Prospect Info: 2023 NHL Draft - Part 2 (Who Do You Want To Draft At #2)

[tomd]

I think this is a really important and nuanced distinction with regards to hockey IQ. We've seen players who lack it, Sprong, Sbisa, and Cogs are just a few that come to mind. These guys would straight up make poor decisions with the puck regularly, make bad reads, be in the wrong place/go to the wrong place, etc. I don't see that with Fantilli.

There are a lot of talented players with high hockey IQ who make bad plays because they are trying to push the envelope with their skills. I honestly think we saw that with Getzy a lot. I also was a big Spezza fan, and he made an innumerable amount of bad passes and turnovers over the course of his career, but nobody would say he suffered from low hockey IQ lol.

Yeah, I'm old enough to have watched Gretzky live both when he was in Edmonton and LA. One thing that always amazed me was how many "bad" passes he made each game. But a lot of that was a combination of pushing the play, trying things that no one else would try, and just thinking the game better than his linemates. The rest were just bad passes

 

[Anaheim4ever]

I think part of the reason Fantilli has haters on the mainboard is because they know he's most likely to go #2 and Anaheim is gonna have another physical franchise center again that teams hate to play against and high potential for him to better than Getzlaf.

I see Fantilli producing more offense than the guy he models him game after (Bergeron) but most likely won't be as good defensively as him because no one can be as good defensively as Bergeron lol.
That kind of player is one teams will absolutely hate to play against.
Even a Boston fan even came in here trying to make a trade proposal for #2 pick to draft Fantilli because they want the guy who models himself after Bergy.

 

[Boy Hedican]

Hey ducks, sharks fan here coming in peace. Seems the census is y’all want Fantilli which I totally get. CBJ is clearly going with a Center.

Besides personal feelings, do you see any way in which your club drafts Michkov? I wouldn’t be surprised, but I’m still thinking you take Fantilli. But I also won’t be surprised if you trade down for a kings ransom. But if his contract wasn’t an issue, and Russia etc, would you still think the club would take a C over him?

Anyway, just wondering cuz I’m hoping we take Michkov at 4, but I also think we may take the last remaining center and play it safe. At this point I don’t know who that will be. Smiths stock has risen a lot and they all have different skill sets.

 

[Ducks]

Hey ducks, sharks fan here coming in peace. Seems the census is y’all want Fantilli which I totally get. CBJ is clearly going with a Center.

Besides personal feelings, do you see any way in which your club drafts Michkov? I wouldn’t be surprised, but I’m still thinking you take Fantilli. But I also won’t be surprised if you trade down for a kings ransom. But if his contract wasn’t an issue, and Russia etc, would you still think the club would take a C over him?

Anyway, just wondering cuz I’m hoping we take Michkov at 4, but I also think we may take the last remaining center and play it safe. At this point I don’t know who that will be. Smiths stock has risen a lot and they all have different skill sets.

I think it's a close to zero percent chance Verbeek takes a swing at Michkov. Fantilli is just too good of a prospect, plays a more valuable position, and brings a bunch of intangibles that Verbeek values. I also really like Michkov as a prospect, I think he could end up as the better offensive player in the long run and I have him ahead of Carlsson. But I think all of us would be extremely, extremely shocked if Verbeek selected Michkov at 2oa based on his preferences and team needs.

 

[DuckRogers10]

There's also obviously far more factors at play than just production in a league (even if you somehow normalized it across different leagues) and height. There have been plenty of juniors who put up good numbers but were not considered top prospects. How do you factor in skating, style of play, team impact, intangibles, etc. into the size-less ranking? And even then, you're stuck projecting future development ... but how can you possibly know when one guy has more improvement left in him than another?

I bet some really good math geeks could probably come up with some algorithm to eliminate size bias while just accounting for other characteristics, but even if I were capable of it I wouldn't waste time doing it on a hockey forum. I'd be making huge bank doing it for an NHL team.


Not at all. The shaved head thing worked for him, it gave him a bit of Cro Magnon thing that was intimidating. But younger Mess had galactically terrible hair.

I was just joking

 

[Ducks DVM]

Hey ducks, sharks fan here coming in peace. Seems the census is y’all want Fantilli which I totally get. CBJ is clearly going with a Center.

Besides personal feelings, do you see any way in which your club drafts Michkov? I wouldn’t be surprised, but I’m still thinking you take Fantilli. But I also won’t be surprised if you trade down for a kings ransom. But if his contract wasn’t an issue, and Russia etc, would you still think the club would take a C over him?

Anyway, just wondering cuz I’m hoping we take Michkov at 4, but I also think we may take the last remaining center and play it safe. At this point I don’t know who that will be. Smiths stock has risen a lot and they all have different skill sets.

