Salary Cap: '24-'25 Salary Thread: Crosbicles Volume MMXXVI: Sid is Still Goat

[Coastal Kev]

Pens have the 2nd worst record in the conference, but the Sabres have 4 games in hand...this team may end up dead last in the eastern conference. This is a team in a rebuild; the front office just doesn't want to admit it.

But let's not trade our assets when they're at a highpoint.... nope, let's wait until they breakdown, have almost no value and then pay someone to take them off of our hands.

It's the Penguin way

 

[eXile3]

I cannot think of a team I'd rather be less than the Blackhawks right now.

It's a mess outside of Bedard and Bedard isn't as good as he was projected to be.

He’s 19 years old and playing on a bad team. He will be good. He was never going to Crosby McDavid good.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

If a deal with a 1st + is offered then yes I will most likely be upset with Dubas for not taking the moment. I suppose I'd say no if the cap dump was bad I'd expect more then.

It's kind of like the Blues with Schenn
Only moving him if price is met.

Eh, cap doesn't matter anymore aside from taking back bad deals in exchange for draft capital and/or prospects.

If some team offers a 1st+decent prospect/young player, even if the Pens have to take a cap dump back to make it work, I'm taking that.

 

[Andy99]

Trading Rakell for a good return, and good drafting and development, is where Dubas will earn his stripes if he can…

Freidman on NHL radio early this am….Says price for Rakell is very high. Winnipeg is interested but he speculates if they are on Rakell's no trade list. He also said the Pens want to keep some veterans around. He basically hedged. We would move him if we get our price….

That’s bs…he should be going for Lambert from Wpg, Conner Geekie from Tampa, Clarke/Greentree from LA, Casper from Detroit…

Come on, Dubas…

 

[Empoleon8771]

He’s 19 years old and playing on a bad team. He will be good. He was never going to Crosby McDavid good.

Yeah I don't mean that as in Bedard is bad, he's just a good player on a team that has literally nothing else.

 

[IcedCapp]

I have no clue what is said behind closed doors. I don't know what Dubas says to his staff or to Sid. I have no clue what their internal conversations are like. All I do know is, this team was in 8th place like a week before the 4 nations. There were no moves to solidify/improve that position. When they started to drop like a stone, there were no panic moves to fix the situation.

The Penguins are not trying to compete this year. They are making no moves that suggest they believe they can compete in the near future.

NOW, does that mean they won't get a ton of assets and cap space in the next two days and then turn around in the summer and try to turn those assets and cap space into a contender? Nope. And I guess I wouldn't be shocked if that happened. But even in that scenario, I would be shocked if we turned those assets and that cap space into a bunch of 30-year old players.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Casper from Detroit…

lol no shot

Dubas would be running to the phone to call that in if it was even on the table

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

Nothing with how they've operated since the Guentzel trade suggests that is their plan.

They're "rebuilding" without officially saying it.

Except all their actions.

They signed Crosby through 28.
Havent moved anyone with term.
Reports theyre dangling the 1st they got for Petersson for a young nhl ready player
Prospect trade for a “more ready” McGroaty
Reports theyre focused on nhl ready or near ready prospects in trade returns.


Yeah sure seems like a full gut and rebuild for 2030.

 

[cookthebooks]

'reports' doing an awful lot of work there

 

[Empoleon8771]

Except all their actions.

They signed Crosby through 28.
Havent moved anyone with term.
Reports theyre dangling the 1st they got for Petersson for a young nhl ready player
Prospect trade for a “more ready” McGroaty
Reports theyre focused on nhl ready or near ready prospects in trade returns.


Yeah sure seems like a full gut and rebuild for 2030.

How are reports "actions"?

The actual actions they've done:

-Traded Guentzel for prospects and picks
-Acquired Hayes and Glass and got paid picks to acquire him
-Traded Smith for picks
-Traded Pettersson and O'Connor for picks and prospects

Every one of their actual moves suggests this team is rebuilding. Trying to diminish that because of "reports" from guys like Friedman is silly.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Sell everyone.

Play Geno with Sid and Rust for the rest of the year to pump his stats and call up the kids. Get a top 4-5 pick.

