2023 Free Agency/UFA Targets

[Frk It]

Speaking of which, in the juniors DeBrincat played with McDavid and Strome. Couple of quite dominant players in OHL and then DeBrincat got to play with Kane in the NHL. If we take all of these playmakers away, there would be far less hype around DeBrincat.

Red Wings doesn't have a playmaker like that and even if they had DeBrincat still demands way too much money. No point to mess up the cap structure for a couple extra goals.

He put up 50 goals and 100 pts in his draft season with McDavid graduated to the NHL.

Scoring 50 goals in your draft year is not easy to do. Are you saying he doesn’t have a high end shot?

 

[Gniwder]

These summer threads, man.

All I can say is you can tell who goes to a garage sale and offers $2 with a "take it or leave it" posture for the already underpriced $5 item.

You're talking to the same people who thought Tkachuk was gonna go for peanuts because he requested a trade.

 

[Detroit Knights]

We need to be really f***ing careful with capspace this summer. Not factoring in anyone that isn't already on the team, we could very easily see a $20M jump in caphit in '24-'25 with just raises for Mo, Ray, Ras, Kubalik, and Bergie.

To illustrate. Take our current roster. Add a $8M forward, $5M defenseman, $3M goalie, and another $1M defenseman. Retain Veleno and Suter at a combined $4M, they can fight for how it gets split. That's just over $75M. Ton of room right?

Fast forward to next fall. Give the 5 mentioned above raises. Retain Perron with zero raise. $93M payroll.

first off, your math is just not going to compute at all.

Why sign suter and Veleno? they do the same thing, just keep one and you can pay one of them for 1.5 on 3 years (veleno)

Also, why in the world would you retain perron? even on a pay decrease he is a liability.

Kubalik and berggren won't get huge raises. They have done nothing but show promise. That only get's you so far.

Sign chiasson to a low cap hit because reports have said DET wants him and he will be cheap (let's say 2x1.5?)

Ras has shown great glimpses, but hasn't done it for a full season, even then, you would give him a bridge deal around 3x5 if he just pops off this year (most likely 3x4).

Mo get's his 8x8 8x9 and if you sign raymond before this year begins, you can get him on a bridge deal of somewhere around 3x6.

Your math is just not computing and keeping some of the players you are suggesting is a worthless idea. If you take out perron, zadina, and suter. You can pay Debrincat or Meier (if that is how you are looking at things). Then, you bring up soderblom for 4th or 3rd line.

Then you sign one defenseman like a gudas who won't be 5 million as you suggest, probably closer to 4. Sign a backup goalie somewhere in the neighborhood of 3/year.

Roster:
Meier(9m) - larkin (8.7) - ray (6)
debrincat (8)- copp/kasper (6.5) - rasmussen (4)
Berggren (1.5) - copp/kasper (/\) - kubalik (2.75)
soderblom (900k) - veleno (1.5) - Fabbri (4)
Chiasson (1.5)
czarnick (can move him down to ahl if anything idc)

walman (3.4) - seider (8.5)
ed (900k) - chiarot (4.75)
maata (3) - gudas (3)

husso (4.75)
backup (raanta?) (2.5-3)

cap hit for 2024-25: 85.65 million
cap ceiling is expected to go minimum 3 mil after next year, so ceiling is going to be a minimum of 86 million.

This team, this team goes to the second round with ease and has to work to get to the third round. With the balance of scoring and passing and defense, this team would rival any one of our teams since 2013.

After 2024-25 season, the cap then will go up again and we won't have fabbri, cossa could be in play for 1B, chiarot becomes tradeable to arizona with 1 year left, ed is still on his entry level, and people will actually want to play in detroit again because we have something going here.

Then, you can promote the mazur/lombardi/wallinder/etc. to keep the costs down.

Where's my job offer for front office folks?

edit: this is the trades for debrincat and meier btw

 

[SantosHalper]

Are you saying he doesn’t have a high end shot?

No, im saying that DeBrincat needs to play with high end playmaker to be worth of his paycheck. Personally i don't believe that DeBrincat is worth 8 million a year, even if Wings had a high end playmaker. I would want more from a 8 million dollar player.

 

[norrisnick]

first off, your math is just not going to compute at all.

Why sign suter and Veleno? they do the same thing, just keep one and you can pay one of them for 1.5 on 3 years (veleno)

Also, why in the world would you retain perron? even on a pay decrease he is a liability.

Kubalik and berggren won't get huge raises. They have done nothing but show promise. That only get's you so far.

Sign chiasson to a low cap hit because reports have said DET wants him and he will be cheap (let's say 2x1.5?)

