2023 Draft Discussion

[Barry Amsterdam]

You know what would be better? If Kasper were the one centering Perreault and Leonard.

do you think kasper goes top 5 in this years draft ?

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I don’t see this gap with Smith/Benson to trade up for them.

Yeah that's fair, and I imagine Yzerman evaluates it similarly otherwise he'd have put his thumb on the scales a bit more aggressively late in the season.

I definitely have daylight between Smith and the rest of the NTDP group. Part of that might be the fact that I'm just not super high on Leonard or Moore's ability to produce points. Perreault I like a lot but I think what Smith would bring to the spine of this team is pretty tantalizing.

Benson and the CHL group is probably a closer call for me, but I still think he brings another gear offensively that I would bet on.

I have an uncomfortable suspicion that this will be a year like 2018 where we walk out with a bunch of nice names in the top 50 or so selections, but ultimately look back and say man, I'd trade all those picks for X or Y guy who went a couple slots higher.

 

[NickH8]

You know what would be better? If Kasper were the one centering Perreault and Leonard.

I mentioned that earlier in the thread. Kasper loves the puck on his stick and Perreault is all about making quick plays to his linemates.

 

[lilidk]

Lombardi Kasper Perreault
Raymond Yager Rasmussen

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

Lombardi Kasper Perreault
Raymond Yager Rasmussen

Raymond Yager Buchelnikov

 

[lilidk]

Raymond Yager Buchelnikov

It's 2 snipers on the same line, Raymond also has nice shot. I totally forgot about Buchelnikov, he didn't have good playoffs also

 

[NickH8]

Won't be able to watch the U18's again until the semis and finals next weekend. That'll be the last bit of draft related hockey I'll be watching. Here's my updated top 32. I'll post the rest of my list when it's finalized, but I'd say my top 32 is pretty much locked in. Nobody on the cusp of it is playing in the U18's.

1	Connor Bedard	C
2	Adam Fantilli	C
3	Leo Carlsson	C/LW
4	Matvei Michkov	RW
5	Zach Benson	LW
6	Will Smith	C
7	David Reinbacher	RD
8	Gabe Perreault	LW
9	Ryan Leonard	RW
10	Dalibor Dvorsky	C
11	Brayden Yager	C
12	Oliver Moore	C
13	Eduard Sale	LW
14	Andrew Cristall	LW
15	Colby Barlow	LW
16	Tom Willander	RD
17	Matthew Wood	C/RW
18	Gavin Brindley	C/RW
19	Jayden Perron	RW
20	Quentin Musty	LW
21	Nate Danielsson	C
22	Samuel Honzek	C/LW
23	Axel Sandin Pelikka	RD
24	Riley Heidt	C/LW
25	Calum Ritchie	C
26	Otto Stenberg	LW
27	David Edstrom	C
28	Gracyn Sawchyn	C/RW
29	Nick Lardis	LW
30	Koehn Ziemmer	RW
31	Oscar Fisker-Molggard	C
32	Mikhail Gulyayev	LD

 

[Pavels Dog]

If Willander is available with the Isles 1st we should probably grab him.

 

[Indrid Cold]

If Willander is available with the Isles 1st we should probably grab him.

Willander, Wallinder... Just need Homelander.

 

[NickH8]

If Willander is available with the Isles 1st we should probably grab him.

I'm really high on him. He's not huge but he's big enough, he's got that mobility Yzerman loves in dmen. He's physical, good rush defender, and he's got a decent shot from the point. He's not gonna be an offensive 50 point guy but we don't need him to be. He's like a right handed Walman.

 

[lilidk]

If Willander is available with the Isles 1st we should probably grab him.

Even if Sandin Pelikka available? I d rather have 2 forwards in the first and Reinbacher should be gone by NYI pick

 

[Reddwit]

Even if Sandin Pelikka available? I d rather have 2 forwards in the first and Reinbacher should be gone by NYI pick

Doubt Yzerman likes ASP that much. I’m also wary of ASP’s ceiling. I think he has an NHL floor but maybe tops out as a 4/5. I’ve seen Brannstrom as a comp and think it’s fair.

 

[Frk It]

Won't be able to watch the U18's again until the semis and finals next weekend. That'll be the last bit of draft related hockey I'll be watching. Here's my updated top 32. I'll post the rest of my list when it's finalized, but I'd say my top 32 is pretty much locked in. Nobody on the cusp of it is playing in the U18's.

