Blue Jays GDT: 2024 v4 |Mon, Jun 17 | vs BOS | 7pm ET/4pm PT | Pivetta vs Kikuchi

[Eyedea]

I'm not blaming him. I'm just saying that hitting mostly singles on this particular team isnt very effective.

Just look at Varsho. Barely hititng .200 but he has more RBI's than Vladdy. Why? Because he's hitting more homers.

I find it odd that so many people are throwing batting average around like it’s the telltale sign of an effective hitter, and then excuse Vladdy as being a disappointment despite leading the team in batting average (Jansen not qualified). Varsho can be good without hitting for average, Vlad can be good without hitting for power. These things are possible!

Fact of the matter is that even if you include Jansen in the leaderboards, Vladdy has been the 2nd best hitter on the team. And this is only because Jansen has Ruthian numbers, but regardless Vladdy hasn’t been a disappointment in the slightest especially since he’s been the Jays best hitter and one of the best in baseball since that Royals series where he used Teo’s bat.

 

[Eyedea]

Even Lourdes who is hitting .234 would be a better option than any of Kiermier, Varsho or Springer .. when .234 is a better option that is in inditement of your GM and Hitting Coach. Moreno at .228 is better than Kirk at .209, would have compared him to Jansen but he was not here most of the season, Atkins is the anti-Midas touch.

No, Gurriel would not be a better option than Varsho, and he wouldn’t even be a good option in LF with the way he’s hitting. Ridiculous take.

Major League Leaderboards - 2024 - Batting | FanGraphs Baseball

www.fangraphs.com

Varsho has been more valuable than Gurriel and Moreno COMBINED so far this season. Even by rWAR standards he’s practically 2 full wins ahead of them.

 

[HockeyThoughts]

C'mon. Vladdy has had many opportunities so far this season to drive in runs. Many times he's been in the position to put the team out in front or get them right back in it. You're now sounding like a Vladdy excuse maker. He's been one of the biggest disappointment this season, If not the biggest.

You realize that Bichette (88 WRC+) and Springer (58 WRC+) play for the Toronto Blue Jays right?

Vlad is top 20 in WRC+ leaguewide - T3 for 1B (T2 not including Salvador Perez).

 

[LaP]

I'm still not sold we need a full rebuild because I think we have a lot of good pieces. What we lack is a good DH and a middle of the order bat.

I agree with you. I think if you add a better/younger DH and you move Varsho to CF and get a better bat than KK to play LF then it can potentially be a good offense. Still got the Springer and Kirk problem though. But personally i would refrain to evaluate players atm cause there might be a little bit of the team has given up going on. I mean Atkins pretty much did nothing this summer and everyone knew the team was not good enough so there might be a little bit of that in the beginning of the season the pitching and offense had. Not sure the players believe in the coaching staff either. The team on the bench looks like it has phased out.

 

[MK78]

Springer-2-run-Dinger!

 

[PanniniClaus]

Springer-2-run-Dinger!

It's a start.

 

[MK78]

I find it odd that so many people are throwing batting average around like it’s the telltale sign of an effective hitter, and then excuse Vladdy as being a disappointment despite leading the team in batting average (Jansen not qualified). Varsho can be good without hitting for average, Vlad can be good without hitting for power. These things are possible!

Fact of the matter is that even if you include Jansen in the leaderboards, Vladdy has been the 2nd best hitter on the team. And this is only because Jansen has Ruthian numbers, but regardless Vladdy hasn’t been a disappointment in the slightest especially since he’s been the Jays best hitter and one of the best in baseball since that Royals series where he used Teo’s bat.

I just want him to hit more than 2 homers per month, because that's what he's been doing.

Is that so much to ask, after what he's done so far in his career? Has he forgot how to hit homers after hitting 135 in his career, and the two monster home run derby performances?

He may never be the 48 home run hitter he was in 2021. Fine, I've come to terms with that. But this team needs a 30 HR+ hitter from the 1B position. He's on pace for what, about 15? That's brutal.

 

[Hellcat]

No, Gurriel would not be a better option than Varsho, and he wouldn’t even be a good option in LF with the way he’s hitting. Ridiculous take.

