HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

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WeThreeKings

Demidov is a HAB
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Yeah, and if he suffers a career ending injury like countless other prospects in a dangerous contact sport, or ends up with a freak ailment like Amirov, he's still set up financially for life from the age of SIXTEEN.

He is definitely not.

Furthest thing from a red flag. You're judging him so harsly over a decision he probably had very little authority over. A lot more likely he was just following what the people around him told him to do at that young age. You've really been drinking the anti Russia Kool-Aid all year.

Ah so he made a decision he had no authority over and that's not a red flag? There's concern he could be forced to sign another extension, probably not a good thing if he already signed a contract without being able to make that decision himself.
 

Kennerback

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Making 200k a year from 16 until 21 and potentially taking your parents out of the financial hole vs appeasing greasy posters on a hockey forum, I really wonder which one Id rather...

He's making money most of us make in 2-3 years and has been doing so since he's 16. If you're offered this kind of money at 16 and you say no because you might be paid that salary at 19, you're out to lunch and don't know anything about financial security. Money now is always greater than money later, especially for such a volatile environment as contact sports.
The contract was negotiated when he was 15 years old (that’s in 9th grade). It was signed on his 16 birthday. At that age, you need to convince the dad, not the kid.
 
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SannywithoutCompy

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He is definitely not.



Ah so he made a decision he had no authority over and that's not a red flag? There's concern he could be forced to sign another extension, probably not a good thing if he already signed a contract without being able to make that decision himself.
If the rumours about it being worth 1.15M USD, he most certainly is, if he's smart with his money. Even if he never comes over (say, due to a freak injury/ailment/politics), he's still set up financially in a place where cost of living is 2.3x less expensive.
 
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HabbyGuy

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Making 200k a year from 16 until 21 and potentially taking your parents out of the financial hole vs appeasing greasy posters on a hockey forum, I really wonder which one Id rather...

He's making money most of us make in 2-3 years and has been doing so since he's 16. If you're offered this kind of money at 16 and you say no because you might be paid that salary at 19, you're out to lunch and don't know anything about financial security. Money now is always greater than money later, especially for such a volatile environment as contact sports.
Right? And he's the idiot?
 
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Schooner Guy

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Jun 23, 2006
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They didnt tank. They half assed it. The superstar are in the top 5 and now theyre overthinking it and are gonna pick a sligthly better Lekhonen. They should at least be trading down IMO.
They had 4-5 rookies playing D for much of the season. They had Pezzetta and Kovacevic going in shootouts. The roster was filled with AHL players the last couple of months. The Arizona Coyotes finished ahead of them in the standings again. It was a serious tank job in a year where several teams scorched the earth to try to get a lottery shot at Bedard.

What's next? The Bruins half-assed their effort to win the Cup? :laugh:
 

HabbyGuy

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If the rumours about it being worth 1.15M USD, he most certainly is, if he's smart with his money. Even if he never comes over (say, due to a freak injury/ailment/politics), he's still set up financially in a place where cost of living is 2.3x less expensive.
Even if he's not, he's still better off than he would have been otherwise if he would have suffered a career ending injury.
 
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Kaladin

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Nov 5, 2017
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He is definitely not.



Ah so he made a decision he had no authority over and that's not a red flag? There's concern he could be forced to sign another extension, probably not a good thing if he already signed a contract without being able to make that decision himself.
You think when Auston Matthews went over to Europe that was completely his decision with no input from anyone else? When you're 15/16/17 you do what people around tell you to do especially your parents/agent. I'm sure it works the same for any prospect/young child. This isn't exactly a revelation. When he's 21 he'll have a lot more agency in his life just like anyone else.
 

Schooner Guy

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He would make more on an ELC with bonuses than he will in his KHL contract.
He would actually make more in one year of NHL salary plus his signing bonus than his entire 5-year KHL contract.

If the rumours about it being worth 1.15M USD, he most certainly is, if he's smart with his money. Even if he never comes over (say, due to a freak injury/ailment/politics), he's still set up financially in a place where cost of living is 2.3x less expensive.
If he was smart with his money, he wouldn't have signed that contract. The 5-year contract is backloaded too with his salary increasing every year for the entire 5 years. This was done to incentivize him signing for 5 years rather than 2 years and being free to leave.

He's getting peanuts the first two years. Xhekaj likely had a higher hourly wage working at Costco at that same age.

You think when Auston Matthews went over to Europe that was completely his decision with no input from anyone else? When you're 15/16/17 you do what people around tell you to do especially your parents/agent. I'm sure it works the same for any prospect/young child. This isn't exactly a revelation. When he's 21 he'll have a lot more agency in his life just like anyone else.
How many years did Matthews play in Europe after he was drafted? Apples vs oranges.
 

