2025 NHL Draft: Lose a ton for Porter Martone

[Hodge]

Welp Id suggest you watch a devils games then. Not gonna argue with someone that’s clearly never seen Jack Hughes play apart from maybe his rookie year.

Pure projection. If you had followed the Devils at all this past season you would know that Hughes was used almost exclusively on the wing, especially in the second half of the season, with Haula centering him. Not only is Hughes incapable of fulfilling the defensive zone responsibilities of a center, he is literally too physically weak to take faceoffs. 35.7% in the dot for his career.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Welp Id suggest you watch a devils games then. Not gonna argue with someone that’s clearly never seen Jack Hughes play apart from maybe his rookie year.

Hughes literally played wing for half of last season...

 

[gaucholoco3]

Bedard is absolutely a C. Laughable you think otherwise. If guys like Jack Hughes are Cs then so is Bedard

They both can play C and be successful scoring a lot of points. My take is the neither Bedard or Hughes are able to be the best C on their team. I would say the same for Will Smith and possibly even Matthews. This archetype can not be the best C on a team that will win the cup. Each team needs a C that can influence the game on both sides of the ice. Hughes has Nico so he can be a scoring 2nd line C allowing Nico to eat up all the hard matchups.

Bedard and Hagens down the middle will not win a cup.

This is why Celebrini is the perfect 1C to build around.

 

[Shark in Hockeytown]

Jack Hughes is also not a center. Hagens probably won't be either. How many legit 5'10 centers have there ever been?

Uhhh,...Marcel Dionne? Igor Larionov? More Hall of Fame centers are 5'11' too.

 

[matt trick]

It's an interesting discussion. Let's say for the sake of discussion:

Player	95% Potential	80% potential	70% potential	Bust Potential
Hagens	Hughes	Point	Larkin	5%
Martone	M. Tkachuk	Landeskog	Meier	10%
Schaefer	Heiskanen	Hanafin	Ekblad	25%
Frondell/Rybakin	Kadri	Granlund	Stephenson	30%

On the one hand, I'd probably first pick Heiskanen then Tkachuk to our team due to needs, on the other hand, I do think Hughes is the best player and will have the best career. I also think defenseman are just straight up harder to project then elite forwards.

Another year will make things more clear. I trust Grier and the staff to get it right, but this is shaping up to be quite a fascinating draft year already, and I anticipate we'll be bottom three at the end of it.

 

[Hodge]

It's an interesting discussion. Let's say for the sake of discussion:

Player	95% Potential	80% potential	70% potential	Bust Potential
Hagens	Hughes	Point	Larkin	5%
Martone	M. Tkachuk	Landeskog	Meier	10%
Schaefer	Heiskanen	Hanafin	Ekblad	25%
Frondell/Rybakin	Kadri	Granlund	Stephenson	30%

On the one hand, I'd probably first pick Heiskanen then Tkachuk to our team due to needs, on the other hand, I do think Hughes is the best player and will have the best career. I also think defenseman are just straight up harder to project then elite forwards.

Another year will make things more clear. I trust Grier and the staff to get it right, but this is shaping up to be quite a fascinating draft year already, and I anticipate we'll be bottom three at the end of it.

You think Jack Hughes is a more valuable player than Matthew Tkachuk and Miro Heiskanen?

Based on your projections I would definitely take Schaefer, then Martone, before even considering Hagens. We'll see how it plays out this year.

 

[Stewie Griffin]

As nice as getting Hagens would be...we need a Martone or Schaefer 100% more. If we finish dead last again we're guaranteed one of them.

 

[coooldude]

It's an interesting discussion. Let's say for the sake of discussion:

Player	95% Potential	80% potential	70% potential	Bust Potential
Hagens	Hughes	Point	Larkin	5%
Martone	M. Tkachuk	Landeskog	Meier	10%
Schaefer	Heiskanen	Hanafin	Ekblad	25%
Frondell/Rybakin	Kadri	Granlund	Stephenson	30%

On the one hand, I'd probably first pick Heiskanen then Tkachuk to our team due to needs, on the other hand, I do think Hughes is the best player and will have the best career. I also think defenseman are just straight up harder to project then elite forwards.

