Buffalo Bills 2023 Summer - Post-Draft and Pre-Camp Talk

What position do you want the Bills to draft round 1?

  • RB

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • WR

    Votes: 15 22.1%
  • TE

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • OL

    Votes: 11 16.2%
  • DE

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • DL

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • LB

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • CB

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • S

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Trade out of first round

    Votes: 24 35.3%

  • Total voters
    68
  • Poll closed .
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Expecting a 31 yo player to suddenly be able do something effectively, which they have never been relied upon to do before in their career... sounds like pure hope. Sure it could happen - but i wouldn't bet on it.

Don't brush it off like it's some kind of trivial responsibility which anyone can learn to do. If it were that easy, then I'm pretty sure someone already on the roster would have picked it up by now & ran with the opportunity.

And where did i say that a potential replacement needed to be an exact clone of Edmunds? I just want(ed) someone either with recently proven NFL ability (not Kirksey) or a prospect with realistic potential to fill the role (again not Kirksey).

If he turns out to be the answer there, then I'll obviously hope he does as well as he can. But don't act like signing him is a foregone conclusion to effectively filling the position, because it isn't. That's akin to watching them sign Jermaine Ifedi then thinking 'Bills finally filled that RT slot, great job Beane'. The only difference is that Kirksey is a name which more people have heard of.
What exactly are you referring to?

I'm no expert on Kirksey, so I'm just relying on what reporters have said about him:

Texans analyst John Harris in 2022: "He's a leader on this team, wearing the green dot as the communicator between the sideline and the huddle. He has a great way with young players and provides leadership regardless of any situation. . . . What Kirksey gives the Texans that they've lacked for YEARS is the fact that he was such an asset in pass coverage. He had eight passes defensed which was the top total for a player returning to the Texans in 2022. He's vital as a middle of the field player in Tampa 2 coverage but his ability and intellect reading routes and route combinations helps the defense in all facets of pass coverage."

Basically this is my impression of him. A smart, coverage LB that is undersized and probably losing a step at this stage in his career. I look at him as a major upgrade on the Klein role in terms of someone that can raise the floor of the room by being highly intelligent, getting the defense on the right page, and being in the right position. He's getting older so probably doesn't have the speed to be highly effective anymore, and so hopefully Bernard takes the job and runs with it, but similar to the Odefi signing, I see this as a raise the floor move if all else fails.
 
Screen Shot 2023-08-31 at 10.33.26 AM.png


Joe Marino's pre draft report on Buechele
1693492429508.png
 
This MLB / RB discussion takes me back to the draught years, when we were all trying to figure out the best way to win games without a quarterback. And in the end, nothing mattered, because we didn't have our guy.
To further that, I fully expect us to alter the scheme to be less reliant on having an MLB that can cover the slot and stand up pulling guards. Yes, if they ran back the exact schem as last year with Dodson trying to do all that, it’d be a train wreck, but I just have to assume they modify the scheme to accommodate not having Edmunds.
 
What exactly are you referring to?

I'm no expert on Kirksey, so I'm just relying on what reporters have said about him:

Texans analyst John Harris in 2022: "He's a leader on this team, wearing the green dot as the communicator between the sideline and the huddle. He has a great way with young players and provides leadership regardless of any situation. . . . What Kirksey gives the Texans that they've lacked for YEARS is the fact that he was such an asset in pass coverage. He had eight passes defensed which was the top total for a player returning to the Texans in 2022. He's vital as a middle of the field player in Tampa 2 coverage but his ability and intellect reading routes and route combinations helps the defense in all facets of pass coverage."

Basically this is my impression of him. A smart, coverage LB that is undersized and probably losing a step at this stage in his career. I look at him as a major upgrade on the Klein role in terms of someone that can raise the floor of the room by being highly intelligent, getting the defense on the right page, and being in the right position. He's getting older so probably doesn't have the speed to be highly effective anymore, and so hopefully Bernard takes the job and runs with it, but similar to the Odefi signing, I see this as a raise the floor move if all else fails.
Damn, as a 35-year-old it hurts to read a 31-year-old is past his prime!

I agree with this post, though. He gives us better depth and a chance of starting and not looking too out of place. These are the types of players we're going to get at this time of year.

I'm still a bit peeved they didn't address the position enough during the offseason. I understand a solid RT is extremely hard to come by, so I'm more understanding of not finding a Brown replacement, but MLB? That position should be much easier to find a solid player (doesn't have to be elite, obviously)

View attachment 740083

Joe Marino's pre draft report on Buechele
View attachment 740080
Geez. I don't know enough about Broeker to comment in-depth, but I hope we're not kicking ourselves for exposing him.
 
