2023 Trade Deadline (03/03/23 3PM EST)

[tunnelvision]

Trading Laine for some meaningful return might just be the best thing that can happen before the draft

I can easily think of some even "better" turns of events:

1. Get top-3 pick in the draft
2. Get desired return for Gav, Gus and Korpi
3. Sillinger is sent down and starts working on his skating as soon as season ends

After those there are things we hope will happen that are at about same level of importance with Laine trade, such as firing Larsen, upgrading the defense etc.

 

[ViD]

I can easily think of some even "better" turns of events:

1. Get top-3 pick in the draft
2. Get desired return for Gav, Gus and Korpi
3. Sillinger is sent down and starts working on his skating as soon as season ends

After those there are things we hope will happen that are at about same level of importance with Laine trade, such as firing Larsen, upgrading the defense etc.

Your first point is certainly the most important thing this season, but I counted it as something happening at the draft.

The return for our UFAs will be good for our futures, but Laine could bring some serious roster players so I would consider it more valuable

 

[tunnelvision]

Laine could bring some serious roster players so I would consider it more valuable

What would be his value in draft picks? As you probably have noticed we don't have a strong consensus here on what could be a realistic return.

 

[ViD]

What would be his value in draft picks? As you probably have noticed we don't have a strong consensus here on what could be a realistic return.

I personally don’t think we should trade him for draft picks, we need play driving roster players

 

[tunnelvision]

I personally don’t think we should trade him for draft picks, we need play driving roster players

Who is a play driving player we could get? I want examples.

 

[ViD]

Who is a play driving player we could get? I want examples.

I wonder if something could be done with Detroit around Larkin and Bertuzzi

 

[I3LI3]

realistically (I think there’s a 99 percent chance he does not get traded but if he does), what could we expect as a return for Patty?

 

[VT]

What do you expect to get for Patrik? Players who will immediately strengthen us? If no draft picks, players we have plenty of. Also keep in mind that teams that want to be successful in the PO will be more likely to be interested, so the draft pick won't be extra. He's a winger.

 

[NotWendell]

I think we hold onto Laine. For years, we were missing a sniper. Now we have one.

 

[ViD]

I think we hold onto Laine. For years, we were missing a sniper. Now we have one.

The problem is he’s a one trick pony much more than Ovechkin. At his current contract is too damn expensive for a left circle one time laser

 

[VT]

The problem is he’s a one trick pony much more than Ovechkin. At his current contract is too damn expensive for a left circle one time laser

Funny thing is, he scored most of his goals from other positions, not just this season. Other than that, he's improved overall, for/backchecking, playing all over the rink, creating chances for his teammates. Unfortunately, he won't get rid of his reputation that easily. Of course, he has only himself to thank for that.

 

[majormajor]

The problem is he’s a one trick pony much more than Ovechkin. At his current contract is too damn expensive for a left circle one time laser

If he had any consistency at all at shooting he'd be worth his salary. The problem is that he doesn't even shoot half enough. He traded in being the best at that thing to become a mediocre playmaker who turns the puck over too often. Not bad defensively, but the dangle around and give the puck away routine is not something we need. Maybe on a really good team with an established possession game he can be persuaded to just clap bombs. He doesn't even try to shoot for whole games in Columbus. Literally zero shot attempts some times.

 

[NotCommitted]

If he had any consistency at all at shooting he'd be worth his salary. The problem is that he doesn't even shoot half enough. He traded in being the best at that thing to become a mediocre playmaker who turns the puck over too often. Not bad defensively, but the dangle around and give the puck away routine is not something we need. Maybe on a really good team with an established possession game he can be persuaded to just clap bombs. He doesn't even try to shoot for whole games in Columbus. Literally zero shot attempts some times.

Well... I've been saying this for years, but when you have a goal scorer who has 7th and 2nd place finishes for Rocket after his teenage years, you should kinda run with that...

I think you are selling his overall game a bit short here, but I completely agree he should turn his focus on being a goalscorer. Judging by the snarky remark he made recently about how it was fun back in the old days when he used to be a decent goalscorer, maybe he's waking up to it Especially now since there's Gaudreau and Johnson & Marchenko are making an appearance, it's not like he has to do everything by himself.

Though I think part of it is, or at least has been, the injuries, I really think with those oblique strains and what not he's had quite a bit of time where he was physically unable to shoot the puck as well as he used to. It would also be interesting to know how much he used to practice his shots and how much he does it these days. He's certainly still one of the better shooters in the league, but it's been quite a drop from the days when you could say he's the best. If you watch his first 100 goals in the NHL or something, a lot of those shots are absolutely insane for power, release and accuracy and perhaps most of all the way he gets off a prime quality shot from a really awkward position on a pass that's far from optimal.

