Rumor: 2023-24 Trade Rumors and Free Agency: Part Deux

[henchman21]

Maybe let's wait until another playoff run before painting a picture of what Byram is.

I'm not saying you're wrong, especially with his offensive potential on the Avs. He could also have a lot better offensive numbers if he sacrificed his D game. Personally, I'd rather have a well-rounded defender that can be counted on defensively. I also could care less about what kind of numbers a guy puts up in the regular season if he's able to elevate his game in the playoffs.

Sure, fantasy-wise, and numbers-wise, Byram may be underwhelming. But it doesn't mean he is less valuable to a team or on the trade market. I think Doughty-lite is a fair comparison based on this kind of all-around game and temperament.

I’ve long thought this about Byram… this isn’t a this year or last few years thing. Just my opinion of how he would develop and thus far I don’t see anything to waiver on it… actually more confirmation than anything else.

With Byram you don’t ever get a good balance for a long stretch of time. You might get it for a few games, but never 15-20. You’ll get stretches of offense and stretches of defense… but rarely both. Worse is you get stretches of risk taking and bad play with no offense and a liability defensively. I don’t really care about numbers (though to be a true 1 you certainly need offense and defense, so production has to be there for that level). I mostly care about a consistent high level of play. Which is why I’d like him dialed back and playing to what he’s really good at and potentially elite in those areas.

Byram has a lot of value right now because of potential. Once that isn’t reached, the value will drop. That doesn’t mean he isn’t incredibly useful though. A 2 or 2/3 defensemen is a core level piece.

As with any of my opinions though… just take it with a grain of salt (or a lot more).

 

[ANewHope]

I still think he has 1D potential. His run during the cup was incredible. He has flashes but they never last. He's just very inconsistent and I'm not sure he reaches his potential with the Avs. It honestly hasn't looked like a good fit for either side this season. I think not getting the PP time clearly impacts his offensive confidence as well. He's to blame for sure but the Avs haven't exactly put him in the best spot this season IMO.

At this point he's the no brainer D to move. Girard has killed his value to the point where when he does get moved it'll just be for futures/to better allocate the cap. Toews is signed long term. Why wait until the shine wears off? Make a hockey trade now before Byram's value drops. Hope to be wrong but that's what I see happening.

Avs learned from Jost with Newhook. It's a different situation but they need to do the same with Byram. Unless the team turns things around in a big way they can't just stand pat.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

Pretty crazy that this came out of nowhere. Who knew that a team wanting to give away a player for free and taking on half of his salary would be a red flag. Hopefully Cmac can learn his lesson before 2030 or so.

Yeah, even still I'm not terribly upset at him pulling the trigger on this deal because I don't actually know what other conversations he had. Everyone could've looked at our assets and basically said, "Pack sand" when CMac came a calling looking for an honest to goodness, real NHL level 2C.

Where I get a bit agitated is that RyJo has another year. If we were to acquire a 2C, I could see him potentially working as our 2RW for a year rather than having negative cap space based on buy-out. But I think his salary, even the negative salary he would create in a buyout, really limits our ability to get a 2C. Our best bet maybe for Landy to play 2C next season.

 

[AvStock]

If we are trading Byram I want to see Petterson returned. Otherwise we may as well say eff it and keep him along for the ride. Anything less would honestly make me sick, especially if he blows up into 1D status.

 

[BobRossColton]

If we are trading Byram I want to see Petterson returned. Otherwise we may as well say eff it and keep him along for the ride. Anything less would honestly make me sick, especially if he blows up into 1D status.

Pettersons contract would definitely cause us to lose mikko.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

Pettersons contract would definitely cause us to lose mikko.

Depending on how this season plays out, Loosing Mikko might not be the wrong play. If this team struggles in the playoffs due to the second line, I think a reset this summer involving Rants, one of our LD, and if possible RyJo and Manson would provide a significant reset allowing reallocation of cap space so we can properly solve 2C, get a good winger or two (not world beaters) and balance our dmen better left and right sided hopefully.

It's a huge ask, but if this teams fails because of secondary scoring and Bednar is still running X-Nate-Moose and not spreading the talent, I might be tempted as a GM to take the decision out of his hands.

I want to make clear that I don't think Moose is a problem and if possible I'd rather solve the 2C using just dmen and whatever it takes to get rid of RyJo. But if that was possible, I think CMac would have done that instead of getting RyJo. Maybe a new summer and new crop of UFA/RFAs changes the playing field. But I'm uncomfortable with the percentage of cap being spent on Cs vs Wingers. I have no idea what Mikko is going to be seeking but I imagine it's going to make him the highest paid RW in the game and not too far off of Nate's (I'm thinking he wants and could well get 12.5ish) as the cap will be moving up by the time it kicks in.

 

[The Kingslayer]

If we are trading Byram I want to see Petterson returned. Otherwise we may as well say eff it and keep him along for the ride. Anything less would honestly make me sick, especially if he blows up into 1D status.