I think the contract alone makes him a no-go. The Ducks want to see significant team progress before 4 seasons from now. He’d be a fine pick for a team like Chicago ( whose cupboards are pretty barren and will benefit from another top 3 pick the next 1-2 years) or a team who had been a huge riser in the lottery because they had a playoff adjacent team, or a team that had just had a surprisingly poor season for injury or other reason. Anaheim doesn’t want a 4th shot at a bottom 5 finish in a 5 year period, they want a player who can contribute sooner rather than later.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

Think the only way Pat picks Michkov is if he has a deal in place pre-draft for a top 6 winger.

 

[ADHB]

Didn't PV already say in one of the interviews after the lottery that we would be adding size to our lineup with our pick? That eliminates Michkov.

 

[HanSolo]

I've just about finished watching this Canada game from the early morning. I'm really not seeing how we take anyone but Fantilli. People might as well order the nameplate. Carlsson will be a great selection for whoever gets him, same with Michkov. But Fantilli has such a wide variety of tools in his kit that every team wants in their top center. Blazing speed, relentless effort in all zones of the ice, a strong shot, great vision, skilled hands, good size...theres still things he needs to work on but the biggest knocks on him, primarily not utilizing his teammates enough and being too adventurous/experimental which results in turnovers,

I've seen none of that in the WCs. He's not cautious and responsible to a fault like Carlsson but he is usually making the smart play and relying on his linemates (who've been subpar) and he is for real the fastest player on the team. So with that, my takeaway is he made adjustments to his game which are proportionate to the quality of competition he's drawing up against.

This feels like a slam dunk. Like yeah the question might be more complicated if Michkov wasn't stuck on a KHL contract but keeping that in consideration, idk how you pick anyone else at 2 unless Chicago went rogue and picked Michkov.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I've just about finished watching this Canada game from the early morning. I'm really not seeing how we take anyone but Fantilli. People might as well order the nameplate. Carlsson will be a great selection for whoever gets him, same with Michkov. But Fantilli has such a wide variety of tools in his kit that every team wants in their top center. Blazing speed, relentless effort in all zones of the ice, a strong shot, great vision, skilled hands, good size...theres still things he needs to work on but the biggest knocks on him, primarily not utilizing his teammates enough and being too adventurous/experimental which results in turnovers,

I've seen none of that in the WCs. He's not cautious and responsible to a fault like Carlsson but he is usually making the smart play and relying on his linemates (who've been subpar) and he is for real the fastest player on the team. So with that, my takeaway is he made adjustments to his game which are proportionate to the quality of competition he's drawing up against.

This feels like a slam dunk. Like yeah the question might be more complicated if Michkov wasn't stuck on a KHL contract but keeping that in consideration, idk how you pick anyone else at 2 unless Chicago went rogue and picked Michkov.

Agreed across the board... no real need to complicate this pick... just go fantilli

 

[ScarTroy]

I've just about finished watching this Canada game from the early morning. I'm really not seeing how we take anyone but Fantilli. People might as well order the nameplate. Carlsson will be a great selection for whoever gets him, same with Michkov. But Fantilli has such a wide variety of tools in his kit that every team wants in their top center. Blazing speed, relentless effort in all zones of the ice, a strong shot, great vision, skilled hands, good size...theres still things he needs to work on but the biggest knocks on him, primarily not utilizing his teammates enough and being too adventurous/experimental which results in turnovers,

I've seen none of that in the WCs. He's not cautious and responsible to a fault like Carlsson but he is usually making the smart play and relying on his linemates (who've been subpar) and he is for real the fastest player on the team. So with that, my takeaway is he made adjustments to his game which are proportionate to the quality of competition he's drawing up against.

This feels like a slam dunk. Like yeah the question might be more complicated if Michkov wasn't stuck on a KHL contract but keeping that in consideration, idk how you pick anyone else at 2 unless Chicago went rogue and picked Michkov.

I agree, I was definitely originally team Carlsson, but that was purely from watching highlight videos. After watching both in full games, and seeing what each do without the puck, Fantilli is just a much bigger factor. He’s been ready for a few one timers that Zegras could send to him in his sleep, but his teammates here just aren’t thinking on that level.

 

[Boy Hedican]

I think the contract alone makes him a no-go. The Ducks want to see significant team progress before 4 seasons from now. He’d be a fine pick for a team like Chicago ( whose cupboards are pretty barren and will benefit from another top 3 pick the next 1-2 years) or a team who had been a huge riser in the lottery because they had a playoff adjacent team, or a team that had just had a surprisingly poor season for injury or other reason. Anaheim doesn’t want a 4th shot at a bottom 5 finish in a 5 year period, they want a player who can contribute sooner rather than later.

Thank you!

Makes perfect sense for y’all to get one of the big C’s, particularly Fantilli. Not looking forward to playing against y’all when we’re competitive again.

