Buffalo Bills 2023 Summer - Post-Draft and Pre-Camp Talk

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What position do you want the Bills to draft round 1?

  • RB

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • WR

    Votes: 15 22.1%
  • TE

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • OL

    Votes: 11 16.2%
  • DE

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • DL

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • LB

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • CB

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • S

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Trade out of first round

    Votes: 24 35.3%

  • Total voters
    68
  • Poll closed .
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A friend of mine just made a great comp for Kincaid that I’m now obsessed with:

Cooper Kupp

What sort of WR were you looking for exactly? A guy for the outside? For the Slot? A Dynamic/Speedy guy? A good Route Runner? A Big Guy?
I know you didn’t ask me, but personally if the value is there I’d love them to grab an upside boundary receiver to stash for 2024 and beyond. Tyler Scott is someone I specifically have my eyes on. Young, played X, high end skill.
 
My pros to the pick:
- I actually like that he's 23. As a TE where it takes longer to develop, that might not be the case here.
- I'd imagine they had a 1st round grade on him. So to get one of them, even with the trade up is a win.
- As mentioned a lot here, scheming him in and confusing defenses will be a win. Maybe some motion? Line up in line and then spread out the formation pre snap.

Cons that stick out:
- This was TE heavy draft. So, would it have been that much of a downgrade to grab one on day 2? Compared to other positions in the draft that aren't nearly as deep. Maybe it was, especially if this kid is worth the 1st round grade.

- Was it really a need? If he's running routes out of the slot, then yes. But still, it's a tight end and we just locked ours up last year and wouldn't move on for another two years.

- Did we really need to move up and burn an asset? Why not let him come to you, then, if he doesn't then simply trade back.
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All in all, I like it a good amount. So don't let the con list fool ya. It'll really come down to how he looks and is utilized.
 
A friend of mine just made a great comp for Kincaid that I’m now obsessed with:

Cooper Kupp
I don't see it. Kincaid is significantly bigger (2 inches and 40 pounds worth right now). I think all the talk about how he's "really a WR" has people going a little bit overboard right now. Judging from the scouting reports he's going to be a better blocker than most WR's ("a willing blocker") but not really a quick twitch type WR (a tendancy to round off his routes rather than making sharp cuts was one of the cons I saw on him, which is not abnormal for a guy who's bigger than a "normal" WR).

He's small - for a tight end. He is not at all small as pass catching options go. (see here: Dalton Kincaid - MockDraftable )
 
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I don't see it. Kincaid is significantly bigger (2 inches and 40 pounds worth right now). I think all the talk about how he's "really a WR" has people going a little bit overboard right now. Judging from the scouting reports he's going to be a better blocker than most WR's ("a willing blocker") but not really a quick twitch type WR (a tendancy to round off his routes rather than making sharp cuts was one of the cons I saw on him, which is not abnormal for a guy who's bigger than a "normal" WR).

He's small - for a tight end. He is not at all small as pass catching options go. (see here: Dalton Kincaid - MockDraftable )
I think if you watch them play and see how they win you’ll see it. They’re both very heady players that win first and foremost with intelligence and by reading the defense and who also have plus route running and contested catch. I also think they’re probably closer in play size than combine testing suggests, since Kincaid would’ve been bulking for his weigh in since he wasn’t doing any testing. I bet his play weight is about 230 and Kupps is in the 210-220 range.
 
I think if you watch them play and see how they win you’ll see it. They’re both very heady players that win first and foremost with intelligence and by reading the defense and who also have plus route running and contested catch. I also think they’re probably closer in play size than combine testing suggests, since Kincaid would’ve been bulking for his weigh in since he wasn’t doing any testing. I bet his play weight is about 230 and Kupps is in the 210-220 range.
He's also winning against college guys on tape while Kupp is and has been winning against pros.

The huge advantage of Kincaid is going to be when (if?) he can eat up the big nickel in the run game, while being uncoverable by LB's in the pass game. That's the matchup nightmare for opponents - you're screwed in both base and nickel.

As for size, I guess we'll see. Certainly we'll see him in the slot more than a bit, but him being capable of playing TE will also be a huge advantage when it comes to motion and manipulating matchups pre-snap. I highly doubt the Bills only plan on him playing out of the slot and would like to see him not be overwhelmed when lined up on the end of the line. And even 230 would be a couple of standard deviations over the mean WR weight.

EDIT: Utah's 2022 roster also had him at 240.
 
He's also winning against college guys on tape while Kupp is and has been winning against pros.

The huge advantage of Kincaid is going to be when (if?) he can eat up the big nickel in the run game, while being uncoverable by LB's in the pass game. That's the matchup nightmare for opponents - you're screwed in both base and nickel.

As for size, I guess we'll see. Certainly we'll see him in the slot more than a bit, but him being capable of playing TE will also be a huge advantage when it comes to motion and manipulating matchups pre-snap. I highly doubt the Bills only plan on him playing out of the slot and would like to see him not be overwhelmed when lined up on the end of the line. And even 230 would be a couple of standard deviations over the mean WR weight.
We’ll see for sure. Beanes presser sounded like they have very little intention of using him in-line and their primary deployment of him will be in the slot. Whether they ask him to bulk or cut will definitely be enlightening toward their long term plans for him.
 
Sal is really the only rational football guy over there. He seemed to have to talk everyone else off the ledge last night and today and began sounding a little frustrated despite saying TE was a sneaky need of late.


The video I saw Mayer looked slow to the eye, but he did make plays. Dallas passing on him is very telling I think. There are still strong TE's available today.
Sal, Brown and Tasker are the only ones I'll tolerate. Everyone else has me reaching for the console.
 
Couple interesting Steeler notes here, one re Bergeron, the other speculation about the price to move up to 32


 
rain in KC tonight btw

Wonder if the Chiefs were in on Kincaid ? They took pass rusher at 31 so that could of been it too.
 
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If the comparisons for Kincaid to Beasley and Kupp are based on intelligence, reading defenses, and route running, I’m on board. But Kelce does that stuff too. And we don’t really make the Kelce comparison to either of those two. Because Kelce is a move TE, not a big slot receiver. Same with Kincaid.

If the Bills goes 11 with Beasley, and the defense goes nickel, the run defense doesn’t suffer and it’s up to the coverage to handle Beasley. If the Rams go 11, and the defense puts a CB on Kupp, the run defense doesn’t suffer and it’s up to the coverage to contain Kupp.

If the Bills go 12, they can do some 11 things, but the fact that Kincaid is a 246 pound TE makes things more interesting. Kupp and Beasley could line up in a tight receiver position, and no defense is going to feel threatened by them down blocking. Kincaid can do that, which creates a second D gap.

And it’s pick your poison on playing a nickel against the Bills 12 or a base defense. Look at the 2012 Pats. That was what the Bills are aiming for. That’s the dilemma that 2 TEs puts a defense into. It’s why I stated a while ago that I love 12 personnel.

Beasley and Kupp doesn’t do any of that, even for as great as Kupp is.
 
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So what are we thinking for the Bill's picks tonight if they do not trade, 9:45-10:00 & 11:15-30 ?
 
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Good for Levis, thats a good place for him long term I think

When someone gets the price for that move up let us know
 
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