What else are the Avs adding?

 

[Miri]

What else are the Avs adding?

Johansen, Drouin, Tatar, JMFJ, Manson :-D

 

[NorthernAvsFan]

Byram for Pettersson is complete fantasy.

A second pairing D for a franchise centre? Vancouver hangs up the phone and doesn’t even consider a counter offer.

 

[Hasbro]

Byram for Pettersson is complete fantasy.

A second pairing D for a franchise centre? Vancouver hangs up the phone and doesn’t even consider a counter offer.

Looks at Vancouver trading history...

 

[Rumplesnipeskin]

If we are trading Byram I want to see Petterson returned. Otherwise we may as well say eff it and keep him along for the ride. Anything less would honestly make me sick, especially if he blows up into 1D status.

I don’t personally (just me I’m speaking for) believe Byram will ever be a 1 D, and I think his ceiling is as a second pairing (hope I’m proven wrong). No denying he has a skill set, but some of the mental side (which admittedly can take longer to develop) I just don’t see falling into place, and I don’t think the Avs develop the defensive side of the puck particularly well with their defense.

I would trade G before Bo but a decent return on Bryam, RD or Center, should be taken into consideration.

If we are trading Byram I want to see Petterson returned. Otherwise we may as well say eff it and keep him along for the ride. Anything less would honestly make me sick, especially if he blows up into 1D status.

I don’t personally (just me I’m speaking for) believe Byram will ever be a 1 D, and I think his ceiling is as a second pairing (hope I’m proven wrong). No denying he has a skill set, but some of the mental side (which admittedly can take longer to develop) I just don’t see falling into place, and I don’t think the Avs develop the defensive side of the puck particularly well with their defense.

I would trade G before Bo but a decent return on Bryam, RD or Center, should be taken into consideration.

 

[JH21]

So now I have to sort through 20 pages of guys saying Bo Byram, 22 year old Bo Byram who has 108 games of experience will be nothing more than a 2nd pair Dman??

That may be true if he stays with us because he has Makar and Toews ahead of him but make no mistake, he would be a top pair Dman on 98% of the teams in the league.

We are just fortunate to have him as a 2nd pair Dman right now.

 

[Ararana]

Byram is hamstrung on the Avs. I'm fine with sending him out for everyone's best interests but I'm worried after years of concussions and consitent lack of opportunity in Colorado his development has been significantly hampered and his ceiling is no where near what it once was.

The Avs chose Toews, I wildly don't agree with that but they chose him as Makar's long term partner over Byram. Lets move on from Byram and give him the best shot to reach his potential on a club that will use him appropriately.

IMO Bowman absolutely f***ed Byram by not taking him 3rd OA, Chicago was the ideal fit for him. Spend a year mentoring under Duncan Keith as their #1D in grooming and slowly take over their PP1. Who knows how events would have unfolded but Beddard and Byram would have been a fantastic duo.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

I really do think Bo either needs to consistently show something good or we need to move on. I don’t think the Avs current build is great for his development, they have him on his offside, and the message seems unclear whether they want him to go free range (where he is at his best) or if they want him to play more conservative (where he looks bad)

 

[GeoRox89]

Looks at Vancouver trading history...

Benning is gone now. Makar is the only piece that would get Petey given Mack’s age and contract

 

[henchman21]

So now I have to sort through 20 pages of guys saying Bo Byram, 22 year old Bo Byram who has 108 games of experience will be nothing more than a 2nd pair Dman??

That may be true if he stays with us because he has Makar and Toews ahead of him but make no mistake, he would be a top pair Dman on 98% of the teams in the league.

We are just fortunate to have him as a 2nd pair Dman right now.

Byram wouldn't be a top pairing guy on 98% of other teams... half, sure. Maybe slightly more. Frankly though, if Byram is on your top pairing, you're not a very good team. Take Arizona... I quite like Sean Durzi, but because he's their #1, that doesn't make him a #1. The fact that he is in Arizona says more about them than him.

The whole he's only 22 argument doesn't hold water though. If you think Byram is an elite #1D prospect, or even a #1 sort.... in today's NHL, they are in their prime and about as good as they will get. You might get a peak year at 22 or you may get it at 25, but 22 is right in the range where they are expected to dominate. If Byram is to be a top pairing guy (and I think he will be), that level of play should be happening today or at the very latest next season. Defensemen peak and hit their primes earlier than people think. On the games played... it is misleading because of injuries. Bo has gotten NHL coaching and also played in 27 playoff games too. Along with that, again in today's NHL, young players should step in very quickly to higher roles.

All this is to really say Bo really should be near his top level of play very soon.

I really do think Bo either needs to consistently show something good or we need to move on. I don’t think the Avs current build is great for his development, they have him on his offside, and the message seems unclear whether they want him to go free range (where he is at his best) or if they want him to play more conservative (where he looks bad)

I'd argue the opposite... when he's free range, he looks the flashiest, but it isn't nearly as effective (see last season). When he's more conservative, he's the most effective (see Cup run).