Major League Leaderboards - 2024 - Batting | FanGraphs Baseball

www.fangraphs.com

Varsho has been more valuable than Gurriel and Moreno COMBINED so far this season. Even by rWAR standards he’s practically 2 full wins ahead of them.

That buzzing sound that went over your head was the point that you clearly missed, they are both pretty shitty at the plate.

 

[Eyedea]

I just want him to hit more than 2 homers per month, because that's what he's been doing.

Is that so much to ask, after what he's done so far in his career? Has he forgot how to hit homers after hitting 135 in his career, and the two monster home run derby performances?

He may never be the 48 home run hitter he was in 2021. Fine, I've come to terms with that. But this team needs a 30 HR+ hitter from the 1B position. He's on pace for what, about 15? That's brutal.

Power’s been down league wide and is one of the lowest since 2000. It wouldn’t surprise me if he gets hot in terms of power output through the summer, but there are very few players this year who’ll actually end up hitting 30+. Look at the names around his in the HR category, even some +/- 1 from him. Plenty of AS calibre players aren’t hitting HRs this year. Maybe they nerfed the baseball.

That buzzing sound that went over your head was the point that you clearly missed, they are both pretty shitty at the plate.

Except that Varsho hasn’t been bad, so your point makes even less sense.

 

[MK78]

Bichette hits a solo dinger!

 

[Hellcat]

I find it odd that so many people are throwing batting average around like it’s the telltale sign of an effective hitter, and then excuse Vladdy as being a disappointment despite leading the team in batting average (Jansen not qualified). Varsho can be good without hitting for average, Vlad can be good without hitting for power. These things are possible!

Fact of the matter is that even if you include Jansen in the leaderboards, Vladdy has been the 2nd best hitter on the team. And this is only because Jansen has Ruthian numbers, but regardless Vladdy hasn’t been a disappointment in the slightest especially since he’s been the Jays best hitter and one of the best in baseball since that Royals series where he used Teo’s bat.

When the metric that a sport uses to determine a player is an effective hitter is use to determine if he is an effective hitter you shouldn't be surprised. Would you prefer if people use arm strength or sprint speed to gauge a batters ability to hit the ball?

Vladdy was supposed to be a generational talent, would you say based on performance he is a generational talent? Should people be happy or disappointed that he has not reach his expected ceiling? You dont understand why people are disappointed with Vlad?

 

[PanniniClaus]

Home runs are back baby!!! well today anyway..

 

[MK78]

Power’s been down league wide and is one of the lowest since 2000. It wouldn’t surprise me if he gets hot in terms of power output through the summer, but there are very few players this year who’ll actually end up hitting 30+. Look at the names around his in the HR category, even some +/- 1 from him. Plenty of AS calibre players aren’t hitting HRs this year. Maybe they nerfed the baseball.

I dunno, the best power hitters seem to be hitting their homers. Plenty of players on pace for 30+

Vladdy wants to get paid. hitting singles doesnt get you paid.

 

[Eyedea]

When the metric that a sport uses to determine a player is an effective hitter is use to determine if he is an effective hitter you shouldn't be surprised. Would you prefer if people use arm strength or sprint speed to gauge a batters ability to hit the ball?

Vladdy was supposed to be a generational talent, would you say based on performance he is a generational talent? Should people be happy or disappointed that he has not reach his expected ceiling? You dont understand why people are disappointed with Vlad?

Did you even bother to read the second part of that sentence?

Vladdy is batting .300 with a near .400 OBP. Despite his slow start he’s now 5th in average and 4th in OBP in the AL. If you want to use average to determine the effectiveness of a player… then Vladdy looks pretty damn elite to me.

 

[Hellcat]

Except that Varsho hasn’t been bad, so your point makes even less sense.

Yeah he's been an All Star with these stats
xwOBA 7th percentile - 93% of the league is better
xBA 1st percentile - 99% of the league is better
XSLG 11th percentile - 89% is better
Avg exit Velo 9th percentile - 91% is better
hard Hit % 18th percentile - 72% is better
K % 26th percentile - 74% is better ....

