Boston Bruins 2023 Off-Season CAP, Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk XI

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BruinDust

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See I don't make that deal.

Both DeBrusk and Carlo still have about 7 good years of hockey in them.

Meanwhile Linholm has what ? 3 maybe 4 years.

Not giving up 14 NHL years for 3 or 4.

If I'm adding to DeBrusk it's not anything major. A 3rd rounder or a B prospect.

The bolded is a valid point. And what does Lindholm's next contract look like. Term is concerning with him. His new contract basically starting when he turns 30 and if he wants 7-8 years, taking him to age 37 or 38, very risky. He's no Bergeron. Most guys that age are long gone or on their last legs and no longer close to the players they once were.

I just think that's the realistic price when looking at what the Bruins have to offer and what the Flames are looking to get back (not futures). I'm not even confident Calgary would jump at that offer just it's a place to start.

I think the value of Debrusk vs. Lindholm is fairly significant and Debrusk + a pick or prospect is a clear downgrade from them and they can do better, elsewhere.
 

JOKER 192

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Lindholm is only two years older than both those players. How does he only have 3-4 years left while they each have 7?

I’m not advocating moving either, but Carlo has had quite a few concussions already, I wouldn’t exactly pencil him in for a good seven more years.
Ok fair enough, I should probably have done the research you did but the argument still holds. Your trading two assets who have about twice as much race track ahead of them as Linholm does.

Plugging one hole to create 2 doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.
RHD are not as easy to find as LHD. The proposed trade does not move the needle in the Bruins favor IMO it actually dials it back.

The bolded is a valid point. And what does Lindholm's next contract look like. Term is concerning with him. His new contract basically starting when he turns 30 and if he wants 7-8 years, taking him to age 37 or 38, very risky. He's no Bergeron. Most guys that age are long gone or on their last legs and no longer close to the players they once were.

I just think that's the realistic price when looking at what the Bruins have to offer and what the Flames are looking to get back (not futures). I'm not even confident Calgary would jump at that offer just it's a place to start.

I think the value of Debrusk vs. Lindholm is fairly significant and Debrusk + a pick or prospect is a clear downgrade from them and they can do better, elsewhere.

Well so be it then. The idea of a trade is to better your team. I'm not sure that's what would happen here.

If Calgary can do better more power to them.
 
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DiggityDog

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Ok fair enough, I should probably have done the research you did but the argument still holds. Your trading two assets who have about twice as much race track ahead of them as Linholm does.

Plugging one hole to create 2 doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.
RHD are not as easy to find as LHD. The proposed trade does not move the needle in the Bruins favor IMO it actually dials it back.
I totally agree with the package being an overpayment. I was just confused about the age aspect of it. If we had been talking about Scheifele it would have been different.
 
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goldnblack

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Leaf fan posting this??

I was curious to see how many players are traded pre/post arbitration. I came across this article. Sharing with you folk. I guess it's very possible the same can happen with one of Swayman or Freddy. Has Boston ever made a trade post arbitration?

CUTTING TIES​

In her column earlier this week, Rachel Doerrie wrote about how P.K. Subban's 2014 arbitration hearing was a watershed moment in the relationship between the defenseman and the Montreal Canadiens — who then kept him for just two more years before trading him to the Nashville Predators two days before his full no-movement clause kicked in.

Looking back through arbitration settlements over the last 15 years, the trend does lean toward teams moving on not long after an arbitration award.

Here are a couple of examples that illustrate how things can play out:

In 2019, Joel Edmundson went to arbitration immediately after the St. Louis Blues' Stanley Cup win. Coming off a one-year deal with a cap hit of $3 million — which he signed with the expectation that a long-term contract would eventually be forthcoming — he was awarded only a small raise to $3.1 million.

Edmundson had just one year left on his contract before becoming a UFA, and Doug Armstrong elected not to extend Edmundson. After the arbitrator's award, Edmundson was dealt to Carolina Hurricanes during the 2019-20 pre-season as part of the package that brought back Justin Faulk, who the Blues promptly signed to a seven-year deal with a cap hit of $6.5 million.

