Blue Jays GDT: 2024 v4 |Mon, Jun 17 | vs BOS | 7pm ET/4pm PT | Pivetta vs Kikuchi

[The Nemesis]

Why did they pull Bassitt so early? His pitch count was at 87. Also, Why the F is Vagelbach hitting 5th with his 160 average. Insanity with this team.

I thought I heard speculation that maybe he was dealing with some sort of discomfort (I've had the game on in the background while I worked so I didn't see anything). In his last start he was putting cream or something on his neck as he was coming out of the game so I think Dan and Joe might've been questioning if he's still got something in there bugging him a bit and they took him out because it had flared up again.

 

[phillipmike]

Why did they pull Bassitt so early? His pitch count was at 87. Also, Why the F is Vagelbach hitting 5th with his 160 average. Insanity with this team.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1795199047059276226

 

[canucksfan]

I like using wRC+ to evaluate hitters. OPS is a good one as well.

A guy like Varsho has a bad average but he walks a lot and his power is really good. I would take Varsho's wRC of 117 any day because his defense is elite.

 

[HockeyThoughts]

You think .299 is generational?



Predictive stats eventually become .... ?



Starting to think the bar you set for generational talent is pretty low. Shoei is what in your opinion?

Why does he have to be a "generational" player to be deemed valuable? He's a star 1B and a key cog in our machine.

All the stats (which have been shared with you already) tell the same story.

 

[Hellcat]

Why does he have to be a "generational" player to be deemed valuable? He's a star 1B and a key cog in our machine.

All the stats (which have been shared with you already) tell the same story.

If you READ the previous posts, the question was asked why are people disappointed with Vladdy I think it is because he was marketed as a generational talent, he has not live up to the hype, he had one great year.

 

[PanniniClaus]

If you READ the previous posts, the question was asked why are people disappointed with Vladdy I think it is because he was marketed as a generational talent, he has not live up to the hype, he had one great year.

Agreed - this is why there is disappointment. His next contract will be interesting.

 

[Hellcat]

Vladdy is 4th in hard hit% behind Judge, Soto, and Ohtani? Three generational hitters?

You yourself agree that predictive stats eventually become…?

Jesus, when you clearly lose a debate do you always devolve it into this sort of discussion? Lemme try it .... Varsho is 99th percentile for Range, must mean he is a good goalie in the NHL....

Predictive stats...nothing more

Sometimes predictive stats work. Sometimes they don't.

Danny's xStats aren't great despite his actual stats. Vladdy's xStats far outpace his actual production.

Bigger the sample size across multiple metrics means it is more likely or less likely to be eventually become true?

 

[Bjindaho]

Jesus, when you clearly lose a debate do you always devolve it into this sort of discussion? Lemme try it .... Varsho is 99th percentile for Range, must mean he is a good goalie in the NHL....



Bigger the sample size across multiple metrics means it is more likely or less likely to be eventually become true?

That's not how predictive stats work

Over time, actual stats paint a picture. The way Varsho is succeeding is greater than his predictive stats for the same reason Danny's success is and Semien's is.

 

[trellaine201]

Agreed - this is why there is disappointment. His next contract will be interesting.

Someone will pay. Owners can’t help themselves.

 

[MK78]

Someone will pay. Owners can’t help themselves.

I dunno, this year was certainly different in terms of the Boras clients, teams balked at the outrageous demands and term.

Will be interesting to see what happens with Soto, but he's young and he has performed much better than Vladdy.

I guess it all depends how Vladdy will perform rest of this year and next. if the lack of power continues it will not help him.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Someone will pay. Owners can’t help themselves.

I hope it's the Jays. If a Guerrero Jr. popped up on the open market, I'd want the Jays lining up with a substantial offer to entice him to come here.

He may not be living up to the hype, and possibly may never will, but he still is a good enough player to keep around and have as a core piece. Even if it's not as the franchise/cornerstone piece we expected him to be.

 

[dredeye]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1795199047059276226

Thank you. I was worried he got hurt or something. I guess he is hurt but hopefully nothing serious.