He's the baseball equvliant of warm pablum at the plate.

 

[Eyedea]

I dunno, the best power hitters seem to be hitting their homers. Plenty of players on pace for 30+

Vladdy wants to get paid. hitting singles doesnt get you paid.

Matt Olson, ISO down 130 points.
Kyle Schwarber, ISO down 120 points.
Ronald Acuna Jr, ISO down 140 points.
Mookie Betts, ISO down 60 points.
Austin Riley, ISO down 90 points.
Jorge Soler, ISO down 100 points.
Jake Burger, ISO down 140 points.
Corey Seager, ISO down 100 points.
Ozzie Albies, ISO down 100 points.
Julio Rodriguez, ISO down 130 points.
Francisco Lindor, ISO down 60 points.
Spencer Torkelson, ISO down 70 points.
Manny Machado, ISO down 70 points.

These are just 13 of the 26 hitters that had 30 HRs last season. There are plenty of other guys that fell slightly short of that mark last year (Freeman, Castellanos, Goldschmidt, Arenado, Carroll, etc.) that have seen their power numbers drop significantly this year.

 

[Bjindaho]

Yeah he's been an All Star with these stats
xwOBA 7th percentile - 93% of the league is better
xBA 1st percentile - 99% of the league is better
XSLG 11th percentile - 89% is better
Avg exit Velo 9th percentile - 91% is better
hard Hit % 18th percentile - 72% is better
K % 26th percentile - 74% is better ....

He's the baseball equvliant of warm pablum at the plate.

Why are you using predictive stats to gauge actual performance?

 

[Eyedea]

Yeah he's been an All Star with these stats
xwOBA 7th percentile - 93% of the league is better
xBA 1st percentile - 99% of the league is better
XSLG 11th percentile - 89% is better
Avg exit Velo 9th percentile - 91% is better
hard Hit % 18th percentile - 72% is better
K % 26th percentile - 74% is better ....

He's the baseball equvliant of warm pablum at the plate.

Meanwhile Vladdy has generational xStats dating back to last season. So what side do you lean on? That Vladdy is elite and Varsho is shit? Or just flip flop to argue that everyone on the team sucks.

 

[Hellcat]

Did you even bother to read the second part of that sentence?

Vladdy is batting .300 with a near .400 OBP. Despite his slow start he’s now 5th in average and 4th in OBP in the AL. If you want to use average to determine the effectiveness of a player… then Vladdy looks pretty damn elite to me.

You think .299 is generational?

Why are you using predictive stats to gauge actual performance?

Predictive stats eventually become .... ?

Meanwhile Vladdy has generational xStats dating back to last season. So what side do you lean on? That Vladdy is elite and Varsho is shit? Or just flip flop to argue that everyone on the team sucks.

Starting to think the bar you set for generational talent is pretty low. Shoei is what in your opinion?

 

[Bjindaho]

You think .299 is generational?



Predictive stats eventually become .... ?

Predictive stats...nothing more

Sometimes predictive stats work. Sometimes they don't.

Danny's xStats aren't great despite his actual stats. Vladdy's xStats far outpace his actual production.

 

[Eyedea]

You think .299 is generational?



Predictive stats eventually become .... ?



Starting to think the bar you set for generational talent is pretty low. Shoei is what in your opinion?

Vladdy is 4th in hard hit% behind Judge, Soto, and Ohtani? Three generational hitters?

You yourself agree that predictive stats eventually become…?

 

[MK78]

All these fancy stats don't mean squat to me when I'm watching the Jays play.

 

[Bjindaho]

All these fancy stats don't mean squat to me when I'm watching the Jays play.

That's the thing. People are using fancy stats or non-fancy stats but either one is going to say some guys are good and some guys are bad.

Vladdy has the best combination of both, but outside of him, nobody else is remotely decent in both

 

[trellaine201]

Swanson has been dog poo this year.

 

[dredeye]

Why did they pull Bassitt so early? His pitch count was at 87. Also, Why the F is Vagelbach hitting 5th with his 160 average. Insanity with this team.