HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

[SannywithoutCompy]

On both your points I ask:

Is there a long history of:
A) KHL teams freezing out players unless they sign extensions with them?
B) KHL teams not paying their injured players?

If there isn't a long history of either of those scenarios that you've extensively researched then maybe take a step back from your Russian fever dream.

I swear people's opinions on Russians here come exclusively from 80s action movies

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Friedman- What's your top 5

Marek:
1 Bedard, obvious pick

2, I want to say Carlsson because I think he'll make a lot of noise, but Fantilli.

3, Carlsson and this might be a steal

4, I want to say Michkov, but I think Benson.

5, Smith.

Friedman - Montreal would be very happy with Smith. There are people out there who think it's Smith, or Reinbacher for Montreal.

Marek - I wonder if San Jose trades down if they're interested in Reinbacher. Theyre interested in D and goalie.

It's on the latest 32 thoughts, towards the end. About 16 minutes left.

 

[WeThreeKings]

On both your points I ask:

Is there a long history of:
A) KHL teams freezing out players unless they sign extensions with them?
B) KHL teams not paying their injured players?

If there isn't a long history of either of those scenarios that you've extensively researched then maybe take a step back from your Russian fever dream.

There's enough of a history of both those things and other things happening in the KHL.

Maybe you need to accept there is some risks and some red flags on Michkov. NHL teams aren't in the business of talking themselves out of getting talent over unsubstantiated boogeymen.

 

[Kaladin]

Don't you love debating with posters who have no idea how contracts work but still chose to debate?

Is there where you inform the rest of us that there is a clause in KHL contracts where if a player gets injured he doesn't get paid at all?

We'll wait for your all knowing contract knowledge ser Schooner.

There's enough of a history of both those things and other things happening in the KHL.

Maybe you need to accept there is some risks and some red flags on Michkov. NHL teams aren't in the business of talking themselves out of getting talent over unsubstantiated boogeymen.

List out the examples then.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Don't you love debating with posters who have no idea how contracts work but still chose to debate?

Oh have you read through the KHL's legal regulations? Because if you had, you might have noticed this:
"1.27. In case the Hockey Player is not healthy due to any sports injury suffered during performance of the
Hockey Player’s obligations, the Contract cannot be terminated at the Club’s initiative until the Hockey Player
recovers his labor ability or is referred to any disability category"

 

[WeThreeKings]

Oh have you read through the KHL's legal regulations? Because if you had, you might have noticed this:
"1.27. In case the Hockey Player is not healthy due to any sports injury suffered during performance of the
Hockey Player’s obligations, the Contract cannot be terminated at the Club’s initiative until the Hockey Player
recovers his labor ability or is referred to any disability category"

Self own, those are rare.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Self own, those are rare.

1.25. In case the Hockey Player fully loses his professional capacity during participation in the training and (or) competition process of the Club during the term of the Contract, the Club on the basis of a medical expert conclusion shall pay the Hockey Player at its own expense during two months a one-time compensation up to the amount of 100 % of the remuneration (fee) sum for the season when the Hockey Player loses his working capacity if such one-time compensation in the amount of 100 % of the remuneration (fee) sum for the season is not covered by insurance payments under the athlete’s additional insurance maintained by the Club and (or) KHL.

So I guess if it were career ending, he'd still get the full amount for the season, assuming he was an absolute dolt and got no insurance.

 

[HabbyGuy]

Maybe you need to accept there is some risks and some red flags on Michkov. NHL teams aren't in the business of talking themselves out of getting talent over unsubstantiated boogeymen.

One would hope, because that's all I'm getting thus far from people and posters like yourself afraid to draft him. I guess we'll see at the draft. You keep pushing this negative bias towards him in anything discussed it seems.