1	Connor Bedard	C
2	Adam Fantilli	C
3	Leo Carlsson	C/LW
4	Matvei Michkov	RW
5	Zach Benson	LW
6	Will Smith	C
7	David Reinbacher	RD
8	Gabe Perreault	LW
9	Ryan Leonard	RW
10	Dalibor Dvorsky	C
11	Brayden Yager	C
12	Oliver Moore	C
13	Eduard Sale	LW
14	Andrew Cristall	LW
15	Colby Barlow	LW
16	Tom Willander	RD
17	Matthew Wood	C/RW
18	Gavin Brindley	C/RW
19	Jayden Perron	RW
20	Quentin Musty	LW
21	Nate Danielsson	C
22	Samuel Honzek	C/LW
23	Axel Sandin Pelikka	RD
24	Riley Heidt	C/LW
25	Calum Ritchie	C
26	Otto Stenberg	LW
27	David Edstrom	C
28	Gracyn Sawchyn	C/RW
29	Nick Lardis	LW
30	Koehn Ziemmer	RW
31	Oscar Fisker-Molggard	C
32	Mikhail Gulyayev	LD

I have a really hard time with Perron above Danielsson, Honzek, and Ziemmer. I would push back on that.

I mean you have to consider floor to a degree.... and those 3 are just way more likely to be NHLers IMO.

What Ziemmer did in the WHL on Prince George is more impressive to me than what Perron did on the Steel, and by a decent amount I'd say.

 

[Frk It]

Yeah that's fair, and I imagine Yzerman evaluates it similarly otherwise he'd have put his thumb on the scales a bit more aggressively late in the season.

I definitely have daylight between Smith and the rest of the NTDP group. Part of that might be the fact that I'm just not super high on Leonard or Moore's ability to produce points. Perreault I like a lot but I think what Smith would bring to the spine of this team is pretty tantalizing.

Benson and the CHL group is probably a closer call for me, but I still think he brings another gear offensively that I would bet on.

I have an uncomfortable suspicion that this will be a year like 2018 where we walk out with a bunch of nice names in the top 50 or so selections, but ultimately look back and say man, I'd trade all those picks for X or Y guy who went a couple slots higher.

You have the big 4... and then I see a group that includes:

Smith, Dvorsky, Benson, Perreault, Yager, Sale, Moore, Leonard, Reinbacher, Wood, Danielson, Honzek, Cristall, Sandin Pelikka, Ritchie, Ziemmer.

If you told me with confidence I have to tell you the best 2 players from that group, I don't know I would be that confident with my answer.

I am trying to make a new rating and struggling with this.

What do you see as the difference between Benson and Perreault? I would say they excel in similar areas and also have similar drawbacks.

 

[norrisnick]

You have the big 4... and then I see a group that includes:

Smith, Dvorsky, Benson, Perreault, Yager, Sale, Moore, Leonard, Reinbacher, Wood, Danielson, Honzek, Cristall, Sandin Pelikka, Ritchie, Ziemmer.

If you told me with confidence I have to tell you the best 2 players from that group, I don't know I would be that confident with my answer.

I am trying to make a new rating and struggling with this.

What do you see as the difference between Benson and Perreault? I would say they excel in similar areas and also have similar drawbacks.

And the beauty of this coming draft is that the Wings can have two of this group.

 

[Frk It]

If Willander is available with the Isles 1st we should probably grab him.

Would not be surprised at all if this is what we do. (even though he wasn't in the list I just posted... lol)

 

[NickH8]

I have a really hard time with Perron above Danielsson, Honzek, and Ziemmer. I would push back on that.

I mean you have to consider floor to a degree.... and those 3 are just way more likely to be NHLers IMO.

What Ziemmer did in the WHL on Prince George is more impressive to me than what Perron did on the Steel, and by a decent amount I'd say.

I cooled off a bit on those three. I see there floors but question their upside. At 19 I say why not bet on Perrons skill.

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

You have the big 4... and then I see a group that includes:

Smith, Dvorsky, Benson, Perreault, Yager, Sale, Moore, Leonard, Reinbacher, Wood, Danielson, Honzek, Cristall, Sandin Pelikka, Ritchie, Ziemmer.

If you told me with confidence I have to tell you the best 2 players from that group, I don't know I would be that confident with my answer.

I am trying to make a new rating and struggling with this.

What do you see as the difference between Benson and Perreault? I would say they excel in similar areas and also have similar drawbacks.

Smith, Dvorsky, Benson, Perreault, Yager, Sale, Leonard, Reinbacher,

Moore, Wood, Danielson, Honzek, Cristall, Sandin Pelikka, Ritchie, Ziemmer

is how i’d split that group

 

[Frk It]

I cooled off a bit on those three. I see there floors but question their upside. At 19 I say why not bet on Perrons skill.

Danielson and Ziemmer are better goal scorers and bigger. Perron should have been able to score more goals on that stacked team.

