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2024-25 Roster Thread #1: The Beginninging

deadhead said:
Attard played 12 games, ATOI 15:23
Ginning played 9 games, ATOI 14:09
Belpedio played 12 games, ATOI 13:23
Andrae played 4 games, ATOI 13:00
Staal played 35 games, ATOI 13:49
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Attard had a guarantee in his contract and that's the only reason he was called up. Was awful when sent to LHV for playoffs
Ginning didn't look out of place at all , big-strong-a little grit , he's coming along fine and I like him
Belpedio made the best out of his 12 games and given a legitimate chance could be a very similar player to Walker
Andrae a little to weak to win battles although he tries his ass off ... hopefully stronger this season and gets a chance
Staal .... 🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮
 
deadhead said:
Risto is a much better skater and more skilled overall than Attard.

And under Shaw, he's become a good defensive defenseman, albeit at the cost of some offense, but you gotta walk before you run. The problem is the contract, not the player.

Attard has a plus shot for a D-man, good size and he's no longer a gross liability on defense, but he has below average speed and has to be careful attacking the O-zone not to get caught up ice.
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This is just false. What they have done is simplified his game by how they play as a team. That is not an improvement on his end but rather reflective of the system they employ.

That being said Risto is a solid bottom pair dman on any team. Just way overpaid with $$ and term.

Attard does not have below average speed.
 
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deadhead said:
2019: York, Brink, with Attard on the bubble
2020: Foerster, Andrae on the bubble
2021: no 1st rd, Tuomaala on the bubble
2022: Gaither/Drysdale, no 2nd rd pick, McDonald on the bubble, Bump has a good shot in a couple years
2023: Michkov, Bonk, Barkey, Sotheran, Zavragin, Bjarnason

"On the bubble" - good shot at competing/being promoted for a roster spot this year or next year.
Helps to have extra draft picks instead of trading them away.
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Unless injuries Attard and Andrae have no shot for promotion to see any significant time.

Hunter Mac has played a dozen or so pro games in a sheltered role now he is a bubble player. Can't wait to see him get exposed.
 
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blackjackmulligan said:
This is just false. What they have done is simplified his game by how they play as a team. That is not an improvement on his end but rather reflective of the system they employ.

That being said Risto is a solid bottom pair dman on any team. Just way overpaid with $$ and term.

Attard does not have below average speed.
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According to Edge, his top speed was 20.84, average for D-men is 21.67.
He did have (13) 20+ bursts in about a 4th of a season, which puts him above the average.

Risto was 21.25 last season, but 22.36 the year before when he was healthy.

Doesn't mean Attard can't make it work, but ideally he needs to be more fundamentally sound b/c he has a smaller margin of error, and you'd like to pair him with a faster partner.
 
Mickey the mouse said:
Attard had a guarantee in his contract and that's the only reason he was called up. Was awful when sent to LHV for playoffs
Ginning didn't look out of place at all , big-strong-a little grit , he's coming along fine and I like him
Belpedio made the best out of his 12 games and given a legitimate chance could be a very similar player to Walker
Andrae a little to weak to win battles although he tries his ass off ... hopefully stronger this season and gets a chance
Staal .... 🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮
Click to expand...
A rebuilding team lets him play after he showed some solid play in that 12 game sample. Maybe he becomes your next Seeler who is a late bloomer.

deadhead said:
According to Edge, his top speed was 20.84, average for D-men is 21.67.
He did have (13) 20+ bursts in about a 4th of a season, which puts him above the average.

Risto was 21.25 last season, but 22.36 the year before when he was healthy.

Doesn't mean Attard can't make it work, but ideally he needs to be more fundamentally sound b/c he has a smaller margin of error, and you'd like to pair him with a faster partner.
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Stast do not tell the full story. He has never looked slow or below average when he has played at the NHL level. Skating is a non-issue.
 
Belpedio is an AHL plus player, good to have around in case of injury, but not a NHL starter.
But kind of player you want at LHV to mentor young D-men.

