2024 preseason (camp, media stuff)

[tiburon12]

In a salary cap league, roster decisions are made as contracts are signed unless somebody on a one-way really underperforms. The point of preseason games is mainly to gouge season ticket holders.

No, the point of pre-season is to warm up before the real season. That's why no one is in favor of eliminating the pre-season, but rather truncating it because players only need a few game reps.

In that light, pre-season is also the chance for coaches to see how their players have progressed as a result of their off-ice training and judge the changes in in-game settings.

While you're right the pre-season is ultimately meaningless w/r/t points (Doug Murray hattrick excluded ), it still remains the best place to judge whether a player is NHL ready for the upcoming season or not. Gushchin has proven he is worth giving a shot to, especially early on. That's not a full roster spot, but that's a chance to prove it.

 

[Hodge]

No, the point of pre-season is to warm up before the real season. That's why no one is in favor of eliminating the pre-season, but rather truncating it because players only need a few game reps.

In that light, pre-season is also the chance for coaches to see how their players have progressed as a result of their off-ice training and judge the changes in in-game settings.

While you're right the pre-season is ultimately meaningless w/r/t points (Doug Murray hattrick excluded ), it still remains the best place to judge whether a player is NHL ready for the upcoming season or not. Gushchin has proven he is worth giving a shot to, especially early on. That's not a full roster spot, but that's a chance to prove it.

Preseason is a horrible way to judge whether a player is ready for the upcoming season or not. The quality of rosters teams are icing, especially in week one, are barely above AHL caliber. Even when they draw into the lineup, veterans on one-way deals are incentivized not to exert themselves and risk injury. We haven't learned anything new about Gushchin who has already established he can score at the AHL level.

 

[Jargon]

Preseason is a horrible way to judge whether a player is ready for the upcoming season or not. The quality of rosters teams are icing, especially in week one, are barely above AHL caliber. Even when they draw into the lineup, veterans on one-way deals are incentivized not to exert themselves and risk injury. We haven't learned anything new about Gushchin who has already established he can score at the AHL level.

Gushchin has proved himself in the AHL (but that doesn’t matter), has looked great in camp (who cares) and looked awesome in the preseason (totally useless), so I guess, by your standards, the only way for him to make the team is to somehow manifest himself into the lineup?

I think all these things are of course factors for coaches - they’re all auditions for players. The only way to see if the success transfers to the NHL is to let him play a few games in the NHL and I think he’s earned that.

 

[barriers]

Gushchin has proved himself in the AHL (but that doesn’t matter), has looked great in camp (who cares) and looked awesome in the preseason (totally useless), so I guess, by your standards, the only way for him to make the team is to somehow manifest himself into the lineup?

I think all these things are of course factors for coaches - they’re all auditions for players. The only way to see if the success transfers to the NHL is to let him play a few games in the NHL and I think he’s earned that.

He's also got 4 points in the 6 NHL games he's been on the roster, but you're right. Producing at the the NHL level when called upon means nothing

 

[Hodge]

Gushchin has proved himself in the AHL (but that doesn’t matter), has looked great in camp (who cares) and looked awesome in the preseason (totally useless), so I guess, by your standards, the only way for him to make the team is to somehow manifest himself into the lineup?

I think all these things are of course factors for coaches - they’re all auditions for players. The only way to see if the success transfers to the NHL is to let him play a few games in the NHL and I think he’s earned that.

Gushchin has proven that he can score, mostly on the power play, against minor league goalies and defenses while not providing anything else to a team in the way of defensive play, physicality, PK, forechecking, etc. Maybe he should have gotten more runway last season ahead of guys like Barabanov and Hoffman but he's clearly worse than our current top six forwards and doesn't fit our defensively oriented bottom six.

So no he hasn't "earned the right to be on the opening night roster" as @OrrNumber4 said. At best, he's earned the right to be the first call-up when someone in the top six gets injured but he'll need to continue earning that in the AHL over Cardwell, Bystedt and Graf.