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Expecting a 31 yo player to suddenly be able do something effectively, which they have never been relied upon to do before in their career... sounds like pure hope. Sure it could happen - but i wouldn't bet on it.

Don't brush it off like it's some kind of trivial responsibility which anyone can learn to do. If it were that easy, then I'm pretty sure someone already on the roster would have picked it up by now & ran with the opportunity.

And where did i say that a potential replacement needed to be an exact clone of Edmunds? I just want(ed) someone either with recently proven NFL ability (not Kirksey) or a prospect with realistic potential to fill the role (again not Kirksey).

If he turns out to be the answer there, then I'll obviously hope he does as well as he can. But don't act like signing him is a foregone conclusion to effectively filling the position, because it isn't. That's akin to watching them sign Jermaine Ifedi then thinking 'Bills finally filled that RT slot, great job Beane'. The only difference is that Kirksey is a name which more people have heard of.

Sometimes I think people argue just to argue.
 
Two quick thoughts:

I like that the Bills are getting no love from the national media, and aren’t the pre-season darlings. I think that hurt them last year. Last season the Chiefs got a lot of what Buffalo is getting now. It can depressurize the team. After KC lost to Buffalo last season, they just stopped getting talked about for a while. The Chiefs lost to the Colts and the Bills, won some tight games that shouldn’t have been tight, and we’re 4-2. Next thing we know, they’re 9-2, lose to the Bengals, and the ran the rest of the season. So let the Bills just stay out of the news. It’s a good thing.

When you’ve got a contending roster and are at the cap, you’re not raising the ceiling without doing something like signing Von Miller. Beane is raising the floor. The goal is that a reserve can come in and the team doesn’t lose much. The Bills have Edwards, Bates, and Idefi as offensive line reserves, as an example. If any of them plays, the Bills won’t lose much. Adding Kirksey is just giving the defense a baseline level of competent at MLB. He can call the defense, play coverage, and not get you killed in the run game. That’s how you patch up a contending roster.
 
Two quick thoughts:

I like that the Bills are getting no love from the national media, and aren’t the pre-season darlings. I think that hurt them last year. Last season the Chiefs got a lot of what Buffalo is getting now. It can depressurize the team. After KC lost to Buffalo last season, they just stopped getting talked about for a while. The Chiefs lost to the Colts and the Bills, won some tight games that shouldn’t have been tight, and we’re 4-2. Next thing we know, they’re 9-2, lose to the Bengals, and the ran the rest of the season. So let the Bills just stay out of the news. It’s a good thing.

When you’ve got a contending roster and are at the cap, you’re not raising the ceiling without doing something like signing Von Miller. Beane is raising the floor. The goal is that a reserve can come in and the team doesn’t lose much. The Bills have Edwards, Bates, and Idefi as offensive line reserves, as an example. If any of them plays, the Bills won’t lose much. Adding Kirksey is just giving the defense a baseline level of competent at MLB. He can call the defense, play coverage, and not get you killed in the run game. That’s how you patch up a contending roster.
Florio had Bills the worst team in the division. It is just a trendy take for hits. Everyone want's to predict the fall of a juggernaut before it happens, which it won't. Jets will implode as always, Tua will get stepped on and be out for the year. Patriots will suck (duh).
 
What exactly are you referring to?

I'm no expert on Kirksey, so I'm just relying on what reporters have said about him:

Texans analyst John Harris in 2022: "He's a leader on this team, wearing the green dot as the communicator between the sideline and the huddle. He has a great way with young players and provides leadership regardless of any situation. . . . What Kirksey gives the Texans that they've lacked for YEARS is the fact that he was such an asset in pass coverage. He had eight passes defensed which was the top total for a player returning to the Texans in 2022. He's vital as a middle of the field player in Tampa 2 coverage but his ability and intellect reading routes and route combinations helps the defense in all facets of pass coverage."

Basically this is my impression of him. A smart, coverage LB that is undersized and probably losing a step at this stage in his career. I look at him as a major upgrade on the Klein role in terms of someone that can raise the floor of the room by being highly intelligent, getting the defense on the right page, and being in the right position. He's getting older so probably doesn't have the speed to be highly effective anymore, and so hopefully Bernard takes the job and runs with it, but similar to the Odefi signing, I see this as a raise the floor move if all else fails.
One might also intuit a portion of the Bills interest in Kirksey is to add a 2nd coach besides the position coach to help Dodson or whomever else build better / faster skills in the mental and on-field communication aspects of the game. As opposed to the Bills bringing in a younger, rawer, physical talent who lacked all those mental / communication skills & experience.
Sometimes I think people argue just to argue.
I disagree!!!!



:sarcasm:
 
Florio had Bills the worst team in the division. It is just a trendy take for hits. Everyone want's to predict the fall of a juggernaut before it happens, which it won't. Jets will implode as always, Tua will get stepped on and be out for the year. Patriots will suck (duh).

