GDT: #34 New York Islanders @ New York Rangers | December 22nd | 7 PM | F/5-3 L

DerekKingSnipes

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Feb 20, 2013
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Bailey's game doesn't pair up with the NHL at the moment, so no arguing there. They tried Holmstrom with him and either didn't see a fit, or decided to bring Holmstrom along more slowly. Honestly, I think dropping him down to play with JPG has been good for him. I like how he's coming along.

At the moment, Beau may very well be the best option.
The way lambert talked after game lines will be different tomorrow night.
 
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Strummergas

Regular User
Sep 3, 2006
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Your right, I’m not sure what the hell you are saying!
Why not use whatever hockey wisdom you have and post something constructive instead of using the word Dopey to deflect your hockey ignorance

I calls them as I sees them. And I see it again right here. So you reap what you sew, dopey. Your opinion is dopey, and so are your reading comprehension skills. You're too dopey to even realize the irony of you calling out others for their inability to read. :laugh:

The way lambert talked after game lines will be different tomorrow night.

Gotta try something different. Especially if Cizikas can't go.
 

DerekKingSnipes

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Dumb penalties are a result of a team being outplayed and forced into mistakes.
They weren’t outplayed tonight, they took bad penalties. I don’t disagree overall with what you said but tonight was on them. None of the six penalties that caused them to be short handed where due to being outplayed at that moment or under pressure. It was stick fouls, stupid cross check by mayfield and a two delay of game penalties that were not forced errors.
 
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LAIslanderFan

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Nov 18, 2010
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They weren’t outplayed tonight, they took bad penalties. I don’t disagree overall with what you said but tonight was on them. None of the six penalties that caused them to be short handed where due to being outplayed at that moment or under pressure. It was stick fouls, stupid cross check by mayfield and a two delay of game penalties that were not forced errors.
I would respectively disagree. Especially the delay of game penalties. They were being overwhelmed and frustrated and they needlessly rushed clearing the puck, that's when those things happen. I really didn't have a problem with the way the game was called.
 

DerekKingSnipes

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I would respectively disagree. Especially the delay of game penalties. They were being overwhelmed and frustrated and they needlessly rushed clearing the puck, that's when those things happen. I really didn't have a problem with the way the game was called.
They took the penalties, refs weren’t too blame. they weren’t outplayed overall tonight, rangers played that first home game after long trip which usually isn’t great and we kinda were in same boat off our western trip. There is so much parity if Nelson shot goes in or Pageau right after it’s probably a different story and feeling. Every night is like this and they will stay in this and even get in but there will need to be upgrade made on wings in top six to get this team to contend seriously.
 

Throttle

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Sep 22, 2020
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How’s the Barzal fan club tonight? 1G, 1GW due to lackadaisical play on the boards (hint…he was looking to skate…) and 1EN due to another lackadaisical play on the boards.

Don’t worry folks, he just needs a winger. Uh-huh.
 
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LAIslanderFan

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Nov 18, 2010
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The way lambert talked after game lines will be different tomorrow night.
Barzal could indeed stand to have better linemates. However, a lot of the criticism thrown his way is over self-inflicted wounds; his reluctance to shoot, his reluctance to drive the net, his over-handling the puck in some instances, and his wishful thinking passing at times. And to me, those are all fair game. Perhaps he wouldn't feel obligated to do everything himself if he had better linemates (if that is indeed why he makes some of the decisions he does), but those are still choices he's made.

Lee was never a great skater. But it's rarely a detriment to his team. He's been successful in this League despite that. I'm not sure what your getting at with the "playing in all three zones" statement. I don't believe Anders Lee has ever been a defensive liability. Has he slowed a bit more than he already was? It appears that he might have. Will he be an anchor by the end of this contract? Maybe. But he's pretty far down on the list on problems this team has, both overall and certainly tonight. So I stand by my statement that your post was bizarre tonight, considering that there were WAY more obvious culprits who could've been the subject of a rant. It stunk of personal vendetta.

I don't really get into the trade value of players, probably because they're relative to so many factors at the time a trade is actually made. So maybe you're right about that he would only go for a 3rd rounder, but don't be terribly surprised when a team gives up more than that under a particular set of circumstances.
Please do me a favor. Over the next few game, really focus in Lee handling the puck in the neutral zone, behind the net or in the defensive zone. I think it will become evident what is frustrating me the most about him.