 

[hotcabbagesoup]

Well, for what it's worth, Goose did play some PK last game so maybe Coach is considering him to be more than just an AHL-caliber scorer. And he took Musty's spot on the PP mudway through the game. I think Wars sees more in him than Quinn. Will be intriguing to see his deployment the next preseason game.

 

[weastern bias]

At this point Gushchin has been more impressive than Smith so I can see a world where he makes the team on the 2nd line and Smith gets to play 3rd line comp until he's ready for more responsibility

72-71-73
75-64-20

Pair Smith with Wennberg on the 3rd line with whatever winger fits best until Smith is more seasoned and is ready for top-6 minutes with Granlund, this gives Gushchin a chance to legitimately audition for a role that fits his skillset

 

[TheBeard]

So no he hasn't "earned the right to be on the opening night roster"

I mean if we’re going off what he’s done in the NHL and what he’s done in preseason then he’s probably earned it more than Smith has.

 

[Hobocop]

Probably useful to post here after today's transactions (see LS's post in the recall/assign thread), here's who's left in camp. Musty has gone back to juniors, so no 9 games for him. Bailey on waivers, headed to the AHL. Halttunen was assigned to Barracuda camp as well.

Couple names still on there that are hurt, like Chernyshov, Bordeleau.

Cardwell, Gushchin, Cagnoni, Dickinson, Thompson still around.

 

[weastern bias]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1840806187023155596

Pashelka has Halttunen to the Cuda answer Musty to the Wolves

SWOOPED

 

[Jargon]

I mean if we’re going off what he’s done in the NHL and what he’s done in preseason then he’s probably earned it more than Smith has.

I had the same thought earlier. Obviously Smith is a better player but Gushchin has had a better camp for sure (and for obvious reasons of course).

From the practice lines today, I don’t think Goose is breaking in though.

 

[tiburon12]

Preseason is a horrible way to judge whether a player is ready for the upcoming season or not. The quality of rosters teams are icing, especially in week one, are barely above AHL caliber. Even when they draw into the lineup, veterans on one-way deals are incentivized not to exert themselves and risk injury. We haven't learned anything new about Gushchin who has already established he can score at the AHL level.

It's still game time to see if they improved in the things they needed to do as outlined by the coaches and staff for off-season training. It's also literally the only time.

Perhaps we have different leadership styles but when I work with a junior in order to improve something, and then they prove their growth in the opportunities given, I reward them.

How else do you propose they evaluate and handle him or any other cuda player (if they had shown up to camp noticeably better)?

 

[Patty Ice]

He's also got 4 points in the 6 NHL games he's been on the roster, but you're right. Producing at the the NHL level when called upon means nothing

5'9 don't care.

 

[TheBeard]

I had the same thought earlier. Obviously Smith is a better player but Gushchin has had a better camp for sure (and for obvious reasons of course).

From the practice lines today, I don’t think Goose is breaking in though.

If that's the case then you may as well just trade him since there's a part of me that doesn't think he'll report or it won't be long before he asks for a trade.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1840806187023155596

Pashelka has Halttunen to the Cuda answer Musty to the Wolves

SWOOPED

I'm happy Halt is headed there. Barracuda are gonna be a lot of fun to watch this year.

 

[coooldude]

1. Feel like the biggest piece of news for the speculation on these boards is Musty going back to OHL. No Shane Wright plan (or whoever it was).

2. Halttunen to Cuda camp isn't surprising YET, as I suspect Musty would have definitely been assigned there if he could have been. I will still be a bit surprised if he makes the AHL roster.

3. I don't think it's surprising that Cagnoni and Dickinson are still in the big camp. I don't think they have any shot of making the big squad but this is a "keep them in an NHL environment for as long as possible" move, and then I expect Luca is AHL this year.

 

[one2gamble]

1. Feel like the biggest piece of news for the speculation on these boards is Musty going back to OHL. No Shane Wright plan (or whoever it was).