People don’t want to remember how awful the dolphins were down the stretch with Tua. Or how they virtually beat only bad teams outside of implosions of the bills and ravens. Or that the they were a 9 win team
 
Florio had Bills the worst team in the division. It is just a trendy take for hits. Everyone want's to predict the fall of a juggernaut before it happens, which it won't. Jets will implode as always, Tua will get stepped on and be out for the year. Patriots will suck (duh).
Being a Clemson alumna, my wife has followed Tua through his 'Bama career and into the pros. She strongly believes Tua should retire before he is killed on the field or receives serious brain damage.
We're exploring attending the 1-Oct Dolphins game in BUF and/or the Bills season-ender in MIA.
 
To further that, I fully expect us to alter the scheme to be less reliant on having an MLB that can cover the slot and stand up pulling guards. Yes, if they ran back the exact schem as last year with Dodson trying to do all that, it’d be a train wreck, but I just have to assume they modify the scheme to accommodate not having Edmunds.

Not sure I understand what you mean here.

McD runs a base nickel with mostly cover-3 and quarters coverages. They play some alignment games presnap to disguise what they're doing, and he will also design some creeper blitz packages off those base looks, but he's still mostly a C3/C4 guy.



I'm not sure how you change the responsibilities of the MLB in a C3 or C4 defense. In any zone defense, the MLB is going to have cover guys crossing through their zone.
 
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Being a Clemson alumna, my wife has followed Tua through his 'Bama career and into the pros. She strongly believes Tua should retire before he is killed on the field or receives serious brain damage.
We're exploring attending the 1-Oct Dolphins game in BUF and/or the Bills season-ender in MIA.
You hate to see it, but its a real risk for that guy. Could be a good game though.
 
Not sure I understand what you mean here.

McD runs a base nickel with mostly cover-3 and quarters coverages. They play some alignment games presnap to disguise what they're doing, and he will also design some creeper blitz packages off those base looks, but he's still mostly a C3/C4 guy.



I'm not sure how you change the responsibilities of the MLB in a C3 or C4 defense. In any zone defense, the MLB is going to have cover guys crossing through their zone.

Not sure I understand what you mean here.

McD runs a base nickel with mostly cover-3 and quarters coverages. They play some alignment games presnap to disguise what they're doing, and he will also design some creeper blitz packages off those base looks, but he's still mostly a C3/C4 guy.



I'm not sure how you change the responsibilities of the MLB in a C3 or C4 defense. In any zone defense, the MLB is going to have cover guys crossing through their zone.

You don’t change the MLB responsibilities, but you probably run a little less base nickel and dime on early downs against running teams because you don’t trust Dodson to handle the whole middle with 6 in the box. I’m not saying it’s great, but I guess my point is, McDermott has to know he can’t get away with not running heavy sets on 1st and 10 AS MUCH.
 
You don’t change the MLB responsibilities, but you probably run a little less base nickel and dime on early downs against running teams because you don’t trust Dodson to handle the whole middle with 6 in the box. I’m not saying it’s great, but I guess my point is, McDermott has to know he can’t get away with not running heavy sets on 1st and 10 AS MUCH.

So you're taking Taron Johnson.....who's probably our best tackling CB......off the field for another one of our middling-at-best LBs?

I'm not sure that's the answer either.

I get what Beane and McDermott wanted -- I get that they wanted Dodson or Bernard to take the job and run with it. I get that money is/was tight and they thought they could save money at the position. And frankly, I don't necessarily disagree with what they did -- when a team is paying a QB as much as we are, there will be sacrifices at some positions.

My hope is that the others on the defense step up to support what I think is the obvious weak link.
 
So you're taking Taron Johnson.....who's probably our best tackling CB......off the field for another one of our middling-at-best LBs?

I'm not sure that's the answer either.

I get what Beane and McDermott wanted -- I get that they wanted Dodson or Bernard to take the job and run with it. I get that money is/was tight and they thought they could save money at the position. And frankly, I don't necessarily disagree with what they did -- when a team is paying a QB as much as we are, there will be sacrifices at some positions.

My hope is that the others on the defense step up to support what I think is the obvious weak link.
I agree with this.

The answer is increasing the responsibilities for Milano. Obviously changing what Milano is doing has side effects as well, but I'd trust him to play a bigger role over having Dodson/Bernard try to fill in for Edmunds. But my hunch is they're not going to do that quite as much either.
 
The amount of damage the colts have done to their organization in one week is pretty impressive.

I’m not one to say just pay a RB but if you were going to make a case for a team that should, it would be a team with a high risk, high reward QB prospect that needs some shielding early in his career.

Good luck attracting a quality free agent that has options.
 
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