WeThreeKings

Demidov is a HAB
Sep 19, 2006
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I'm just seeing a lot of excuses for a guy that y'all want to draft so badly.

If his true goal was to come to NA, then he wouldn't have signed a 5 year contract when he was 16 years old.. and if you are saying that the contract signed without his input at all, then that is still a red flag because things haven't gotten -less- authoritative over in Russia.
 

SannywithoutCompy

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Dec 22, 2020
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I'm just seeing a lot of excuses for a guy that y'all want to draft so badly.

If his true goal was to come to NA, then he wouldn't have signed a 5 year contract when he was 16 years old.. and if you are saying that the contract signed without his input at all, then that is still a red flag because things haven't gotten -less- authoritative over in Russia.
You're missing the main point of everyone's argument: he was in a position to achieve lifetime financial security at the age of 16, in a sport that has seen numerous prospects suffer career altering or ending injuries, and sacrificed his first 3 potential years in the NHL for it.
 

AHShadow

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Apr 9, 2015
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Lets talk about a more interesting subject.

What is the archetype we aim for with FLA? If Cristall, Heidt, Lardis, Perron, Perrault are there, do we go for them? Cristall is a slam dunk for me, but what do you guys think?

Would you rather go for a RD? Brzustewicz? Willander of course if hes there, but he wont. Strbak, Dragicevic?

Do we go for more of a size/grit pick? Nelson? Ziemmer, Wahlberg, Rehkopf?

Its been so lame around here, lets discuss something else.
With the 31st I think I want a high-upside guy like Cristall, Perreault or Musty. Either those or Willander if ever he drops.

I also wouldn't mind a faller like Yager or Sale since maybe they come back to their D-1 form next year.

We need another Hutson pick and less of a Beck pick at 31 IMO. I know you hated the Mesar pick, but I he can be argued to BPA or at least close to BPA when we picked him last year so I didn't mind it even though Kulich would've been better in retrospect (for now).
 
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SannywithoutCompy

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He would actually make more in one year of NHL salary plus his signing bonus than his entire 5-year KHL contract.


If he was smart with his money, he wouldn't have signed that contract. The 5-year contract is backloaded too with his salary increasing every year for the entire 5 years. This was done to incentivize him signing for 5 years rather than 2 years and being free to leave.

He's getting peanuts the first two years. Xhekaj likely had a higher hourly wage working at Costco at that same age.


How many years did Matthews play in Europe after he was drafted? Apples vs oranges.
He was smart with his money, he took a guaranteed 1.15M USD (2.622M in buying power in Russia).

Lets talk about a more interesting subject.

What is the archetype we aim for with FLA? If Cristall, Heidt, Lardis, Perron, Perrault are there, do we go for them? Cristall is a slam dunk for me, but what do you guys think?

Would you rather go for a RD? Brzustewicz? Willander of course if hes there, but he wont. Strbak, Dragicevic?

Do we go for more of a size/grit pick? Nelson? Ziemmer, Wahlberg, Rehkopf?

Its been so lame around here, lets discuss something else.
BPA, BPA, BPA. Of those guys, Cristall would be my BPA.

I would love to draft Nadeau though, such intriguing tools, I'd be curious to see him develop (as long as they don't rush him Jost-style)
 

AHShadow

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Apr 9, 2015
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Damn, Buffalo is drowning in great forward prospects as is.
If we pass on Benson and he falls past 10, I really hope Kent tries to package something to get Vancouver's pick at 11.

Get a cap-dump, and swap the firsts.

If we skip on Michkov, I'd be ecstatic leaving away with Leonard and Benson.
 

WeThreeKings

Demidov is a HAB
Sep 19, 2006
94,768
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Halifax
You're missing the main point of everyone's argument: he was in a position to achieve lifetime financial security at the age of 16, in a sport that has seen numerous prospects suffer career altering or ending injuries, and sacrificed his first 3 potential years in the NHL for it.

His contract was broken down above, he ran the same risk as if he signed a short term contract in the KHL. He is now forfeiting way more money than if he signed a 2-3 year deal at the time.

It was a bad decision then, it's a worse decision now.. I won't hold the Ukraine thing against him, but there was 0 upside to signing 5 years in the KHL unless he actually wants to play in the KHL for a long time like Kaprizov did.

We can't pretend that there is no risk on the Michkov profile. As talented and tantalizing as he is, there are legitimate concerns but anyone who is saying it's Michkov or no-one, doesn't want to do an unbiased review of those risks.
 