I mean he didnt even come close to earning that, which is disappointing but I think he learned enough to know he has work to do.

 

[TheBeard]

1. Feel like the biggest piece of news for the speculation on these boards is Musty going back to OHL. No Shane Wright plan (or whoever it was).

2. Halttunen to Cuda camp isn't surprising YET, as I suspect Musty would have definitely been assigned there if he could have been. I will still be a bit surprised if he makes the AHL roster.

3. I don't think it's surprising that Cagnoni and Dickinson are still in the big camp. I don't think they have any shot of making the big squad but this is a "keep them in an NHL environment for as long as possible" move, and then I expect Luca is AHL this year.

I think Luca gets a 9 game stint to start the season. Especially with all the injuries on the blue line. Mukh's inability to breathe without getting injured almost assures that.

 

[Jargon]

I think Luca gets a 9 game stint to start the season. Especially with all the injuries on the blue line. Mukh's inability to breathe without getting injured almost assures that.

I think Muhk played most of the year last year, no? He had an injury around the all-star break. Don’t think he’s injury prone just yet.

 

[TheBeard]

I think Muhk played most of the year last year, no? He had an injury around the all-star break. Don’t think he’s injury prone just yet.

It was an exaggeration, but he had an injury in Feb, came back, got injured again for the rest of the year March 31st with an UBI. He didn't play the rookie games because of "general soreness" and now he's been out this whole time with a LBI. The fact everything has been so vague scares me. He also already had shoulder surgery back in 2021.

 

[Star Platinum]

I mean if we’re going off what he’s done in the NHL and what he’s done in preseason then he’s probably earned it more than Smith has.

But as we know, some guys have to earn it and other guys have to "earn" it.

 

[TheBeard]

But as we know, some guys have to earn it and other guys have to "earn" it.

Oh, I agree. I'm just saying if we're going solely off merit then Gush is much higher on that list than some of the players we know are making the team.

 

[Star Platinum]

Oh, I agree. I'm just saying if we're going solely off merit then Gush is much higher on that list than some of the players we know are making the team.

We have approximately 27 fourth-line forwards that are going to make it just by virtue of having contracts, not because they've shown they're actually any good in 2024. But Warsofsky seems to think we're gonna have really great third and fourth lines.

 

[TheBeard]

We have approximately 27 fourth-line forwards that are going to make it just by virtue of having contracts, not because they've shown they're actually any good in 2024. But Warsofsky seems to think we're gonna have really great third and fourth lines.

I mean they could be providing the top two lines exceed offensive expectation and the defense shows they're a decent to good group - neither of which I think are realistic. If they're needed to do more than just chip in offensively then we're screwed.

 

[mogambomoroo]

I'm in the camp of trading Goose, if there is no use. (nice, that rhymed)
At this point if he still makes a serious push to play in NHL and doesn't get a chance, it's time to move him to another team that gives him that chance and wants to pay a project defencemen or some picks. Looking at our future line up projection, he doesn't really fit the MG mold but should definitely have a chance somewhere else.

EDIT: I'm not opposed to trying him out on the big squad if the numbers say so.

 

[gaucholoco3]

I'm in the camp of trading Goose, if there is no use. (nice, that rhymed)
At this point if he still makes a serious push to play in NHL and doesn't get a chance, it's time to move him to another team that gives him that chance and wants to pay a project defencemen or some picks. Looking at our future line up projection, he doesn't really fit the MG mold but should definitely have a chance somewhere else.

EDIT: I'm not opposed to trying him out on the big squad if the numbers say so.

Gushchin is not the best fit in part because Smith and Celebrini are just average size. If he is on a line with with of those two then that makes that line very undersized. In addition the Sharks don’t have many big wings yet so that third player on the line would also be undersized. At least MG has compensated by drafting a lot of size at wing.

For a projected top 6 of:
Eklund - Celebrini - Toffoli
Granlund - Smith - Zetterlund

None of those players are taller than 6’0”.