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HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

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Kudo Shinichi said:
I don't buy Basu's opinion about the habs not wanting two small one dimensional forwards in their top 6. They wouldn't have used a 1st round pick on Mesar if that was the case.
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If it’s true then they are wildly inconsistent. Sounds like Basu is doing the typical Habs PR spin for them already so they have excuses ready for picking an inferior prospect. I can’t believe we finally might have a chance at drafting a 1OA talent and we are going to pass based on politics.

For f***sakes, why did I choose this team as my favourite as a small child.
 
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Kennerback said:
Is it really Bobrov/Lapointe?

It seems more like when scouting teams No Drafted David Fischer, but here it would be a novel kind of No Draft, not emanating from the scouts themselves but a top down No Draft approach similar to the Charles Wang school of drafting. While the results were mitigated with the Islanders, maybe this is the time and place where it works.
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I'm not sure what happened to David Fischer, but I'm pretty sure that if both Bobrov and Lapointe want Michkov, then Hughes is drafting Michkov.
MarkovsKnee said:
Except we haven't reached on anyone. Every one of our picks last year was in range of their consensus rankings +/- 5 spots.

Our last real reach was probably Kotkaniemi.
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I was mainly talking about the Slaf pick and if we pick Leonard next week as they're the most important picks. I have to give you Slaf though since he was actually the consensus pick.

For Leonard though, there's clearly a separation between the top 5 and the rest, so even if it's just a pick after, it'd still be a reach IMO.

I'd also say that although Mesar was the consensus pick around our pick last year, both Kulich and Lambert were ranked higher and technically should've been the pick before Mesar if we went BPA.

Again, I'm fine with giving them the benefit of the doubt and hope they prove me wrong.
Goldenhands said:
They are passing on Michkov mainly because the risk factor is too high and because there are question marks about his 3 zones play. If a player is offensively minded only and has notable flaws in his game, some scouts will lean toward more complete players even if the upside isnt as high. The goal is to win hockey games, the show comes 2nd.
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I understand why they would pass on Michkov, but that still goes against what Hughes said: That they'd draft for talent first.

And again, despite Michkov's flaws, you can't say that he has way more talent than any after the consensus top 5. To win hockey games, you have to score more goals than your opponents and Michkov does this better than arguably anyone not named Bedard in this draft. You're leaving A LOT of talent on the table even if his floor might be lower than Dvorsky or Leonard or Reinbacher.
 
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BehindTheTimes said:
where there is smoke there is fire. Michkov 5th and Leonard 6th all but confirms to me that we will be selecting Leonard.

I don't like it, but I didn't like last years results either. At least I won't have to look at MB at our table.
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Hey not Bergevin fault, Pronger has never bring him his cofee :sarcasm:

I think Hugo are considering Michkov, if hes there i got a good feeling, but hey at least, Leonard could scores a lot of goals with Dach
 
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BehindTheTimes said:
If it’s true then they are wildly inconsistent. Sounds like Basu is doing the typical Habs PR spin for them already so they have excuses ready for picking an inferior prospect. I can’t believe we finally might have a chance at drafting a 1OA talent and we are going to pass based on politics.

For f***sakes, why did I choose this team as my favourite as a small child.
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Perhaps Basu and a couple of posters, believe in the heart of heart that Leonard or Reinbacher are really the best pick. Anything is possible. I don’t believe that the Habs scouts would. I don’t even believe any serious hockey person outside of Montréal thinks those prospects are anywhere near Michkov. This push for second rate prospects doesn’t look organic at all. It’s quite funny really.
 
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Leonard would a 100% be a reach by the Habs at 5th overall. No one can argue otherwise with Bob’s latest rankings. Our last reach didn’t go so well so my hopes aren’t high on this one.
 
Kennerback said:
Perhaps Basu and a couple of posters, believe in the heart of heart that Leonard or Reinbacher are really the best pick. Anything is possible. I don’t believe that the Habs scouts would. I don’t even believe any serious hockey person outside of Montréal thinks those prospects are anywhere near Michkov. This push for second rate prospects doesn’t look organic at all. It’s quite funny really.
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I don't think anybody is doing that though. Or, it's a pretty small minority. It's discussing the options in the event this team is one of those that will pass on Michkov for non hockey related reasons. We don't know if it's going to happen, but it definitely could. Trying to mock or shut down discussions on other options because MAH mICHKOV !! is dumb imo. Ive seen you do it by comparing Leonard to Lapierre which is basically taking a discussion, putting it in the garbage can and pissing on it for a few days. I get it, it's frustrating the team could possibly skip him, but if he's the next Ovechkin or Kucherov, everyone is reaching right from the number 2 spot.
 
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BehindTheTimes said:
If it’s true then they are wildly inconsistent. Sounds like Basu is doing the typical Habs PR spin for them already so they have excuses ready for picking an inferior prospect. I can’t believe we finally might have a chance at drafting a 1OA talent and we are going to pass based on politics.

For f***sakes, why did I choose this team as my favourite as a small child.
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To be fair, anyone picking after 1 is likely picking an inferior prospect. This isn’t a Habs-only issue. And it’s not another case of Timmins thinking he’s the smartest guy in the room. There’s a legit concern and we just have to deal with it.
 