Another year will make things more clear. I trust Grier and the staff to get it right, but this is shaping up to be quite a fascinating draft year already, and I anticipate we'll be bottom three at the end of it.

I think Martone plays more like a Rantanen (95% potential, by which I mean this is basically his ceiling) -- he's big, he's not a body banger though, and he's creative offensively and responsible defensively, at least from my limited watching. So, different than Tkachuk and Meier as a style comp.

There's a whole year to see whether Hagens solidifies his 1OA or if there's a 2-3 player tier at the top. Right now I think it's three All-star potential players (Hagens, Martone, Schaefer) and then the next tier might only be Ryabkin (top of lineup) before a bunch of top/mid lineup options. Again, huge amount of time left.

If the draft were today and we had 1OA, I think you still might have to go with Hagens. If they were all similar potential/performance prospects, we need Schaefer-types first then Martone-types before Hagens-types.

FWIW I put together a Sharks-centric watch list for our likely 3 top-35 picks. Mostly I'm focusing on D except for F names that might really pop or are in the top 5 currently. These are tiered, but not ranked. There might be players that will go top 10-15 that I'm just not tracking here. I barely knew anything about Jett Luchanko last year, for example, because he simply wasn't going to be a likely target for any of our picks.

1 - Generational/clear franchise
2 - All-star/possible franchise
3 - Top of lineup
4 - Bubble top of lineup / mid lineup
5 - Mid-lineup
6 - Bubble-mid

Feedback welcome!

 

[Gecklund]

Hughes literally played wing for half of last season...

But he didn’t. His most common linemates were Bratt, Toffoli. Neither are Cs. Unless you’re talking about Haula that played on the LW to help with faceoffs.

 

[Hodge]

But he didn’t. His most common linemates were Bratt, Toffoli. Neither are Cs. Unless you’re talking about Haula that played on the LW to help with faceoffs.

Hughes played LW. Haula was the center.

 

[Patty Ice]

Jack Hughes is also not a center. Hagens probably won't be either. How many legit 5'10 centers have there ever been?

Doug Gilmour and Pat Lafontaine just off the top of my head. The 90s were littered with them.

Joe Sakic and Steve Yzerman if you grant me +/- an inch.

 

[Juxtaposer]

But he didn’t. His most common linemates were Bratt, Toffoli. Neither are Cs. Unless you’re talking about Haula that played on the LW to help with faceoffs.

Aside from the fact that you can ask any Devils fan to confirm, there's this:

https://x.com/i/web/status/1777103420282769593

 

[Lebanezer]

Aside from the fact that you can ask any Devils fan to confirm, there's this:

https://x.com/i/web/status/1777103420282769593

Hughes injured his shoulder early in the season so it’s not surprising he was shifted over to wing for most of the season. I’m not saying he’ll be a center long term, just that he was hurt.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Hughes injured his shoulder early in the season so it’s not surprising he was shifted over to wing for most of the season. I’m not saying he’ll be a center long term, just that he was hurt.

Sure, but I was responding to the claim that Gecklund was making that Hughes has never played wing. Easy debunk.

But the overarching point is that Jack Hughes is always hurt because he doesn't have the physicality to be a center. It's not just because he's 5'10" and poor defensively, he is also just really slight.

I have more faith in Hagens and Smith to be centers than I do Hughes because Hagens is pretty good defensively and Smith has NHL center size. Additionally, either of those guys are waterbug puck carriers like Hughes. They're more system players than individual skill players.

 

[gaucholoco3]

Doug Gilmour and Pat Lafontaine just off the top of my head. The 90s were littered with them.

Joe Sakic and Steve Yzerman if you grant me +/- an inch.

The game is a lot different than it was in the 90’s. There just aren’t many sub 5’11” centers that are more than just scoring wings who play center.

 

[sharski]

both smith and celebrini were officially measured as 5'11.75" tall at their combines so the sharks are still looking for their top 2 centers but are VERY deep at wing right now

 

[Patty Ice]

The game is a lot different than it was in the 90’s. There just aren’t many sub 5’11” centers that are more than just scoring wings who play center.