As yall may know, we’re early in our rebuild so Michkov’s timeline is fine. We need to place bottom 5 for a few more seasons. And I would just go nuts over a player like him in teal with a sharks logo on it

But if it’s between him and smith, and I suspect it will be, there’s a good chance GMMG goes with the high end center with a lot of Boston ties (Grier is all about it). Not a bad selection either. Michkov just has that potential for us to have a generational talent. Especially if we can get one of Eisserman or Celebrini next year

 

[Anaheim4ever]

I agree, I was definitely originally team Carlsson, but that was purely from watching highlight videos. After watching both in full games, and seeing what each do without the puck, Fantilli is just a much bigger factor. He’s been ready for a few one timers that Zegras could send to him in his sleep, but his teammates here just aren’t thinking on that level.

When I assumed we'd drop to #3 I was team Carlsson and when McKenzie said Will Smith is #3 ranked I was getting worried the Ducks could end up Smith at #3. Well now that the Ducks have #2 post lottery I've changed tunes to Fantilli becauss they now get the choice.
Honestly thought we'd miss out on Top2 pick and debate Carlsson vs Smith but that will be Columbus decision and I hope they go Carlsson so we don't see a 6'3 center in SJ for thr next 15+ years.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

Hey ducks, sharks fan here coming in peace. Seems the census is y’all want Fantilli which I totally get. CBJ is clearly going with a Center.

Besides personal feelings, do you see any way in which your club drafts Michkov? I wouldn’t be surprised, but I’m still thinking you take Fantilli. But I also won’t be surprised if you trade down for a kings ransom. But if his contract wasn’t an issue, and Russia etc, would you still think the club would take a C over him?

Anyway, just wondering cuz I’m hoping we take Michkov at 4, but I also think we may take the last remaining center and play it safe. At this point I don’t know who that will be. Smiths stock has risen a lot and they all have different skill sets.

SJ can have Michkov, that makes their future core very very small: Michkov, Eklund and Bordeleau all under 6'0 with the tallest being Eklund at 5'11.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Hey ducks, sharks fan here coming in peace. Seems the census is y’all want Fantilli which I totally get. CBJ is clearly going with a Center.

Besides personal feelings, do you see any way in which your club drafts Michkov? I wouldn’t be surprised, but I’m still thinking you take Fantilli. But I also won’t be surprised if you trade down for a kings ransom. But if his contract wasn’t an issue, and Russia etc, would you still think the club would take a C over him?

Anyway, just wondering cuz I’m hoping we take Michkov at 4, but I also think we may take the last remaining center and play it safe. At this point I don’t know who that will be. Smiths stock has risen a lot and they all have different skill sets.

We dont do peace with your kind bud

But seriously

I feel like there is borderline 0 chance we go for Mihckov. Fantilli kinda fills the void we had when getlzaf left.... differnet players stylistically, but he competes and is a big body. I think were also closer to contending than a team like san jose, and would want our 2nd overall pick playing with us by next year.

Sharks can prob afford to go for michkov (and may be a blessing in disguise), because you guys will likely have another 2-3 years of being towards bottom of standings, and mihckov is prob the 2nd most talented player in this draft. You have a couple big picks the next 2 years to add to eklund, and eventually michkov comes over and sanjose should be in a great spot.

SJ can have Michkov, that makes their future core very very small: Michkov, Eklund and Bordeleau all under 6'0 with the tallest being Eklund at 5'11.

Eh they got a couple years to find some size to go with that skill theyll be fine....

Michkov eklund and borderleau will be good skill players for them

 

[70sSanO]

FWIW…

The Columbus board thinks we should pick Fantilli on their poll.

Fantilli has the fewer votes and the sentiment is why even include him, he’ll be gone before the 3rd pick.

John

 

[Leonardo87]

Fantilli checks all the boxes for us. It’s not even just BPA, but what fits our team. The Michkov thing really makes no sense for us. Yeah he is a potential top player but he doesn’t fit our needs, And you are waiting potentially 3-4 years? There is also a risk he never even comes over to the NHL.

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

Verbeek either gets fantilli or smith.

if we choose Will Smith over Fantilli or Carlsson I would be super angry.

Smith is on a much lower tier than the big four, I don’t even think he breaks into the conversation of even breaking that bubble

 

[Leonardo87]

if we choose Will Smith over Fantilli or Carlsson I would be super angry.

Smith is on a much lower tier than the big four, I don’t even think he breaks into the conversation of even breaking that bubble

Smith is more like a Zegras I think. We don’t need another Zegras. We need a compliment for Zegras.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Smith is more like a Zegras I think. We don’t need another Zegras. We need a compliment for Zegras.

I doubt smith is anywhere near our list.

For what we have here already I prefer Leonard more than smith.