After a year in Carolina, Edmundson signed as a free agent with Montreal at a cap hit of $3.5 million.

In 2018, 24-year-old defenseman Brett Kulak filed for arbitration. He'd just hit a career-high 71 NHL games with the Calgary Flames while playing on a two-way contract at the league minimum.

Kulak was awarded a one-year, one-way deal at $900,000 by the arbitrator. But that was too rich for Brad Treliving's blood.

After he cleared waivers on Oct. 1, Kulak was dealt to the Montreal Canadiens in exchange for Matt Taormina and Rinat Valiev.

Neither new acquisition played a single NHL game for the Flames. Meanwhile, Kulak spent one more year moving back and forth to the minors before establishing himself as an NHL regular. When he was dealt to the Edmonton Oilers at the 2022 trade deadline, he netted the Canadiens the second-round draft pick they used on promising defense prospect Lane Hutson.

Kulak now averages more than 17 minutes a game on the Oilers blueline. He hit a career high of 20 points last season, at a cap hit of $2.75 million, which is perfectly reasonable for what he brings to the table.

STICKING AROUND​

While players and teams cut ties not long after an arbitration award, there are a handful of exceptions.

In 2019, Andrew Copp saw his cap hit with the Winnipeg Jets bump up from $1 million to $2.28 million on a two-year deal from the arbitrator. He stuck around and filed again in 2021, then settled for a one-year contract at $3.64 million two weeks before that scheduled hearing.

By that point, however, it had become clear that Copp wanted to move on when he hit unrestricted free agency one year later. At the 2022 trade deadline, the Jets got a nice package from the New York Rangers that included the first-round pick that would become Brad Lambert. Then, Copp cashed in for five years at $5.625 million with the Detroit Red Wings that summer.

Back when negotiations could continue after arbitration hearings, there are also some examples where the sides did come to terms on long-term deals, and stayed together for several years afterward.

Victor Arvidsson jumped from $650,000 on his entry-level contract to a seven-year deal at $4.25 million after his 2017 arbitration hearing, then remained with Nashville for four seasons before being traded to the Los Angeles Kings. And Tyson Barrie went from $2.6 million to $5.5 million on a four-year deal after his hearing in 2016. He stayed with the Colorado Avalanche for three more years before being moved to Toronto as part of the Nazem Kadri swap.

I'm less worried. This is a cap disaster year and it's just a manoeuvre. I think Jeremy knows the keys to the franchise are his, very soon.
 

hrdpuk

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I like JDB and Carlo, probably more than most, but I'd do that deal and then hopefully re-up Lindholm to a 6 years/9million per type of deal.

Again, I don't think they are winning a cup this year, so get Lindholm to anchor one of the top 2 lines for then next 6 years and build around him, Zacha, Pasta, McAvoy, Lindholm, & Swayman.

That's 6 top level talents to start with.
No way!
Lose a young shut down D and a young scoring forward for a not so young center weakens the team going forward.
 
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ON3M4N

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Sure. But it doesn’t have to be Bo Horvat.

Well Horvat is already signed to an 8yr deal, so I'm assuming you're talking about Lindholm. Lindholm over the last 3 seasons ranks 16th among centers in points and 32nd among all forwards in points. He's strong defensively and good in the dot. He checks every box Bruins fans could ask for in a center. I'm not as hung up on the pay him till he's 37 as others are. We see more and more players still being solid contributors into their mid 30's. So sure I'll take 6 good years of a guy and live with possibly two bad ones when the player starts to fall off a cliff. Not to mention the cap 7-8 years from now will be significantly higher and a $8.5 million hit won't see like a big deal.
 

ON3M4N

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Never stop being cheap Bruins management, that's the real 100 years of tradition.