I’d say the ability to score and get to scoring positions matters when it comes to upside.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

do you think kasper goes top 5 in this years draft ?

Top 5? Maybe at 5 at the earliest but I think he’s a much better prospect than Will Smith by a fair bit.

Out of Cooley, Gauthier, Kasper and Savoie, all centers with very different play styles from last draft, the only one of the 4 that I think Will Smith is better than at the same stage is Savoie by a hair.

Smith is flashy and a very good passer but isn’t a Jack Hughes type despite the gaudy point totals. I don’t even think he’s a Trevor Zegras. His two-way game isn’t great, and he doesn’t move his feet enough with the puck on his stick and avoids the hard areas of the ice.

I don’t care for these U18 blowouts against inferior teams like Norway, Latvia and an atypically poor Finland as a measure of a player. We’re seeing the opponent possess the puck MAYBE 20% of the game and the other 80% is USA.

 

[NickH8]

Danielson and Ziemmer are better goal scorers and bigger. Perron should have been able to score more goals on that stacked team.

I’d say the ability to score and get to scoring positions matters when it comes to upside.

Do you see Danielsons goalscoring as translatable? I don't think he'll ever hit 30 in the NHL. Not that that makes him a bad player, the main appeal is his two way game.
If I were convinced Danielsson has plus goal scoring I could see myself bumping him up. Ziemmer (and heidt) I've grown skeptical of. I think they help each other a lot production wise making their stats more eye popping than their play. Honzek is good, I just question his IQ at times. He compares to Rasmussen in a few ways for me.

 

[Frk It]

Do you see Danielsons goalscoring as translatable? I don't think he'll ever hit 30 in the NHL. Not that that makes him a bad player, the main appeal is his two way game.

I see his game as a whole as very translatable. How many 30 goal scorers does a draft usually produce? I mean if anything, I think that should be a reason to rate Ziemmer higher. And I am not really sure why Ziemmer isn't ranked higher just in general....?

I think there is more of an offensive game to be developed with Danielson, but even if not I could see him being a Craig Smith type player in the NHL.

I mean the kid lead his team in points and he didn't really have much help, Brandon was a bad team. I think he deserves to be in the 10-20 range of this draft.

The only small wingers I have in the top 20 are Michkov, Benson, Perreault, and Cristall... who all had pretty exceptional seasons in the leagues they played in. And I even have been moving Cristall back more than I have.

 

[NickH8]

I see his game as a whole as very translatable. How many 30 goal scorers does a draft usually produce? I mean if anything, I think that should be a reason to rate Ziemmer higher. And I am not really sure why Ziemmer isn't ranked higher just in general....?

I think there is more of an offensive game to be developed with Danielson, but even if not I could see him being a Craig Smith type player in the NHL.

I mean the kid lead his team in points and he didn't really have much help, Brandon was a bad team. I think he deserves to be in the 10-20 range of this draft.

The only small wingers I have in the top 20 are Michkov, Benson, Perreault, and Cristall... who all had pretty exceptional seasons in the leagues they played in. And I even have been moving Cristall back more than I have.

Maybe I overvalued Perrons high end when remaking my list. Idk, those guys are all in the same tier for me anyway. I'm a believer in Perrons game. Similar to Brindley he's small but he plays a good defensive game which I think will help him make the NHL despite his lack of high end goal scoring. He is a good playmaker though.

 

[Frk It]

Maybe I overvalued Perrons high end when remaking my list. Idk, those guys are all in the same tier for me anyway. I'm a believer in Perrons game. Similar to Brindley he's small but he plays a good defensive game which I think will help him make the NHL despite his lack of high end goal scoring. He is a good playmaker though.

You could end up being right in both cases, I think I just like some of those bigger or well-rounded guys better.

Still not sure what to make of Wood... Sometimes I think he should be ranked closer to 10 and sometimes closer to 20.

 

[Frk It]

Top 5? Maybe at 5 at the earliest but I think he’s a much better prospect than Will Smith by a fair bit.

Out of Cooley, Gauthier, Kasper and Savoie, all centers with very different play styles from last draft, the only one of the 4 that I think Will Smith is better than at the same stage is Savoie by a hair.

Smith is flashy and a very good passer but isn’t a Jack Hughes type despite the gaudy point totals. I don’t even think he’s a Trevor Zegras. His two-way game isn’t great, and he doesn’t move his feet enough with the puck on his stick and avoids the hard areas of the ice.

I don’t care for these U18 blowouts against inferior teams like Norway, Latvia and an atypically poor Finland as a measure of a player. We’re seeing the opponent possess the puck MAYBE 20% of the game and the other 80% is USA.