I'm also aware of his size and strength, yet when he lays a check it has very little impact. It's kind of a nudge or push. I would probably be less critical of him if he was more physical. Maybe one aspect of his game is lacking because of age, but I would like him to be more physical and rely a little more on his size.
I'm just not seeing it.

I haven't missed an Isles game this season, so I'm not making that assessment from one game. I did catch the Isles in person in Arizona and I'm going tomorrow night against FLA (first time at UBS).
 

DerekKingSnipes

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Please do me a favor. Over the next few game, really focus in Lee handling the puck in the neutral zone, behind the net or in the defensive zone. I think it will become evident what is frustrating me the most about him.

I'm also aware of his size and strength, yet when he lays a check it has very little impact. It's kind of a nudge or push. I would probably be less critical of him if he was more physical. Maybe one aspect of his game is lacking because of age, but I would like him to be more physical and rely a little more on his size.
I'm just not seeing it.

I haven't missed an Isles game this season, so I'm not making that assessment from one game. I did catch the Isles in person in Arizona and I'm going tomorrow night against FLA (first time at UBS).
Lee isn’t fast and isn’t guy you want handling puck but that’s why he fits with Nelson I think, he is also really good in front of net on PP but we don’t shoot puck enough. He is also very good captain which counts for something I think. We need to upgrade Bailey and Beau, Lee is fine I think for now.
 
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Lights911

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Dec 5, 2017
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How’s the Barzal fan club tonight? 1G, 1GW due to lackadaisical play on the boards (hint…he was looking to skate…) and 1EN due to another lackadaisical play on the boards.

Don’t worry folks, he just needs a winger. Uh-huh.
Is every loss Barzal’s fault? Does the general manager ever take any blame in the below average roster configuration?
 

LAIslanderFan

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Lee isn’t fast and isn’t guy you want handling puck but that’s why he fits with Nelson I think, he is also really good in front of net on PP but we don’t shoot puck enough. He is also very good captain which counts for something I think. We need to upgrade Bailey and Beau, Lee is fine I think for now.
Agreed he's good in from of the net, but that's his limit. One of the most important statics in hockey is time of possession and puck control, that's where Lee is the most detrimental. The less time you have puck possession, the less likely you are to score a goal. That's a stat that's hard to measure but it's so, so important. If a player could have a stat line for that, Lee would more then likely have the worst numbers on the team. Lee quite simply turns the puck over. It's like having 4 player on the ice instead of 5.
 

DerekKingSnipes

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Agreed he's good in from of the net, but that's his limit. One of the most important statics in hockey is time of possession and puck control, that's where Lee is the most detrimental. The less time you have puck possession, the less likely you are to score a goal. That's a stat that's hard to measure but it's so, so important. If a player could have a stat line for that, Lee would more then likely have the worst numbers on the team. Lee quite simply turns the puck over. It's like having 4 player on the ice instead of 5.
Offensive zone he’s good along boards, he really is fine I think as second liner who captains the team. The two bigger issues are Beau not developing and Bailey seemingly aging out of league. They miss Palmieri just overall lengthening the lineup and Pelech missing more and more time is exposing defense depth. I do think a few moves though could change direction for this year.
 

BelovedIsles

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Oct 22, 2005
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Unfortunately the Islanders aren't an average team, there what I like to refer to as a "nice team".
They'll win their share of games, beat good teams, lose to bad team, borderline playoff team. They might sneak in, based on the play of other teams around them, they might just miss the playoffs. The problem with "nice teams" is that, although they're competitive and they give fans some fun moments, they end up drafting somewhere around 12-16 every year, so they never really become a real serious top tier team.

IMO, the Islanders really need to be sellers this year at the trade deadline. They have the worst prospect pool in the NHL and they're not getting any younger. The Isles need to have a few drafts where they have early 1st round picks. The current team past their expiration date last year, arguably the year before.

The Isles need a rebuild. There's no question in my mind. This is a stale team.

I have to be mindful of the adjectives I use for this team :sarcasm:. They are an average team, but semantics. A few factors. They don't have enough talent, nor depth to offset injuries. Losing Pelech, their best D man, can be a death sentence to this kind of team. Nor do they have enough talent to take 'nights off.' Talented teams can get away with playing at 75%, this team cannot. As a result, they need to play at 100% every night (just using the catch phrase b/c it's easier). That's not realistic, and it wears a team down. Furthermore, their system does not accentuate the kind of team they have; Trotz' system maximized limited talent.