 

[Crede777]

If he had any consistency at all at shooting he'd be worth his salary. The problem is that he doesn't even shoot half enough. He traded in being the best at that thing to become a mediocre playmaker who turns the puck over too often. Not bad defensively, but the dangle around and give the puck away routine is not something we need. Maybe on a really good team with an established possession game he can be persuaded to just clap bombs. He doesn't even try to shoot for whole games in Columbus. Literally zero shot attempts some times.

Laine had to develop other aspects to his game.

I highly suggest this article from the Athletic: This type of one-time shot almost never goes in. So why do NHLers keep taking it?

Here's an important quote:

Put another way, the high unscreened one-timer has a 0.6 percent chance of becoming a goal. Clear Sight Analytics defines a high-percentage scoring chance as one that goes in 20 percent or more of the time.

“Do they score? Yes,” says John Healy, Clear Sight Analytics’ vice president for data collection. “Do they score often? Very short answer: no.”

Simply put, one-timers just aren't very effective anymore. If that's all you have to offer, it's not much at all.

To actually be a productive scorer, Laine has to have multiple tools at his disposal including the pass and the ability to skate the puck in the offensive zone.

Even if we say Laine is twice as dangerous with an unscreened one-timer from the circle as your average NHLer, that only amounts to about a 1.2% chance of scoring which is much lower than the typical 10-12% shooting average.

Unless he has an open goal, clapping bombs is by far a non-economical use of offensive possession. In all likelihood, he is probably being heavily coached to PASS UP shots in favor of statistically more productive plays.

 

[thebus88]

I wonder if something could be done with Detroit around Larkin and Bertuzzi

I’d be all over both guys. Maybe something just around Bertuzzi/Laine.

Problem is what the CBJ would have to add for both guys. This is all under the assumption that Larkin would re-sign or come with an extension, which I think is something we as a group have stopped talking about, regarding the Werenski-Larkin connection.

If the interest is there, you just wait to sign him as a free agent. I think regarding all the “fantasy” ideas people have, Larkin might be trending as the most realistic, and we seemingly aren’t talking much about him anymore.

What do you expect to get for Patrik? Players who will immediately strengthen us? If no draft picks, players we have plenty of. Also keep in mind that teams that want to be successful in the PO will be more likely to be interested, so the draft pick won't be extra. He's a winger.

Well, if he is apparently so good and strengthens the CBJ so much, why couldn’t we get a player of similar quality/caliber in return??

We need a DIFFERENT player than Laine. We don’t need a guy with similar offensive qualities, we need a guy who brings everything Laine (and many other CBJ players) DOES NOT bring.

 

[DarkandStormy]

Trading Laine for some meaningful return might just be the best thing that can happen before the draft

Posted in the Laine thread, but he has 91 points in his last 98 games here. Not a lot of teams are going to want to trade for his cap hit with his term.

 

[thebus88]

I wonder if something could be done with Detroit around Larkin and Bertuzzi

Nvm, I thought Bertuzzi had a couple years left on his contract. I’d still target both guys as UFA. With Larkin, we WOULD know because of Werenski.

I don’t know why I have this feeling. Why hasn’t Larkin signed with DET?? Did Gaudreau come to the CBJ to play with Larkin and not Laine…..??

 

[thebus88]

I think we hold onto Laine. For years, we were missing a sniper. Now we have one.

Yeah, and those years just happened to be easily the most successful in franchise history….

Look at the team now…

Not to mention all the BUDDING young offensive players we have that get paid a FRACTION of what Laine gets paid. Chinakhov and his shot already practically brings everything Laine does, and he doesn’t have the negative impact on the team where guys are forcing him the puck to make him happy.

 

[DarkandStormy]

After the ROR/Acciari trade, the Leafs have just 5 selections in the first four rounds over the next three drafts.

It basically turned out to be...
-a 4th to Minnesota to launder part of O'Reilly's cap hit
-a 3rd to St. Louis to retain 50% of O'Reilly's cap hit
-a 2nd for Acciari
-a 1st for ROR

After all the talk from Dubas that he wasn't going to trade their top prospect(s) or 1st for a rental...he did exactly that. They traded their '23 1st for O'Reilly. They traded their '22 1st with Mrazek to drop 13 spots at the draft. They traded their '21 1st for Foligno. To get out of the Patrick Marleau contract, they traded Marleau, their 2020 1st (who turned into Seth Jarvis), and a 2020 7th for a 2020 6th. They traded their 2019 1st with two throw-ins for Jake Muzzin.