Ras has shown great glimpses, but hasn't done it for a full season, even then, you would give him a bridge deal around 3x5 if he just pops off this year (most likely 3x4).

Mo get's his 8x8 8x9 and if you sign raymond before this year begins, you can get him on a bridge deal of somewhere around 3x6.

Your math is just not computing and keeping some of the players you are suggesting is a worthless idea. If you take out perron, zadina, and suter. You can pay Debrincat or Meier (if that is how you are looking at things). Then, you bring up soderblom for 4th or 3rd line.

Then you sign one defenseman like a gudas who won't be 5 million as you suggest, probably closer to 4. Sign a backup goalie somewhere in the neighborhood of 3/year.

Roster:
Meier(9m) - larkin (8.7) - ray (6)
debrincat (8)- copp/kasper (6.5) - rasmussen (4)
Berggren (1.5) - copp/kasper (/\) - kubalik (2.75)
soderblom (900k) - veleno (1.5) - Fabbri (4)
Chiasson (1.5)
czarnick (can move him down to ahl if anything idc)

walman (3.4) - seider (8.5)
ed (900k) - chiarot (4.75)
maata (3) - gudas (3)

husso (4.75)
backup (raanta?) (2.5-3)

cap hit for 2024-25: 85.65 million
cap ceiling is expected to go minimum 3 mil after next year, so ceiling is going to be a minimum of 86 million.

This team, this team goes to the second round with ease and has to work to get to the third round. With the balance of scoring and passing and defense, this team would rival any one of our teams since 2013.

After 2024-25 season, the cap then will go up again and we won't have fabbri, cossa could be in play for 1B, chiarot becomes tradeable to arizona with 1 year left, ed is still on his entry level, and people will actually want to play in detroit again because we have something going here.

Then, you can promote the mazur/lombardi/wallinder/etc. to keep the costs down.

Where's my job offer for front office folks?

edit: this is the trades for debrincat and meier btw
View attachment 716206

Math, yeah...

Why am I keeping Joe, Zadina, Suter, and Perron? Because Yzerman will. Makes much more sense to factor them into the equation than pretending they don't exist.

You're a mil low (minimum) on Ray, Bergie, and Kubalik. Also on whoever will be the 7th D and Abby's buy out. That's 5 mil extra.

Like I said, we have to be really f***ing careful with our cap space this summer.

 

[jkutswings]

These summer threads, man.

All I can say is you can tell who goes to a garage sale and offers $2 with a "take it or leave it" posture for the already underpriced $5 item.

Yeah, I don't get it either.

Nobody is saying to cough up multiple first rounders and pay Debrincat $11M AAV. But it's also silly to automatically assume that it would take a gross overpayment, so don't even bother looking into it.

Every team should always investigate absolutely every option for making their roster better. Always. The only difference is what price they feel is worthwhile for their situation.

But the price of a phone call or two is never prohibitive.

 

[Detroit Knights]

Math, yeah...

Why am I keeping Joe, Zadina, Suter, and Perron? Because Yzerman will. Makes much more sense to factor them into the equation than pretending they don't exist.

You're a mil low (minimum) on Ray, Bergie, and Kubalik. Also on whoever will be the 7th D and Abby's buy out. That's 5 mil extra.

Like I said, we have to be really f***ing careful with our cap space this summer.

didn't know you had a direct line to yzerman and know he is going to keep 3 players that do the job of 1 and an aging vet that is useless to us after this year.

i guess that is the glaringly obvious indicator I just did not factor in.

berggren i can see how i am low, but not kubalik or raymond. to each to own i suppose. abby buyout is 1 mil, that's not going to do much and the 7th d we can do from within quite easily with wallinder/aljo. They would just get limited minutes until whoever got injured comes back. Hell, we could even run with 5 d and an extra forward since we have plenty of defense minded forwards and just not rotate seider/maatta throughout the minutes of the game (as they are both very good at being defensive defensmen).

Our cap space this summer is what it is, but the cap will then go up a minimum of 3 mil (they have reported that it should have gone up 3 mil next season, but they are holding off) so if that is the case, with the "game growing" and more revenue being brought in, the cap will go up more than 3. I just put 3 as the most conservative I could be. I actually think itll go up to around 88-90 mil in 2024-25.

 

[norrisnick]

didn't know you had a direct line to yzerman and know he is going to keep 3 players that do the job of 1 and an aging vet that is useless to us after this year.

i guess that is the glaringly obvious indicator I just did not factor in.

berggren i can see how i am low, but not kubalik or raymond. to each to own i suppose. abby buyout is 1 mil, that's not going to do much and the 7th d we can do from within quite easily with wallinder/aljo. They would just get limited minutes until whoever got injured comes back. Hell, we could even run with 5 d and an extra forward since we have plenty of defense minded forwards and just not rotate seider/maatta throughout the minutes of the game (as they are both very good at being defensive defensmen).