I've had this conversation with other posters. With Sorokin, Barzal, Pelech all in their primes, I'm not sure a rebuild is the best route. You have a franchise goalie, rare as they come, you maximize that opportunity. To sell Sorokin off would be a mistake, IMHO. Then you have to find another franchise goalie that may not be as good. He's a rare breed. Is he willing to resign with a rebuilding club, at what, 29?

Yes, they are in perpetual mediocrity, as currently constructed. There's a lot of restructuring to be done from now until the offseason. I suppose if they can't find a way to bring in better talented players who will help now and down the road, then perhaps a quick rebuild around Sorokin is the way to go. I just wouldn't want to lose him. A franchise goalie is the hardest to find, and he's Vezina material.

My last point about rebuilds is that they aren't fail safe, whatsoever. Yeah, they can draft in the top-5 a few years consecutively, but those picks could develop into Reinharts, MDCs, Stromes, Daigles, Lafs etc. Many variables have to come together for a rebuild to be truly successful. In actuality, the best teams draft well with lottery picks and late rounders (see the Pens and Tampa). So that means the right drafting/development team needs to be in place. Does NYI currently have that? I think not.

To your last point. Speaking of adjectives, yes, this is a very stale team. I love this team through thick and thin, they have brought out emotions since the early 90's, but man, they look stale. Now, if they looked stale and were winning, I'll take that.
 

MJF

Fire Lou
Sep 6, 2003
27,749
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NYC
When he's on the 3rd line or being scratched and other free agents using his salary in negotiations you will.


He wasn't the only problem, true, but he was the most glaring.
Really? I thought Salo, Mayfield, and Aho were the most glaring problems. Lee wasn’t even on my radar.

The way lambert talked after game lines will be different tomorrow night.
Johnston draws in? Otherwise Lambert’s just rearranging the furniture.
 
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Throttle

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Sep 22, 2020
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Is every loss Barzal’s fault? Does the general manager ever take any blame in the below average roster configuration?
Was Barzal involved in the okays that led to the GWG and EN? Asking for a friend…

Was Barzal involved in the plays where he was 10’ in front of the net and didn’t shoot?
 
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WangMustGo

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Mar 31, 2008
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Long Island
Was Barzal involved in the okays that led to the GWG and EN? Asking for a friend…

Was involved in the plays where he was 10’ in front of the net?

Without Barzal they score 1 goal tonight. Sure he made a bad play on a bouncing puck, and a poor pass that led to an empty net goal. I dont see you ever saying anything when he is scoring or making plays.

The primary reason they lost tonight is because they couldnt stay out of the box, and they put 18 shots on net. Lou has put together ab absolutely abysmal offense that is surrounded by a defense that falls apart the second Pelech gets hurt.

Sorokin has been completely average lately and as a result the isles are falling in the standings.
 

Lights911

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Dec 5, 2017
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Long Island
Was Barzal involved in the okays that led to the GWG and EN? Asking for a friend…

Was Barzal involved in the plays where he was 10’ in front of the net and didn’t shoot?
Does the general manager ever take any blame in the below average roster configuration?
 

CupHolders

Really Fries My Bananas!
Aug 8, 2006
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How’s the Barzal fan club tonight? 1G, 1GW due to lackadaisical play on the boards (hint…he was looking to skate…) and 1EN due to another lackadaisical play on the boards.

Don’t worry folks, he just needs a winger. Uh-huh.

That secret cabal of Barzal Illuminati doesn’t have me fooled!

thumbs-up-conspiracy.gif
 

CupHolders

Really Fries My Bananas!
Aug 8, 2006
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5,909
I hate that none of the forwards lower the shoulder and drive towards the net, they all just curl away. Fasching scored by dropping the shoulder and there would be a lot more opportunities if guys did it with regularity.
Other than Palmieri, very few players with the size, balance and skating combo to do it consistently effective.

But that isn’t an excuse for them NOT doing it more often as a collective.

Players like Barzal and Beau are not always going to be overmatched by defenders that they can’t get away with attempting it more often. Not like they’re facing Chris Pronger every night.
 
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