This sort of seems like a "mortgage the future" type of trade you'd expect from a GM who's without a contract at season's end which....[checks note]....oh.

 

[DarkandStormy]

5. Thinks they will send down Sillinger and other young guys the day after the trade deadline. Both for the paper move aspect to make them playoff eligible for the AHL, and perhaps to stay for the remainder of the year.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a player need to be on the AHL roster at 2pm on deadline day to be eligible for the AHL playoffs? The Jackets play on deadline day, so you'd have to figure out how to have 18 skaters + 2 goalies rostered.

Goalies: if Korpi is traded, you're essentially going to have to burn a spot on Tarasov or Greaves, making them ineligible for the AHL playoffs, pending a waiver pickup or taking a warm body back in some trade
Defensemen: with Gavrikov gone, there are only so many Dmen in the organization right now -> presumably you could get away with 6 guys on the roster on deadline day (Gudbranson, Boqvist, Peeke if he's still here, Bayreuther, Blankenburg, and Berni?). Berni and Blankenburg are both waivers exempt.
Forwards: this gets tricky, imo. You presumably need 12 on your roster on TDL day -> Gaudreau, Laine, Roslovic, Jenner, Kuraly, Robinson, Bemstrom, Olivier, Pederson are 9. Foudy and Bemstrom require waivers and would be 10 & 11 if not sent down. Seems unlikely any of Meyer, Danofrth, or Voracek will be activated off of IR on time. So, without anybody coming back in a trade, at least one of Chinakhov, Sillinger, Marchenko, and Johnson would not be able to be sent down.

Additionally, the team only gets four non-emergency recalls post-TDL. So I would look to see them pick up an expiring contract or two in any trades, if the goal is to get as many guys as possible eligible for the AHL playoffs. That or another waiver pick-up potentially.

 

[HHel]

Chinakhov and his shot already practically brings everything Laine does, and he doesn’t have the negative impact on the team where guys are forcing him the puck to make him happy.

Yes and his 4 goals. Practically same.

Laine is one grumpy guy, who only wants puck to him self.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Chinakhov and his shot already practically brings everything Laine does, and he doesn’t have the negative impact on the team where guys are forcing him the puck to make him happy.

i love chinny, and i get that laine can be frustrating to watch, but this is an absurd claim.

since the start of last year:

patrik laine: 42-49–91 in 98 GP

yegor chinakhov: 11-16–27 in 92 GP

chinny was on pace for ~35 points before getting injured and missing two months. there are real flaws with laine's game, too, and even when he's playing well he can look a bit gangly/awkward out there (a byproduct of being so lanky), but his playmaking is easily the second best on this roster.

Posted in the Laine thread, but he has 91 points in his last 98 games here. Not a lot of teams are going to want to trade for his cap hit with his term.

laine has plenty of trade value and his contract isn't even bad for his production. he's neither untouchable nor untradeable. i think they'd move him straight up for a weegar type defenseman with term. otherwise he's probably more valuable to the jackets as a roster piece than in a trade.

Goalies: if Korpi is traded, you're essentially going to have to burn a spot on Tarasov or Greaves, making them ineligible for the AHL playoffs, pending a waiver pickup or taking a warm body back in some trade

i believe they could make an emergency recall without making one of those guys ineligible. or they could sign someone to a PTO or sign a warm body for the rest of the season.

 

[Marioesque]

i love chinny, and i get that laine can be frustrating to watch, but this is an absurd claim.

Just consider the source

 

[majormajor]

Laine had to develop other aspects to his game.

I highly suggest this article from the Athletic: This type of one-time shot almost never goes in. So why do NHLers keep taking it?

Here's an important quote:


Simply put, one-timers just aren't very effective anymore. If that's all you have to offer, it's not much at all.

To actually be a productive scorer, Laine has to have multiple tools at his disposal including the pass and the ability to skate the puck in the offensive zone.

Even if we say Laine is twice as dangerous with an unscreened one-timer from the circle as your average NHLer, that only amounts to about a 1.2% chance of scoring which is much lower than the typical 10-12% shooting average.

Unless he has an open goal, clapping bombs is by far a non-economical use of offensive possession. In all likelihood, he is probably being heavily coached to PASS UP shots in favor of statistically more productive plays.

Just to be clear, we are talking about very far back one-timers, not the one-timer from in the circle?

 

[thebus88]

i love chinny, and i get that laine can be frustrating to watch, but this is an absurd claim.

Just consider the source

………..

but his playmaking is easily the second best on this roster.

Gaudreau, Johnson, Nyquist, Voracek, Boqvist….6th best “playmaker”, at the very most.