Trade Rust and EK in the summer and get some 1-2 year FAs to flip at the '26 deadline.

Trade everyone next TDL, get a top 2-3 pick.

Trade TJ after paying his bonus in '26.

Go ape-shit in '26 FA.

Win the 2028 Cup and Sid and Tang retire.

 

[Sideline]

I think the other thing to consider with trading Rakell is that you can replace Rakell with someone else you can trade later. If you trade Rakell for Moore and a 1st, you then have Moore to play with Crosby for a year or two, put up a 50-60 point season and then you can likely trade him for a 2nd+ as well. If you just hold onto Rakell, you're just going to get what you trade Rakell for.

The same logic applies to signing a UFA. Trading Rakell and replacing him either in that trade or via UFA with someone else you will trade later is the best way to accrue assets.

My ideal scenario is Rakell for cheap futures and then dropping a 1 year ~10MM deal on someone like Marchand to keep Sid happy until the Olympics. Then you sell Marchand at the deadline with double retention and get more picks there.

 

[cookthebooks]

we think our reporters are the dumbest people on earth but then we also think reports show how dumb our dumb glasses wearing nerd gm is

 

[Empoleon8771]

The reason this won't be a full blown tear it down rebuild (like Dubas has said multiple times he doesn't want to do) is because they won't be trading Crosby or Malkin. If this was a complete nuking of the team, those guys would be traded to. However, pretty much every other player on the roster is available for futures. That's a "rebuild" even if Dubas doesn't come out and explicitly call it a rebuild.

They may be targeting more of a quick rebuild with focusing on prospects and trying to be competitive quicker, but it's still a rebuild. Chicago is doing the long drawn out rebuild of building through the draft, Dubas is trying to do a rebuild of acquiring prospects and filling holes with young players via trades and UFA.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

He’s 19 years old and playing on a bad team. He will be good. He was never going to Crosby McDavid good.

I said he looks small and may struggle his first few years adjusting v men.

McDavid came in looking 25. Crosby has his legs.

Trading Rakell for a good return, and good drafting and development, is where Dubas will earn his stripes if he can…

Freidman on NHL radio early this am….Says price for Rakell is very high. Winnipeg is interested but he speculates if they are on Rakell's no trade list. He also said the Pens want to keep some veterans around. He basically hedged. We would move him if we get our price….

That’s bs…he should be going for Lambert from Wpg, Conner Geekie from Tampa, Clarke/Greentree from LA, Casper from Detroit…

Come on, Dubas…

Well if he's on his NTC you can only ask him to waive.
Honestly think GMs and Owners need to crack down on the amount of NTCs and NMCs given to players. It's not just a Pittsburgh issue it's a league wide issue.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

How are reports "actions"?

The actual actions they've done:

-Traded Guentzel for prospects and picks
-Acquired Hayes and Glass and got paid picks to acquire him
-Traded Smith for picks
-Traded Pettersson and O'Connor for picks and prospects

Every one of their actual moves suggests this team is rebuilding. Trying to diminish that because of "reports" from guys like Friedman is silly.

1. They are reports of their action. From well sourced national reporters like Friedman. Not a hard concept to understand.

2. All pending FAs or a guy who wanted out. Not to mention it irrelevant to the point your ignoring.

Everything theyve done or not done in some cases points to trying to rebuild on the fly on an accelerated timeline rather than tearing down to the studs.

Trading pending UFAs doest nothing to refute that. If anything the Geuntzel return is evidence of it and shoppinf the 1st from the petersson trade does as well.

I do not particularly care if you do or do not believe that.

 

[Empoleon8771]

1. They are reports of their action. From well sourced national reporters like Friedman. Not a hard concept to understand.

2. All pending FAs or a guy who wanted out. Not to mention it irrelevant to the point your ignoring.

Everything theyve done or not done in some cases points to trying to rebuild on the fly on an accelerated timeline rather than tearing down to the studs.

Trading pending UFAs doest nothing to refute that. If anything the Geuntzel return is evidence of it and shoppinf the 1st from the petersson trade does as well.

I do not particularly care if you do or do not believe that.