Ginning is just a limited player, size, decent first pass, not a good skater. Not a great shot from the point.
An example where coaching taught him to play within himself, use his body, make the exit pass, don't try to do too much.
Could be a solid 3LHD with the right partner who has more offensive skill.
 
deadhead said:
According to Edge, his top speed was 20.84, average for D-men is 21.67.
He did have (13) 20+ bursts in about a 4th of a season, which puts him above the average.

Risto was 21.25 last season, but 22.36 the year before when he was healthy.

Doesn't mean Attard can't make it work, but ideally he needs to be more fundamentally sound b/c he has a smaller margin of error, and you'd like to pair him with a faster partner.
Click to expand...
Crazy how fast you skate when you screw up your reads and end up chasing the play…..
 
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blackjackmulligan said:
Unless injuries Attard and Andrae have no shot for promotion to see any significant time.

Hunter Mac has played a dozen or so pro games in a sheltered role now he is a bubble player. Can't wait to see him get exposed.
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They can love Hunter Mac all they want...there is no room for anyone!
 
deadhead said:
Belpedio is an AHL plus player, good to have around in case of injury, but not a NHL starter.
But kind of player you want at LHV to mentor young D-men.

Ginning is just a limited player, size, decent first pass, not a good skater. Not a great shot from the point.
An example where coaching taught him to play within himself, use his body, make the exit pass, don't try to do too much.
Could be a solid 3LHD with the right partner who has more offensive skill.
Click to expand...
So was Seeler at one point and the same thing was said about him. Belpedio should have received a longer look.

Didn't you like Ginning at one point? He also should have got a longer look. That is what a rebuilding team would have done. Now it may have turned out that he isn't an NHL regular. They had the time to find that out.

usahockey22flyers said:
They can love Hunter Mac all they want...there is no room for anyone!
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Now I could see the finding a spot for him, not to start, if he shows well in LHV. He is the pet project with size snarl and all the things the Flyers brass love.
 
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Mickey the mouse said:
Attard had a guarantee in his contract and that's the only reason he was called up. Was awful when sent to LHV for playoffs
Ginning didn't look out of place at all , big-strong-a little grit , he's coming along fine and I like him
Click to expand...
They had almost identical results in the short time with the Flyers.
 
blackjackmulligan said:
So was Seeler at one point and the same thing was said about him. Belpedio should have received a longer look.

Didn't you like Ginning at one point? He also should have got a longer look. That is what a rebuilding team would have done. Now it may have turned out that he isn't an NHL regular. They had the time to find that out.


Now I could see the finding a spot for him, not to start, if he shows well in LHV. He is the pet project with size snarl and all the things the Flyers brass love.
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Everyone complains the Flyers didn't tank and obtain premium talent.
Now you want them to play marginal talent because they're young?

Seeler was initially signed to a #7 D-man contract, 2 year, 1st year two way, second year guaranteed. Seeler is an anomaly, few players at his age step up that much. He's bigger and faster than Belpedio and started in the NHL earlier in his career (71 games at 25 years old).

Ginning has worked hard to be a serviceable NHL D-man, and I think he could play at 3LHD for a number of teams, but he lacks top 4 talent. The reason McDonald is getting the hype is he's the same size, defense first, but supposedly a much better skater than Ginning.

They scout the AHL players extensively, they have the input of assistant coaches, film and you see Briere in Allentown on a regular basis. If a LHV player looks NHL ready, they know.
 
deadhead said:
Everyone complains the Flyers didn't tank and obtain premium talent.
Now you want them to play marginal talent because they're young?

Seeler was initially signed to a #7 D-man contract, 2 year, 1st year two way, second year guaranteed. Seeler is an anomaly, few players at his age step up that much. He's bigger and faster than Belpedio and started in the NHL earlier in his career (71 games at 25 years old).

Ginning has worked hard to be a serviceable NHL D-man, and I think he could play at 3LHD for a number of teams, but he lacks top 4 talent. The reason McDonald is getting the hype is he's the same size, defense first, but supposedly a much better skater than Ginning.

They scout the AHL players extensively, they have the input of assistant coaches, film and you see Briere in Allentown on a regular basis. If a LHV player looks NHL ready, they know.
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Not sure what you're referring too with that statement.

Last year was the perfect opportunity to see what you have in a few a players who are no longer prospects. They choose to not go that route.