Did he not say "have there EVER been"?

 

[Celly4Celebrini]

Or we keep Hagens (assuming he's BPA and we pick 1st, of course) and have three top-notch forwards on cheap/cheapish deals for a good time.

I can't see any reason to ever trade down from #1 unless you can get something like #2 and #3-5.

Trying to avoid becoming Toronto 2.0. ~4 high end forwards (including Eklund here) with 0 high end D. Looks great in the regular season. Not so much come playoff time.

I think if you can get a team to overpay for 1 you do it. it isnt like Hagens is a McDavid/MacK/Bedard level guy in which case id see your arguement. Id rather have 2-3 shots at the top d-men (3, 10, 20). If say Philly has 3 and 18, id see if we can swing a move up to 10 with excess 2nds similar to the Buffalo deal along with 18.

 

[matt trick]

You think Jack Hughes is a more valuable player than Matthew Tkachuk and Miro Heiskanen?

Based on your projections I would definitely take Schaefer, then Martone, before even considering Hagens. We'll see how it plays out this year.

Somewhat stylistic examples without a whole lot of thought, I'd be surprised if any of the three end up as good as the contemporary examples. As far as Hughes goes, I imagine he'll move to full time center eventually, and as he is 2-3 years younger, I think he'll end up being better. I do think he'll be better. Probably should have done lesser players then the league's best power forward and a top 5-8 d-man. But like I said, didn't invest enough time in thinking about the best examples.

 

[DG93]

Trying to avoid becoming Toronto 2.0. ~4 high end forwards (including Eklund here) with 0 high end D. Looks great in the regular season. Not so much come playoff time.

I think if you can get a team to overpay for 1 you do it. it isnt like Hagens is a McDavid/MacK/Bedard level guy in which case id see your arguement. Id rather have 2-3 shots at the top d-men (3, 10, 20). If say Philly has 3 and 18, id see if we can swing a move up to 10 with excess 2nds similar to the Buffalo deal along with 18.

You take BPA and figure it out later imo. You can always trade from a position of strength and acquire defensemen via trade too. Having Hagens, Smith, and Celebrini would be insane. Toronto's mistake was spending 18M a year on Rielly and Tavares on top of having their big 3 of Nylander, Marner, and Matthews.

 

[gaucholoco3]

You take BPA and figure it out later imo. You can always trade from a position of strength and acquire defensemen via trade too. Having Hagens, Smith, and Celebrini would be insane. Toronto's mistake was spending 18M a year on Rielly and Tavares on top of having their big 3 of Nylander, Marner, and Matthews.

The 1st overall pick will have more value before the draft than at any other time. If done days or weeks before the draft the team trading for the first overall would get a huge marketing boost. Also players aren’t traded immediately after they are drafted. If the Sharks win the lottery and Hagens is the consensus #1 but Smith and Celebrini look legit then it would benefit the Sharks to trade back to get a ransom. Trade back to 3 and get a late first in 25 and then possibly a protected 1st in 26.

Just because Hagens is the BPA doesn’t mean it’s not in the Sharks best interest to trade back.

 

[sharski]

even if if there's no consensus #1 I feel like you just gotta bask in it while you can and not overthink it

16 birds in the clip is worth one in the hole

 

[coooldude]

Two new D names on the watchlist per German Spitfire-
- Kurban Limatov - LD, 6'4" 187, Russian '07, "Size, mobility, defensive fundamentals, some offensive creativity also, will go 1st round and could go top 10"
- Carlos Handel - RD, 6'1" 168, playing in Swedish J20, "was a wagon for GER at the Hlinka, two way game, strong skater"

 

[landshark]

Two new D names on the watchlist per German Spitfire-
- Kurban Limatov - LD, 6'4" 187, Russian '07, "Size, mobility, defensive fundamentals, some offensive creativity also, will go 1st round and could go top 10"
- Carlos Handel - RD, 6'1" 168, playing in Swedish J20, "was a wagon for GER at the Hlinka, two way game, strong skater"

Somebody feed those guys, FFS!!!

 

[matt trick]

Our defense is a wafer, bring in Matthew Schaefer!