Our cap space this summer is what it is, but the cap will then go up a minimum of 3 mil (they have reported that it should have gone up 3 mil next season, but they are holding off) so if that is the case, with the "game growing" and more revenue being brought in, the cap will go up more than 3. I just put 3 as the most conservative I could be. I actually think itll go up to around 88-90 mil in 2024-25.

The same article you referenced regarding Chiasson mentions Suter as well. Zadina is cheap for two more years and Veleno is RFA. Perron is our 2nd leading scorer and an alternate captain. If he wants to stay he will. It's not exactly reading tea leaves here. It's nice and sensible steady as she goes from Yzerman.

Kubalik is crazy underpaid for what he brings. 20 goals and 45 points for $2.5M? He easily gets $4M on the open market. Bergie is looking at at least $2M on his bridge. Caufield and the Habs f***ed us on Raymond. It's a pipe-dream to expect him below $7M even medium term.

So again, that's $3M at least there. Abby is $1M. You say the 7th D can be from within, but again, that's $.8-1M of cap space on the roster. That's $5M on top of your $85.5M.

Not to mention no reasonable answer for 2nd pairing RHD. Chia and/or Gudas ain't it.

A lot of cap gymnastics are needed to fill the gaps. So you have to be sure on who it is you're investing big money in. That's my hangup with DeBrincat. He's not enough of a driver of offense to dictate what he's asking for, IMO. I'd much rather add slightly more to the trade package to at the very least get some cap relief.

With 2 picks and a prospect can we lure Kempe out of LA? Connor out of WPG? Keller out of Arizona?
Do we talk to Guerin and see what his plans are with $15M in dead space the next two years?
Do we kick tires on one of the Leafs that are expiring in the next year?
Do we talk to Grier and see what's up with his future and is say Hertl part of it? How much are they willing to retain?
There are a ton of options that, to me, are more viable than $8-9M on a 5'7" shooter that doesn't drive his own offense.

DeBrincat isn't the hill (bump?) to die on.

 

[ricky0034]

The same article you referenced regarding Chiasson mentions Suter as well. Zadina is cheap for two more years and Veleno is RFA. Perron is our 2nd leading scorer and an alternate captain. If he wants to stay he will. It's not exactly reading tea leaves here. It's nice and sensible steady as she goes from Yzerman.

Kubalik is crazy underpaid for what he brings. 20 goals and 45 points for $2.5M? He easily gets $4M on the open market. Bergie is looking at at least $2M on his bridge. Caufield and the Habs f***ed us on Raymond. It's a pipe-dream to expect him below $7M even medium term.

So again, that's $3M at least there. Abby is $1M. You say the 7th D can be from within, but again, that's $.8-1M of cap space on the roster. That's $5M on top of your $85.5M.

Not to mention no reasonable answer for 2nd pairing RHD. Chia and/or Gudas ain't it.

A lot of cap gymnastics are needed to fill the gaps. So you have to be sure on who it is you're investing big money in. That's my hangup with DeBrincat. He's not enough of a driver of offense to dictate what he's asking for, IMO. I'd much rather add slightly more to the trade package to at the very least get some cap relief.

With 2 picks and a prospect can we lure Kempe out of LA? Connor out of WPG? Keller out of Arizona?
Do we talk to Guerin and see what his plans are with $15M in dead space the next two years?
Do we kick tires on one of the Leafs that are expiring in the next year?
Do we talk to Grier and see what's up with his future and is say Hertl part of it? How much are they willing to retain?
There are a ton of options that, to me, are more viable than $8-9M on a 5'7" shooter that doesn't drive his own offense.

DeBrincat isn't the hill (bump?) to die on.

hell that's basically identical to what AA just put up and he just got $4.25 literally yesterday

and Kubalik is a year younger with less warts

 

[Frk It]

No, im saying that DeBrincat needs to play with high end playmaker to be worth of his paycheck. Personally i don't believe that DeBrincat is worth 8 million a year, even if Wings had a high end playmaker. I would want more from a 8 million

If you guys want to refrain from adding someone to this team that for sure makes us better, because of a possible potential future bad cap crunch that might not ever happen, go for it.

I’d be seriously looking at adding DeBrincat, or a Dubois/Schiefele/Lindholm.

You guys can let me know when these young players with no flaws become available that are willing to sign cheap/team-friendly deals.