Fantilli and carlsson should be the only debate, and really it should just be draft fantilli

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

Smith is more like a Zegras I think. We don’t need another Zegras. We need a compliment for Zegras.

honestly, it’s like every other day I change my mind on the two players. The way I see it, whoever Verbeek chooses basically sets forth the direction for next season. it’s been discussed in the other thread - but he comes across confusing to me with what he says vs what he actually wants to do.

could be my own tin-foil hat conspiracy theory, but Verbeek has two scenarios with the pick:

say if he goes with Fantilli - high motor guy, extremely competitive, great offensive potential, he must have some tricks up his sleeve to make this team look much better come this offseason via trades, draft and free agency.

if I go by his word - over ‘seasoning’ prospects, I could potentially see him taking Carlsson. He could be that play making driving center that plays a responsible 200ft game (that unfortunately none of our center prospects do well)

 

[Anaheim4ever]

If Bedard wasn't in this draft class then Smith would be #3 pick. He's got a powerful shot too. So Zegras with a powerful shot.

 

[Leonardo87]

honestly, it’s like every other day I change my mind on the two players. The way I see it, whoever Verbeek chooses basically sets forth the direction for next season. it’s been discussed in the other thread - but he comes across confusing to me with what he says vs what he actually wants to do.

could be my own tin-foil hat conspiracy theory, but Verbeek has two scenarios with the pick:

say if he goes with Fantilli - high motor guy, extremely competitive, great offensive potential, he must have some tricks up his sleeve to make this team look much better come this offseason via trades, draft and free agency.

if I go by his word - over ‘seasoning’ prospects, I could potentially see him taking Carlsson. He could be that play making driving center that plays a responsible 200ft game (that unfortunately none of our center prospects do well)

What are the main comparisons to Fantilli and Carlsson? Fantilli is more physical? But Carlsson has more upside offensive potential? I think we have to see the pros and cons of each player, but both players will help this franchise a Lot. They are game changers, with franchise potential.

Really exciting time to be a Ducks fan, and it will really help to put last season into a distant memory.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

honestly, it’s like every other day I change my mind on the two players. The way I see it, whoever Verbeek chooses basically sets forth the direction for next season. it’s been discussed in the other thread - but he comes across confusing to me with what he says vs what he actually wants to do.

could be my own tin-foil hat conspiracy theory, but Verbeek has two scenarios with the pick:

say if he goes with Fantilli - high motor guy, extremely competitive, great offensive potential, he must have some tricks up his sleeve to make this team look much better come this offseason via trades, draft and free agency.

if I go by his word - over ‘seasoning’ prospects, I could potentially see him taking Carlsson. He could be that play making driving center that plays a responsible 200ft game (that unfortunately none of our center prospects do well)

I think mctavish is fine defensively, and i dont think zegras is nearly as bad as people say he is.

I think majority of our "defensive" issues came from Eakins system... and the fact that our defense wasnt really capable of transitioning out of the dzone(with exception to fowler).... as the defense gets better and more mobile, i think overall the rest of the teams defense will look better.

What we were doing this year with the defense we had, Bergeron woulda looked bad in.

I think you go Fantilli, and you def make more aggresive moves on drafty day and free agency... to give zegras terry mctavish and fantilli more support, and make the defense a little better.

Best way to do defense i think is via trade tho.... i dont think i want to sign any dmen to long term deals via free agency, we have too many good dmen coming up that need shots (tho i wouldnt mind Graves)

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I don't think for a second Verbeek actually is debating Fantilli vs Carlsson b/c Fantilli fits Verbeek's vision. I like Carlsson b/c he excels within a structure whereas Fantilli is overpowering with is elite speed and high level compete mode. Right now, Carlsson can make his teammates play better because that's his game. Fantilli is skating beyond his teammates, to where he individually looks amazing. In time, Fantilli should be able to slow the game down and play within a structure when needed, but be amazing in 3v3 b/c that's hero puck time. Carlsson does need to improve his skating and shooting, but, within a structure, I can see him planting himself in front of the net often for goals with his great hands. They're just two different types of players.

But we're not in a vacuum. We are adding Fantilli to Zegras, Terry, and McTavish. Verbeek wants a heavy game. Look at the forward prospects Verbeek has picked up in Gaucher, Hvidston, Wiebe, and Caulfield. They all have bite and Fantilli would be the best of the bunch.

I do have concerns about Fantilli's scoring getting throttled against better competition, but we have Zegras, Terry, and McTavish to pick up the scoring slack if Fantilli struggles early in his career.

Does Verbeek keep to his word and wants prospects overripen? If so, then Fantilli could stay in college another season. There is no 10-day tryout for NCAA players. Would Fantilli like playing in the AHL or return to college? Would Verbeek promise him an NHL roster spot to lure Fantilli out of returning to college?