You're also completely cherrypicking reports that fit your narrative and ignoring the ones that don't. What about the reports that say that Dubas wants to move on from Karlsson and Letang? What about the reports that anyone not named Crosby, Malkin or Rust are available for trade for futures?

A "rebuild on the fly" is still a rebuild. Just because they're not nuking the entire team doesn't mean they're not rebuilding. Just because they're not trading Crosby and Malkin doesn't mean they're not rebuilding.

 

[IcedCapp]

if you refer to GMs as dorks, sleepy, old man, etc... you have the IQ of a gnat and you don't deserve any interactions (and you won't be getting them from me). Stop wasting billions of years of evolution and grow a f***ing brain

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Im listening to yesterday's Overdrive and they're talking about the Jets buying and mentioned that if they wanted Rak the Pens would ask for Perfetti. That would fit into Dubi's plan of getting younger.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

The reason this won't be a full blown tear it down rebuild (like Dubas has said multiple times he doesn't want to do) is because they won't be trading Crosby or Malkin. If this was a complete nuking of the team, those guys would be traded to. However, pretty much every other player on the roster is available for futures. That's a "rebuild" even if Dubas doesn't come out and explicitly call it a rebuild.

They may be targeting more of a quick rebuild with focusing on prospects and trying to be competitive quicker, but it's still a rebuild. Chicago is doing the long drawn out rebuild of building through the draft, Dubas is trying to do a rebuild of acquiring prospects and filling holes with young players via trades and UFA.

And here a post (right after arguing with me) completely agreeing with what i said. Imagine being so hung up on the term “rebuild” that you can literally argue yourself in a circle.

 

[Empoleon8771]

And here a post (right after arguing with me) completely agreeing with what i said. Imagine being so hung up on the term “rebuild” that you can literally argue yourself in a circle.

Your saying their plan is that they will be competitive before Rakell's contract is done. Nothing Dubas has done so far suggests that is the case.

The point I was arguing against in your original post is that the team is planning on being competitive before Rakell's deal is done. They are doing a "rebuild on the fly", but that's still a rebuild that will take far longer than 3 years to make a competitive team again. Nothing that this team has done has suggested they are planning on being competitive again within 2-3 years, and beyond that is after Rakell's deal is done.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I think the hurdle with any Rakell-Winnipeg deal is that Rakell likely has Winnipeg on his no trade list, and while they look like a really strong team, I dunno if the guy wants to lock into three more years in Winnipeg for a playoff run this season.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

You're also completely cherrypicking reports that fit your narrative and ignoring the ones that don't. What about the reports that say that Dubas wants to move on from Karlsson and Letang? What about the reports that anyone not named Crosby, Malkin or Rust are available for trade for futures?

A "rebuild on the fly" is still a rebuild. Just because they're not nuking the entire team doesn't mean they're not rebuilding. Just because they're not trading Crosby and Malkin doesn't mean they're not rebuilding.

And again your arguing yourself in a circle over the semantics of the term “rebuild”

Answer this question as directly as possible please.

Q: What year, based on their current actions, do the Penguins want to start being competitive?

Simple question

 

[Empoleon8771]

And again your arguing yourself in a circle over the semantics of the term “rebuild”

Answer this question as directly as possible please.

Q: What year, based on their current actions, do the Penguins want to start being competitive?

Simple question

Beyond when Rakell is still on the Penguins.

If this team was trying to be competitive within 2-3 years, they wouldn't have spent all of last off-season signing 1 year deals and taking on bad deals for money. They wouldn't have traded Guentzel or Pettersson (especially Pettersson, who wanted to stay with the Penguins) for futures. They wouldn't be talking about trading Rakell right now or Karlsson in the off-season, where it seems basically guaranteed that Karlsson will be shipped out.

 

[Andy99]

I think the hurdle with any Rakell-Winnipeg deal is that Rakell likely has Winnipeg on his no trade list, and while they look like a really strong team, I dunno if the guy wants to lock into three more years in Winnipeg for a playoff run this season.

They also need a second line center more…I could see them having interest in Brock Nelson or Schenn first if they’re available