 

[norrisnick]

If you guys want to refrain from adding someone to this team that for sure makes us better, because of a possible potential future bad cap crunch that might not ever happen, go for it.

I’d be seriously looking at adding DeBrincat, or a Dubois/Schiefele/Lindholm.

You guys can let me know when these young players with no flaws become available that are willing to sign cheap/team-friendly deals.

We definitely need to add. It just has to be the right type of player and at the right cost.

I'd be seriously looking at Connor, Keller, Kempe, Nylander, Hertl, DeBrusk, Meier if the Devils don't want both him and Bratt, etc... There are options that are a bit more involved in creating their own offense and aren't complete disasters as teammates. Oh and Lindholm would work. He'd definitively answer the 2C question barring some calamity.

They don't become available unless you draft them or they twist some other team's arms to join your team. That's why buyers should beware.

I'd much rather pay more in trade assets and get a better fit.

 

[kliq]

You're talking to the same people who thought Tkachuk was gonna go for peanuts because he requested a trade.

If you go to the Calgary board, he did go for peanuts.

 

[Frk It]

We definitely need to add. It just has to be the right type of player and at the right cost.

I'd be seriously looking at Connor, Keller, Kempe, Nylander, Hertl, DeBrusk, Meier if the Devils don't want both him and Bratt, etc... There are options that are a bit more involved in creating their own offense and aren't complete disasters as teammates. Oh and Lindholm would work. He'd definitively answer the 2C question barring some calamity.

They don't become available unless you draft them or they twist some other team's arms to join your team. That's why buyers should beware.

I'd much rather pay more in trade assets and get a better fit.

Fair points. I would be happy to pony up for a good player too, we have the assets.

 

[Gniwder]

If you go to the Calgary board, he did go for peanuts.

By peanuts I meant Zadina and a 2nd, their definition appears to be much different.

The consensus here was it was severe overpayment and a stupid move by Florida. Obviously Calgary has some regrets considering the outcome, but nobody here thought it was a great trade by Florida (or at least had enough balls to say so).

 

[Gniwder]

I'd much rather pay more in trade assets and get a better fit.

We finally agree on something, lol. (Not that I agree with your list of players, I'll pass on Nylander.)

I get the feeling that Fester doesn't tolerate much BS from players. No point in trading for guys that will wind up in his doghouse.

 

[kliq]

By peanuts I meant Zadina and a 2nd, their definition appears to be much different.

The consensus here was it was severe overpayment and a stupid move by Florida. Obviously Calgary has some regrets considering the outcome, but nobody here thought it was a great trade by Florida (or at least had enough balls to say so).

My comment wasn’t a shot at your point, but rather the “hindsight is 20/20” thinking of flames fans on these boards.

 

[Henkka]

He put up 50 goals and 100 pts in his draft season with McDavid graduated to the NHL.

Scoring 50 goals in your draft year is not easy to do. Are you saying he doesn’t have a high end shot?

Just like Anthony Mantha scored 50 goals in his draft year, without McDavid.

Junior scoring sometimes is a factor, sometimes not.

Based on junior scoring, we are very far away from the discussion is he 6-7M player or 9-10M player.

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

Yeah, I don't get it either.

Nobody is saying to cough up multiple first rounders and pay Debrincat $11M AAV. But it's also silly to automatically assume that it would take a gross overpayment, so don't even bother looking into it.

Every team should always investigate absolutely every option for making their roster better. Always. The only difference is what price they feel is worthwhile for their situation.

But the price of a phone call or two is never prohibitive.

Wait if Yzerman is sitting at the police department, Jkuts. Are you still calling about Debrincat with your one phone call?

 

[SantosHalper]

If you guys want to refrain from adding someone to this team that for sure makes us better, because of a possible potential future bad cap crunch that might not ever happen, go for it.

I’d be seriously looking at adding DeBrincat, or a Dubois/Schiefele/Lindholm.

I want to improve this team but let's be honest, DeBrincat doesn't improve this team that much. He's not a line driver, he's a complimentary player. DeBrincat can score 35 goals when there's a high end playmaker next to him and without one he's a 25 goal guy. 8 million a year is way too much for a complimentary player. For 8 million a year, Red Wings can get a player who can also score 25 goals and improves the team other ways as well. All DeBrincat have is the shot.

Dubois - First he wanted out from Columbus and now he wants to leave Winnipeg. Something tells me that Detroit is not the place where he desires. But if he would, i would definitely trade for him.

Scheifele - Too many stories of him being the locker room cancer. I would stay away from him.

Lindholm - Now we are talking! This is the player where i want to spent 8 million a year. Bonafide 70 point and 25 goal guy, who can also play at Selke-level. This is the type we need, tough player to play against offensively and defensively.

