroux was scarily invisible.

Weird to see tight checking hockey from a Leafs team.