 

[WeThreeKings]

1.25. In case the Hockey Player fully loses his professional capacity during participation in the training and (or) competition process of the Club during the term of the Contract, the Club on the basis of a medical expert conclusion shall pay the Hockey Player at its own expense during two months a one-time compensation up to the amount of 100 % of the remuneration (fee) sum for the season when the Hockey Player loses his working capacity if such one-time compensation in the amount of 100 % of the remuneration (fee) sum for the season is not covered by insurance payments under the athlete’s additional insurance maintained by the Club and (or) KHL.

So I guess if it were career ending, he'd still get the full amount for the season, assuming he was an absolute dolt and got no insurance.

Insurance which he would also have gotten if he came over to the NHL and got on an ELC. Would also be making more money on the ELC than in Russia.

The KHL contract was a bad move by him and it infuriates me that he signed it.

One would hope, because that's all I'm getting thus far from people and posters like yourself afraid to draft him. I guess we'll see at the draft.

I'm not afraid at all to draft him.. I'm just not going to put myself in a bubble and pretend there isn't a wart to be found and that there are no red flags or reasons for pause with him being in Russia for another 3 years.

I have not seen more than maybe 3 people who do not want the Michkov risk.. most of us want Michkov but understand if they pass on him, there are some legitimate question marks both in terms of him as a hockey player and him as an asset you can get over to North America.

If people are going to call someone out for a bias, they need to be free from bias themselves. No one is ever fully free from bias.. but I think it is healthy that we look at the green and red lights for all prospects. There's not one prospect in the draft I haven't unearthed a verifiable concern, that includes Connor Bedard.

 

[HuGort]

Looks pretty good to me

View attachment 719179

Ryan Leonard be outstanding pick

 

[HabbyGuy]

Insurance which he would also have gotten if he came over to the NHL and got on an ELC. Would also be making more money on the ELC than in Russia.

The KHL contract was a bad move by him and it infuriates me that he signed it.



I'm not afraid at all to draft him.. I'm just not going to put myself in a bubble and pretend there isn't a wart to be found and that there are no red flags or reasons for pause with him being in Russia for another 3 years.

I have not seen more than maybe 3 people who do not want the Michkov risk.. most of us want Michkov but understand if they pass on him, there are some legitimate question marks both in terms of him as a hockey player and him as an asset you can get over to North America.

If people are going to call someone out for a bias, they need to be free from bias themselves. No one is ever fully free from bias.. but I think it is healthy that we look at the green and red lights for all prospects. There's not one prospect in the draft I haven't unearthed a verifiable concern, that includes Connor Bedard.

I'm having a hard time believing you because I haven't seen anything positive come out of you in regards to the possibility of drafting him.

Only negative.

It seems any other option would be a better one than Matvei from you the closer we get to the draft.

 

[Schooner Guy]

Is there where you inform the rest of us that there is a clause in KHL contracts where if a player gets injured he doesn't get paid at all?

Use Google. There have been many instances where active players haven't been paid because their team wasn't making money. Some players have been asked to pay money back. This was even happening long before COVID, the Russian Rouble crashing, and oil prices crashing. Michkov's parent team is one of the richer teams so he might be ok if injured but nothing's for certain when teams are owned by organized crime lords and oil tycoons who have lost their fortunes. Just over a year ago, a friend of Putin was appointed head coach for Michkov's team despite having zero experience coaching or playing hockey. It's a bad movie happening in that league right now with all the corruption. It makes you wonder even more why Michkov signed such a bad long-term contract relative to what he could make in the NHL overnight.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I'm having a hard time believing you because I haven't seen anything positive come out of you in regards to the possibility of drafting him.

Only negative.

It seems any other option would be a better one than Matvei from you

This is my draft list, showing up until available players in the current HF Habs Mock.

A list I've posted multiple times.

The reason why it seems like this to you is because I'm one of the few people willing to bring up it isn't just this slam dunk, easy thing to just pick Michkov at 5.. and that isn't just me saying it, this is the stuff I've compiled from reputable sources around the media and combine since the draft lottery.

 

[jaffy27]

Looks awful to me. Arizona makes out like bandits with Michkov and Reinbacher.