Kaladin

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Nov 5, 2017
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How many years did Matthews play in Europe after he was drafted? Apples vs oranges.
What does that have to do with anything? WTK said it was a red flag he signed the deal at 16. I replied he probably had very little input on it just like Auston probably had very little input on his move to Europe.
I'm just seeing a lot of excuses for a guy that y'all want to draft so badly.

If his true goal was to come to NA, then he wouldn't have signed a 5 year contract when he was 16 years old.. and if you are saying that the contract signed without his input at all, then that is still a red flag because things haven't gotten -less- authoritative over in Russia.
This reveals your anti Russia bias again. The fact he signed at 16 was because his family/agent probably told him it was a good idea. Not because Putin sat him down in front of him and gave him a pen lol. If Russia is becoming "more authoritative" what does that have to do with his agent or family? Honestly you don't even try to hide it anymore. At 21, he can assert himself and his choice (which he has stated repeatedly is to play in the NHL) more confidently to his family and agent.
 

Schooner Guy

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Jun 23, 2006
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He was smart with his money, he took a guaranteed 1.15M USD (2.622M in buying power in Russia).
It's not guaranteed. I forgot to mention that his salary is cut in half when he plays in the MHL which has taken up a big chunk of his first two years.

No he wasn't smart with his money. I hope you're smarter with yours.
 

SannywithoutCompy

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Dec 22, 2020
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His contract was broken down above, he ran the same risk as if he signed a short term contract in the KHL. He is now forfeiting way more money than if he signed a 2-3 year deal at the time.

It was a bad decision then, it's a worse decision now.. I won't hold the Ukraine thing against him, but there was 0 upside to signing 5 years in the KHL unless he actually wants to play in the KHL for a long time like Kaprizov did.

We can't pretend that there is no risk on the Michkov profile. As talented and tantalizing as he is, there are legitimate concerns but anyone who is saying it's Michkov or no-one, doesn't want to do an unbiased review of those risks.
He really didn't. If he gets a career ending injury tomorrow, he's still getting paid the next few years.

If he hadn't signed that contract and got a career ending injury tomorrow, then what?
 

WeThreeKings

Demidov is a HAB
Sep 19, 2006
94,768
104,623
Halifax
What does that have to do with anything? WTK said it was a red flag he signed the deal at 16. I replied he probably had very little input on it just like Auston probably had very little input on his move to Europe.

This reveals your anti Russia bias again. The fact he signed at 16 was because his family/agent probably told him it was a good idea. Not because Putin sat him down in front of him and gave him a pen lol. If Russia is becoming "more authoritative" what does that have to do with his agent or family? Honestly you don't even try to hide it anymore. At 21, he can assert himself and his choice (which he has stated repeatedly is to play in the NHL) more confidently to his family and agent.

Because his KHL team can literally not play him anywhere unless he signs a longer extension with them?

He really didn't. If he gets a career ending injury tomorrow, he's still getting paid the next few years.

If he hadn't signed that contract and got a career ending injury tomorrow, then what?

He'd have the same money as he did now because in the KHL they aren't paying people who are no longer playing for their teams. Michkov isn't getting money in years 3-5 of that deal if he is unable to play hockey any longer. Do we really think a Russian Oligarch is going to pay someone to not play for his team?
 
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Schooner Guy

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What does that have to do with anything? WTK said it was a red flag he signed the deal at 16. I replied he probably had very little input on it just like Auston probably had very little input on his move to Europe.
The top priority for Matthews was to be ready and able to play on an NHL team as soon as he was drafted.
 
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Kaladin

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Nov 5, 2017
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Because his KHL team can literally not play him anywhere unless he signs a longer extension with them?



He'd have the same money as he did now because in the KHL they aren't paying people who are no longer playing for their teams. Michkov isn't getting money in years 3-5 of that deal if he is unable to play hockey any longer. Do we really think a Russian Oligarch is going to pay someone to not play for his team?
On both your points I ask:

Is there a long history of:
A) KHL teams freezing out players unless they sign extensions with them?
B) KHL teams not paying their injured players?

If there isn't a long history of either of those scenarios that you've extensively researched then maybe take a step back from your Russian fever dream.
 

Schooner Guy

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He'd have the same money as he did now because in the KHL they aren't paying people who are no longer playing for their teams. Michkov isn't getting money in years 3-5 of that deal if he is unable to play hockey any longer. Do we really think a Russian Oligarch is going to pay someone to not play for his team?
Don't you love debating with posters who have no idea how contracts work but still chose to debate?
 
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