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Andrei79 said:
I don't think anybody is doing that though. Or, it's a pretty small minority. It's discussing the options in the event this team is one of those that will pass on Michkov for non hockey related reasons. We don't know if it's going to happen, but it definitely could. Trying to mock or shut down discussions on other options because MAH mICHKOV !! is dumb imo. Ive seen you do it by comparing Leonard to Lapierre which is basically taking a discussion, putting it in the garbage can and pissing on it for a few days. I get it, it's frustrating the team could possibly skip him, but if he's the next Ovechkin or Kucherov, everyone is reaching right from the number 2 spot.
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But...muh michkov tho.
 
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Andrei79 said:
I don't think anybody is doing that though. Or, it's a pretty small minority. It's discussing the options in the event this team is one of those that will pass on Michkov for non hockey related reasons. We don't know if it's going to happen, but it definitely could. Trying to mock or shut down discussions on other options because MAH mICHKOV !! is dumb imo. Ive seen you do it by comparing Leonard to Lapierre which is basically taking a discussion, putting it in the garbage can and pissing on it for a few days. I get it, it's frustrating the team could possibly skip him, but if he's the next Ovechkin or Kucherov, everyone is reaching right from the number 2 spot.
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Agreed.

On the reaching from the number two spot part :sarcasm:

In all seriousness, I think Michkov is far and away the 2nd best prospect in the draft. I'll be disappointed if we don't take him but I've come to terms with it and do like Leonard a lot.
 
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SuzukiSZN said:
How is the 6th ranked prospect a reach at 5 exactly?
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Because there's a clear gap between the top 5 and the rest as seen by Leonard receiving ZERO top 5 votes in bobbymac's scout rankings.

All the top 5 got exclusively top 5 votes, while no one 6th or over received any votes for the top 5.

If Chicago drafts Fantilli, do you think that's a reach?
 
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Also, I must say the opinion of Dvorsky is very funny. Somehow, hes "safe" and "boring" and the same people rave about Leonard?

Besties, Dvorsky can shoot a f***ing puck and he does it better and in more ways than Leonard. Their playmaking is similarly non-dynamic and their inside games are both great.

If you think Leonard is an option at 5, you cannot prefer him to Dvorsky, it makes no sense. Hes the center. Hes bigger. He produced more head to head. Hes younger. He edges him skillwise. He has a better complimentary skillset.

Im not advocating for Dvorsky at 5 btw.
 
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Andrei79 said:
I don't think anybody is doing that though. Or, it's a pretty small minority. It's discussing the options in the event this team is one of those that will pass on Michkov for non hockey related reasons. We don't know if it's going to happen, but it definitely could. Trying to mock or shut down discussions on other options because MAH mICHKOV !! is dumb imo. Ive seen you do it by comparing Leonard to Lapierre which is basically taking a discussion, putting it in the garbage can and pissing on it for a few days. I get it, it's frustrating the team could possibly skip him, but if he's the next Ovechkin or Kucherov, everyone is reaching right from the number 2 spot.
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Look at it as the counterweight to people saying he has a great offensive IQ, he’s super skilled, great stickhandler, great vision, excellent playmaker, line driver, the next Tkachuk or Forsberg. Maxim Lapierre with a better shot and more goals actually is in the realm of possibilities.. The other observations are delirious overcompensation and self-justification because the guy passed over is Michkov.
 
AHShadow said:
I'm not sure what happened to David Fischer, but I'm pretty sure that if both Bobrov and Lapointe want Michkov, then Hughes is drafting Michkov.

I was mainly talking about the Slaf pick and if we pick Leonard next week as they're the most important picks. I have to give you Slaf though since he was actually the consensus pick.

For Leonard though, there's clearly a separation between the top 5 and the rest, so even if it's just a pick after, it'd still be a reach IMO.

I'd also say that although Mesar was the consensus pick around our pick last year, both Kulich and Lambert were ranked higher and technically should've been the pick before Mesar if we went BPA.

Again, I'm fine with giving them the benefit of the doubt and hope they prove me wrong.

I understand why they would pass on Michkov, but that still goes against what Hughes said: That they'd draft for talent first.

And again, despite Michkov's flaws, you can't say that he has way more talent than any after the consensus top 5. To win hockey games, you have to score more goals than your opponents and Michkov does this better than arguably anyone not named Bedard in this draft. You're leaving A LOT of talent on the table even if his floor might be lower than Dvorsky or Leonard or Reinbacher.
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Well they said they will draft BPA, not necessary the most talented player. BPA can be the most impactful player in term of overall play. If you factor talent alone, yeah Michkov is the obvious pick, but if you factor everthing else such as motor, size, IQ, compete, ect, then BPA becomes suggestive. Hughes said last year that he wanted to draft players who play the right way and what we hear from Michkov lately is that he isnt interested at the defensive side of the game and his game away from the puck flawed. And even if they have Michkov as BPA when everything is said, if they judge the risk factor too high, which is likely the case, then BPA will be decided among a small group that excludes Michkov for non hockey related reason. And it could be a combination of both as well.
 
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