 

[Chiarelli]

Byram wouldn't be a top pairing guy on 98% of other teams... half, sure. Maybe slightly more. Frankly though, if Byram is on your top pairing, you're not a very good team. Take Arizona... I quite like Sean Durzi, but because he's their #1, that doesn't make him a #1. The fact that he is in Arizona says more about them than him.

The whole he's only 22 argument doesn't hold water though. If you think Byram is an elite #1D prospect, or even a #1 sort.... in today's NHL, they are in their prime and about as good as they will get. You might get a peak year at 22 or you may get it at 25, but 22 is right in the range where they are expected to dominate. If Byram is to be a top pairing guy (and I think he will be), that level of play should be happening today or at the very latest next season. Defensemen peak and hit their primes earlier than people think. On the games played... it is misleading because of injuries. Bo has gotten NHL coaching and also played in 27 playoff games too. Along with that, again in today's NHL, young players should step in very quickly to higher roles.

All this is to really say Bo really should be near his top level of play very soon.


I'd argue the opposite... when he's free range, he looks the flashiest, but it isn't nearly as effective (see last season). When he's more conservative, he's the most effective (see Cup run).

agreed - Bo thinks he's Makar and we need him to be Slavin

 

[henchman21]

agreed - Bo thinks he's Makar and we need him to be Slavin

I don't think Bo would ever get to Slavin level, but Bo as a shutdown defensive guy is more important to the Avs... but I simply argue that is a better fit for his skill set. I've screamed into the wind for a long time on this subject though and I don't think the Avs will ever coach him that way.

 

[GeoRox89]

I don't think Bo would ever get to Slavin level, but Bo as a shutdown defensive guy is more important to the Avs... but I simply argue that is a better fit for his skill set. I've screamed into the wind for a long time on this subject though and I don't think the Avs will ever coach him that way.

Very few players can be Slavin. I’d kill to have him or a middle class man’s Slavin on this team. One of the few players you can reasonably call a 1D despite being a 30-40 point guy

 

[henchman21]

Very few players can be Slavin. I’d kill to have him or a middle class man’s Slavin on this team. One of the few players you can reasonably call a 1D despite being a 30-40 point guy

Yeah Slavin is pretty much prime Pickles defensively with a decent amount of offense.

 

[AslanRH]

Wennberg wouldn't be any better than RyJo. Big, lazy SOBs with talent... Wennberg is more allergic to shooting and isn't as good of playmaker either... but better defensively. The guy we want from Seattle is Gourde. Yeah he's older and has the extra year... but he's a more talented Colton. He'd absolutely thrive in Bednar's system and what legs are still there, would have the best usage they've had since pre-Cirelli Tampa.

They won't be moving Gourde, but I agree with his fit.
Don't have quite the same read on Wennberg as you, but will concede he's not ideal.

 

[AvStock]

I know this isn’t EA sports but if the Canucks flounder again this season we should consider trading Rants for EP40. Add anything to get the deal done.

 

[henchman21]

I know this isn’t EA sports but if the Canucks flounder again this season we should consider trading Rants for EP40. Add anything to get the deal done.

Honestly, EP is as untouchable for the Canucks as Makar is for the Avs. A 25 year old franchise center and top 10 player in the world is something teams just don't move. Avs could offer Rantanen and Byram and Vancouver still wouldn't move him.

 

[NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS]

Ya JEE would literally be the perfect acquisition. But I think that chance closed a couple years ago.


I remember getting ridiculed for merely suggesting a Byram/JEE swap not too long ago

Now you'd get ridiculed for a Byram JEE swap since you didn't add 3 firsts to Byram.

Maybe let's wait until another playoff run before painting a picture of what Byram is.

I'm not saying you're wrong, especially with his offensive potential on the Avs. He could also have a lot better offensive numbers if he sacrificed his D game. Personally, I'd rather have a well-rounded defender that can be counted on defensively. I also could care less about what kind of numbers a guy puts up in the regular season if he's able to elevate his game in the playoffs.

Sure, fantasy-wise, and numbers-wise, Byram may be underwhelming. But it doesn't mean he is less valuable to a team or on the trade market. I think Doughty-lite is a fair comparison based on this kind of all-around game and temperament.

If he sacrificed his D game any more he'd be out of the league. Byram is incredibly average defensively and has to play high risk just to put up any offense.

 

[GeoRox89]

I know this isn’t EA sports but if the Canucks flounder again this season we should consider trading Rants for EP40. Add anything to get the deal done.

The only way Petey is getting moved is if they flounder so hard that he just flat out says he will not re-sign even medium term and is going UFA. Petey is a pipe dream and half. Miller before they moved Horvat and the resurgence under Tocchet was the guy to get from them but the time for that has long passed