Connor - I believe Chevy already said that Winnipeg wants roster players in exhange. I still offer 2 x 1st round picks + Berggren + Johansson and i can still throw in a 2nd round pick for Connor. Size, speed, skill, 2-way game. Way more bang for your buck than with DeBrincat.

Nylander - New GM said that the big 4 stays. So i guess we have to wait until Nylander is UFA.

Keller - Arizona is done, even Mr. Coyote himself Shane Doan left. They are done and no clear timetable for relocation, it's time to go after Keller. 2 x 1st round + Berggren + Zadina + Johansson

Meier - His name is still thrown around, im quite sure he re-signs with New Jersey.
--------------------------
#17 O
DET 1st/BOS 1st 2024
Berggren
Zadina
Johansson

for

Keller
---------------------------
DET 1st/BOS 1st 2024
DET 1st 2025
Veleno
43 O/DET 2nd 2024

for

Lindholm
------------------------
Ras - Larkin - Ray
Keller - Lindholm - Perron
Kuba - Copp - Fabbri
UFA - Suter - Chiasson

After next season Kasper replaces Perron, Mazur replaces Kubalik, #9 overall replaces Fabbri and Söderblom replaces UFA/Chiasson.

 

[jkutswings]

If Detroit comes away with one of Connor/Keller/Lindholm, I'll be a very happy camper.

 

[Frk It]

I want to improve this team but let's be honest, DeBrincat doesn't improve this team that much. He's not a line driver, he's a complimentary player. DeBrincat can score 35 goals when there's a high end playmaker next to him and without one he's a 25 goal guy. 8 million a year is way too much for a complimentary player. For 8 million a year, Red Wings can get a player who can also score 25 goals and improves the team other ways as well. All DeBrincat have is the shot.

Dubois - First he wanted out from Columbus and now he wants to leave Winnipeg. Something tells me that Detroit is not the place where he desires. But if he would, i would definitely trade for him.

Scheifele - Too many stories of him being the locker room cancer. I would stay away from him.

Lindholm - Now we are talking! This is the player where i want to spent 8 million a year. Bonafide 70 point and 25 goal guy, who can also play at Selke-level. This is the type we need, tough player to play against offensively and defensively.

Connor - I believe Chevy already said that Winnipeg wants roster players in exhange. I still offer 2 x 1st round picks + Berggren + Johansson and i can still throw in a 2nd round pick for Connor. Size, speed, skill, 2-way game. Way more bang for your buck than with DeBrincat.

Nylander - New GM said that the big 4 stays. So i guess we have to wait until Nylander is UFA.

Keller - Arizona is done, even Mr. Coyote himself Shane Doan left. They are done and no clear timetable for relocation, it's time to go after Keller. 2 x 1st round + Berggren + Zadina + Johansson

Meier - His name is still thrown around, im quite sure he re-signs with New Jersey.
--------------------------
#17 O
DET 1st/BOS 1st 2024
Berggren
Zadina
Johansson

for

Keller
---------------------------
DET 1st/BOS 1st 2024
DET 1st 2025
Veleno
43 O/DET 2nd 2024

for

Lindholm
------------------------
Ras - Larkin - Ray
Keller - Lindholm - Perron
Kuba - Copp - Fabbri
UFA - Suter - Chiasson

After next season Kasper replaces Perron, Mazur replaces Kubalik, #9 overall replaces Fabbri and Söderblom replaces UFA/Chiasson.

I’m so with you on Lindholm, I really hope our front office pursued that aggressively this off-season.

Why would Arizona trade Keller? He’s like their only good player and I haven’t heard anything about him not wanting to be there.

 

[jkutswings]

I’m so with you on Lindholm, I really hope our front office pursued that aggressively this off-season.

Why would Arizona trade Keller? He’s like their only good player and I haven’t heard anything about him not wanting to be there.

Potential Landing Spots for Coyote's Clayton Keller

With the Arizona Coyote's future uncertain, which team's could be potential landing spots for Coyote's Clayton Keller?

lastwordonsports.com

He met with ownership after the failed bid, and either his father or somebody who hacked his father's Twitter account posted to say he was leaving town.

 

[Henkka]

Keller is the guy we should be after.

Great contract, many years left, and scored over a point per game at last season.

 

[Henkka]

Columbus turning the switch to win mode.

- Babcock in
- Provorov in
- Severson in, signed 8 years, 6.25M

Drafting a franchise Center with 3rd overall.

 

[dtown77]

For the love of god.. I know good centers don't grow on trees.. but could we please get one? He doesn't even have to be great.. Just good.