Seeler was an afterthought for nhl duty when chuck singed him to that deal and was also signed for the ahl. To his credit he turned his career around. The entire point is maybe Belpedio could be that be that next one. There was no harm in finding out if they were actually rebuilding like they should have been.

Every team scouts their AHL team. I do not trust the Flyers scouting. There was no reason not to give Attard and Ginning a much longer look. Funny how a few years back you loved Ginning and Attard. Don't you think it is sad at this juncture they have no one who is nhl ready.

Hunter Mac is getting undeserved hype because he fits the Flyers mold. Can't wait to see you say well he was a 6th rd pick what did you expect him to be an NHL player? Then throw out the % of players who become NHL from that round as your defense. After he doesn't become one of course. You wil ldefned the Flyers at every turn.
 
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blackjackmulligan said:
So was Seeler at one point and the same thing was said about him. Belpedio should have received a longer look.

Didn't you like Ginning at one point? He also should have got a longer look. That is what a rebuilding team would have done. Now it may have turned out that he isn't an NHL regular. They had the time to find that out.


Now I could see the finding a spot for him, not to start, if he shows well in LHV. He is the pet project with size snarl and all the things the Flyers brass love.
Click to expand...
I prob am higher on Hunter than most people here - I think he has a really good chance to be a solid 5/6 on a good team. I would anticipate him being a Flyer at the start of next year for sure
 
usahockey22flyers said:
I prob am higher on Hunter than most people here - I think he has a really good chance to be a solid 5/6 on a good team. I would anticipate him being a Flyer at the start of next year for sure
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I'll wait and see how he looks in LHV. He's big (reportedly 6'4 230 now), if he is an above average skater and fundamentally sound, he could be an impact defender. But we'll see.

Defensemen generally develop slower, especially those who lack top end offensive skill and have to perfect their fundamentals to play reliable defense. Very few D-men are good enough offensively to compensate for bad defense.

The most frustrating player is Grans, who has top 4 talent (by all reports) but can't put it together on the ice. But he's only 22, so there's time for him. However, he's pretty much flatlined in 3 AHL seasons.
 
usahockey22flyers said:
I prob am higher on Hunter than most people here - I think he has a really good chance to be a solid 5/6 on a good team. I would anticipate him being a Flyer at the start of next year for sure
Click to expand...
Need to see how his first full season of pro hockey goes. Then revaluate.

deadhead said:
I'll wait and see how he looks in LHV. He's big (reportedly 6'4 230 now), if he is an above average skater and fundamentally sound, he could be an impact defender. But we'll see.

Defensemen generally develop slower, especially those who lack top end offensive skill and have to perfect their fundamentals to play reliable defense. Very few D-men are good enough offensively to compensate for bad defense.

The most frustrating player is Grans, who has top 4 talent (by all reports) but can't put it together on the ice. But he's only 22, so there's time for him. However, he's pretty much flatlined in 3 AHL seasons.
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His skating has never been that good. It will never be above average imo.
 
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Tripod said:
Is it good to trade a mid 1st for a Dman you have to try and fix...to become your 3rd pairing Dman?
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:deadhorse

Water under the bridge.

Going forward, the question is how to inflate Risto's value to move his contract and make room for Bonk and Sotheran.
 
deadhead said:
2019: York, Brink, with Attard on the bubble
2020: Foerster, Andrae on the bubble
2021: no 1st rd, Tuomaala on the bubble
2022: Gaither/Drysdale, no 2nd rd pick, McDonald on the bubble, Bump has a good shot in a couple years
2023: Michkov, Bonk, Barkey, Sotheran, Zavragin, Bjarnason

"On the bubble" - good shot at competing/being promoted for a roster spot this year or next year.
Helps to have extra draft picks instead of trading them away.
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Nothing you wrote here refutes what i wrote.

Who's fault is it for not having extra draft picks in 2019, 20, 21 and 22? All while missing the playoffs 3/4 years.

deadhead said:
:deadhorse

Water under the bridge.

Going forward, the question is how to inflate Risto's value to move his contract and make room for Bonk and Sotheran.
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The irony

And inflate his value like we did Seeler? Only to sign a 3rd pairing dman for 4 years?
 
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