Yet have been basement dwellers their entire existence

Leonard a Hab would be amazing as would Michkov or Smith, not really worried what west conference Arizona might do

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

This is my draft list, showing up until available players in the current HF Habs Mock.

A list I've posted multiple times.

View attachment 719236

The reason why it seems like this to you is because I'm one of the few people willing to bring up it isn't just this slam dunk, easy thing to just pick Michkov at 5.. and that isn't just me saying it, this is the stuff I've compiled from reputable sources around the media and combine since the draft lottery.

You're a lot higher on Sale than I was expecting

 

[WeThreeKings]

You're a lot higher on Sale than I was expecting

He might be a total wilting flower in the play-offs, that's a legitimate concern but his skill level is one of the highest in the entire draft.. at a certain point, that skill, in that skating/body, you have to be willing to gamble on it.

 

[Michoulicious]

The funniest scenario ever:

Montreal trades with Detroit #5 for #9 + #17.

Detroit drafts Michkov at #5.

Montreal drafts:

#9. Dvorksy
#17. Honzek
#31. Strbak

... and advances a bit further toward an all-slovak line-up.

 

[tooji]

I'm just seeing a lot of excuses for a guy that y'all want to draft so badly.

If his true goal was to come to NA, then he wouldn't have signed a 5 year contract when he was 16 years old.. and if you are saying that the contract signed without his input at all, then that is still a red flag because things haven't gotten -less- authoritative over in Russia.

i think parents and family could have had a say here, it doesn’t have to be some conspiracy

 

[HabbyGuy]

This is my draft list, showing up until available players in the current HF Habs Mock.

A list I've posted multiple times.

View attachment 719236

The reason why it seems like this to you is because I'm one of the few people willing to bring up it isn't just this slam dunk, easy thing to just pick Michkov at 5.. and that isn't just me saying it, this is the stuff I've compiled from reputable sources around the media and combine since the draft lottery.

Did these reputable sources also believe him to a be a 15 year old idiot? I'm curious. Are they all pushing anyone other than Michkov as a better option for Montréal?

 

[WeThreeKings]

i think parents and family could have had a say here, it doesn’t have to be some conspiracy

I didn't say it was, I was just ping ponging their idea that maybe he signed without having any input.. in which case, that would cause some concern, too.

That 5 year contract is a problem and I'd be asking a lot of questions to Matvei about why he did it.

Did these reputable sources also believe him to a be a 15 year old idiot? Curious.

There have been maturity concerns tagged to Michkov. I don't necessarily believe them but I can't discredit them, either. That's where internet scouts have to be aware of blind spots.

 

[HabbyGuy]

I didn't say it was, I was just ping ponging their idea that maybe he signed without having any input.. in which case, that would cause some concern, too.

That 5 year contract is a problem and I'd be asking a lot of questions to Matvei about why he did it.



There have been maturity concerns tagged to Michkov. I don't necessarily believe them but I can't discredit them, either. That's where internet scouts have to be aware of blind spots.

You literally called him an idiot. Lol

 

[WeThreeKings]

You literally called him an idiot. Lol

Signing a 5 year deal was idiotic, yes. He hurt his draft stock immensely, he's put his development in the hands of a team not super motivated to put it at the forefront and now he can't get out of it and is at risk of having to extend to play.

 

[HuGort]

Dvorsky is fine, but he isn’t a high upside pick IMO.

He’s a low-risk/medium upside guy in my eyes.

I can see him being a 40pt guy ala Dvorak as a worst case, but I have his best case somewhere in the Suzuki tier (60-70pts)

Would Lindholm be good comparison for Dvorsky?

 

[HabbyGuy]

I swear to god why does this team constantly do this to themselves? Why can't it ever be easy?? I hate being a hab fan sometimes. FFS!! Don't be stupid. Just take Michkov.

I guarantee we're gonna regret it if we don't.

 

[Playmaker09]

Why tf is the draft on a Wednesday?

And isn't it normally the 25th anyway? (1 week before FA)