 

[Eyedea]

Jesus, when you clearly lose a debate do you always devolve it into this sort of discussion? Lemme try it .... Varsho is 99th percentile for Range, must mean he is a good goalie in the NHL....

What debate? You're flip flopping between expected stats and actual stats to paint Varsho and Vladdy in a negative light.

And I'm not excusing Vladdy for his inconsistencies, but if he somehow slap singles his way to 190 wRC+, who cares about power? That was the initial point of conversation. How people somehow think it's bad that Vladdy's been getting on base nearly 50% of the time over the last 30 days and brought his overall wRC+ back up to top 25 despite his terrible start.

 

[Puckstuff]

I agree with you. I think if you add a better/younger DH and you move Varsho to CF and get a better bat than KK to play LF then it can potentially be a good offense. Still got the Springer and Kirk problem though. But personally i would refrain to evaluate players atm cause there might be a little bit of the team has given up going on. I mean Atkins pretty much did nothing this summer and everyone knew the team was not good enough so there might be a little bit of that in the beginning of the season the pitching and offense had. Not sure the players believe in the coaching staff either. The team on the bench looks like it has phased out.

1. Schneider .803 ops - good leadoff hitter
2. Gurrerro Jr. - .812 ops - fine #2 hitter
3. - ?
4. - ?
5. Jansen - .946 ops - above average #5 hitter. He's legit. I agree Kirk is a problem though.
6. Bichette - .663 ops - Should bounce back to being at least an .800 ops hitter. That’s an elite #6 hitter. It becomes a problem when he hits 2-4. 5th or 6th is more ideal imo.
7. Varsho .750 ops - Varsho around 7 seems to make sense. He is at least league average for the 7 spot. It's only a problem when he's batting in the top 5.
8. Springer .570 ops - George is the biggest question mark but there's some hope he can figure it out. I'm sure he can bounce back to being a better then average #8 hitter.
9. IKF - .721 ops - .721 is great for a #9 hitter. We also have Martinez playing 3B in the minors.

So really we just need an elite #3 and #4 hitter, which I get it, that might not be possible and if they have to rebuild, then it is what it is. If they can find a good #3 and #4 hitter, maybe it's a 1 year rebuild instead of a massive rebuild.

Pitching with Berrios, Manoah, Gausman, Bassit, Rodriguez, TIedeamann should be ok next year.

 

[Hellcat]

I hope it's the Jays. If a Guerrero Jr. popped up on the open market, I'd want the Jays lining up with a substantial offer to entice him to come here.

He may not be living up to the hype, and possibly may never will, but he still is a good enough player to keep around and have as a core piece. Even if it's not as the franchise/cornerstone piece we expected him to be.

He's not the type pf player you win with, way too many basepath mistakes, he's got a hole in his swing that you can drive a bus through... his god gifted physical skills do not make up for his lack of baseball smarts. Maybe it's because the MLB level coaching has not taught him well, maybe it's because he has lapses of mental acuity, who knows but he's not a guy I want on 2nd base with the series on the line... he's not a guy I want at the plate with the series on the line. His extreme degrees of execution, range from bottom of the line up to top 4 in the batting order, he is just too inconsistent to be a relied upon player.

 

[MK78]

White Sox starter Clevinger scratched, so what are the chances their AAA call up pitcher absolutely bamboozles the Jays? It's happened before.

 

[red devil]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1795563653434851442

 

[MK78]

Wow, him and not Cabrera. Both stink equally i guess.

 

[MS]

Surprising because they usually take the easy way out and option Pearson.

Also a bit surprising because that HR last night was the first run Swanson allowed in his last 6 appearances and it looked like he was throwing a bit better.

 

[red devil]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1795588315015786901

 

[MK78]

Looks like the rain passed on the radar, i guess now its just getting the field ready. my guess it takes an hour.

 

[red devil]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1795600487951286382

 

[MK78]

Babe with a leadoff double!

 

[HockeyThoughts]

Didn't look like Bo swung to me

 

[MS]

Man, IKF is just raking right now.