In fairness this is pretty standard for any team. Both sides know what the other will do. The team will use a low comp, the player will use a high comp. They know the arbitrator will likely find a number in the middle. I personally like @DominicT idea about having the arbitrator pick one of the numbers. It would stopped low-ball/high-ball game each side plays.
 
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DominicT

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True, but I'd still love to hear the Bruins argument in front of an arbitrator about how Jeremy Swayman is only worth 2 million and here are some comparable players to prove that point.
You don't think its possible?

I guarantee its possible because there are all kinds of allowable stats to fit your argument. And it goes both ways.

The reason why they hate going to arbitration is because of those arguments. It creates hard feelings.

Go look at how many players have actually gone to arbitration and then resigned with that team when they became UFA. You might be shocked.

that a big differnce think this might get ugly and someone might be moved. Very low Number for the Bruins
You are absolutely wrong.
 

Hookslide

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Nov 19, 2018
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I'm a bit curious about this as well. I can't believe no one is interested in him, all I can see is he is pricing himself out right now. If it takes Carlo and DeBrusk that would open up some cap space for a move like Dumba.
I don't want Dumba and certainly not to replace Carlo.......
 
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goldnblack

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Dumb question, but if 95% of the time now this thing settles at 3.4, why don't these guys just do 3.4x1 now and be done? I know usually they do. I just wonder which side of the two is the one missing the obvious. Feels like the Bruins probably don't say no right now. So is Swayman the one saying no to 3.4x1?
 

Blowfish

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1690564694263.png
 

TCB

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True, but I'd still love to hear the Bruins argument in front of an arbitrator about how Jeremy Swayman is only worth 2 million and here are some comparable players to prove that point.
I guess in the end it all comes out the same and both sides know it was all pretty much a negotiation tactics, but why bother taking the chance of upsetting one party or the other. Its definitely time for a change that you'd think both sides would want and have each side submit a number and have the arbitrator choose one or the other. like you said I'd really like to hear the Bruins argument on why Jeremy Swayman is only worth 2 million.
 
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Shoebottom88

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Dumb question, but if 95% of the time now this thing settles at 3.4, why don't these guys just do 3.4x1 now and be done? I know usually they do. I just wonder which side of the two is the one missing the obvious. Feels like the Bruins probably don't say no right now. So is Swayman the one saying no to 3.4x1?
Good question. It’s probably more about term than anything.
 

GordonHowe

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Better hope the arbitrator is the fair minded sort. 2 million from the B's is, of course, way low given Swayman's performance and status as goaltender of the future.

On the other hand, 4.8 for a goaltender entering his third year in the NHL is also unrealistic and, if I may, presumptuous.

3.5 X 3 years sounds about right to me.
 

Shoebottom88

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Feb 4, 2019
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The picture is clearing up (underrated rabbit ears). No way Bruins keep two goalies at $5 million each in the long term. Swayman, Forbort, Merkulov for Scheifele & Dillon. Gryz to anyone offering a 2nd rounder. Puts to sleep the Gryz vs Forbort schism, while the Coyle is/isn’t a 2nd line pivot rages on.
 
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dugg133

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I'm far from a cap expert, but I've been messing around on capfriendly and if Swayman and Frederic come in at 5.8mil combined or less then we can just barely squeak under the cap with a full 23 man roster.

1690569715841.png


Doesn't leave them with much flexibility, don't even have the space to have guys like Merkulov, Beecher, or Lohrei to make the roster if they have great camps. Could always solve that by riding with a 22 man roster of need by though.
 

PlayMakers

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The middle ground on those proposed numbers for Swayman is $3.4 but if he comes in any higher than that they'll have a hard time fitting Freddy under the cap. At $3.4 for Swayman, Frederic would have to be $2m or less. Maybe they can scrape up a couple hundred k by moving some league minimum contracts around if Frederic get $2.1, but if Frederic gets $2.25 or 2.5 they'll have to decide whether or not to trade him or someone else to fit him in.
 
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