2023-24 Roster Thread #9: Spring time is upon us

[FLYguy3911]

Not until May 11?

DOB only really matters as it pertains to the league year. His ELC starts for his age 22 season. Had it started this year it still would have been a two year deal also. Age 20 and under at the start of the league year would be a 3 year deal if my math is right.

This is the closest example I could find last year:

Cole McWard Contract, Cap Hit, Salary and Stats - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Cole McWard contract, salary, cap hit, salary cap, aav, career earnings, lifetime earnings, aav, advanced stats, transaction history, trade history, and rfa or ufa free agent status

www.capfriendly.com

Signed for his age 21 season at the end of the year. Burned the first year. Finishing the second year of his two year deal this year.

 

[pooch]

Marketing....who cares? It's fodder for stupid people and children. Give me a good team with some superstars to follow and the team will sell itself.

 

[dragonoffrost]

Marketing....who cares? It's fodder for stupid people and children. Give me a good team with some superstars to follow and the team will sell itself.

You will get CULTURE and you will like it

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Authentics: Camillo is the reason the team was bad!

Is that what I said? That Camillo made the team bad?

Are you being disingenuous or is your reading comprehension that bad?

She pissed off the Snider family. Pissed off season ticket holders. Whitewashed team traditions that they had under one of the most beloved owners in pro sports history. Introduced a plethora of gimmicky corporate BS. Ran cringeworthy marketing campaigns.

She was terrible. Fan engagement and excitement immediately improved when she was booted and Hilferty and Jones took over the PR.

I have absolutely zero idea how anyone can defend her.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

If the Flyers are still spinning tires in mediocrity two years from now no PR related stuff Keith Jones & Dan Hilftery do is going to matter to the vast majority of the fanbase.

 

[kudymen]

thank you! somebody said it!

straight up, if the commercials were better i would be buying tickets to every game.

Maybe more players appearances on the morning shows?

 

[nacc BLOCC]

Maybe more players appearances on the morning shows?

if they did that too i would put my family into debt with ticket purchases and have to seriously consider reducing my candle budget.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

Would someone think of the double logos???

 

[Ghosts Beer]

They did definitely get back on brand this year . When you are going to be I icing a bad team the non hockey stuff matters a lot.
People tend to forget that sports is entertainment. Matt rempe sparked as many conversations as Connor bedard even though they are dramatically different .

Yes, it does matter a lot. If you're going to be bad, don't compound it by erasing the fans' fond memories of the team's identity and history when you were good.

In one season without Camillo, Hilferty and Jones have done an excellent job rebuilding the spirit of the team and fan engagement that fell apart while she was in charge of the business side.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Culture?
Seriously? History? Yeah, maybe ancient history.
Since 2000, we’ve had:
The Clarke/Lindros debacle
The Player revolt against Barber
The 06-07 season
Holmgren’s panic moves after Pronger went down
The 3 games into the season firing of Lavy
Hakstol
The wasted 2OA pick
The messy end to the Hextall era
Chuck Fletcher
AV, Yeo & Torts
A buffoon as PoHO

In those 23 seasons:
8 and soon to be 9 years out of the playoffs
7 first round exits
Only 3 trips to the final four, none since 2010
1 SCF appearance, none since 2010

Is this the history and culture we should be embracing? Give me a break!

As a Football Team fan through the horrific Danbag era, I am intimately familiar with what it looks like when a bad management group is using a team's history as a cudgel to pummel a fanbase into submission. That's exactly what they were doing with increasingly emphasizing Kate Smith as things started falling apart. Using the history as a thing to hide behind is gross. For that reason alone, I'm happy to remove any of it. It's a thing fans should be able to appreciate and celebrate, not something management uses as a shield and ruins for their own benefit. Flyers management does the latter.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Is that what I said? That Camillo made the team bad?

Are you being disingenuous or is your reading comprehension that bad?

She pissed off the Snider family. Pissed off season ticket holders. Whitewashed team traditions that they had under one of the most beloved owners in pro sports history. Introduced a plethora of gimmicky corporate BS. Ran cringeworthy marketing campaigns.

She was terrible. Fan engagement and excitement immediately improved when she was booted and Hilferty and Jones took over the PR.

I have absolutely zero idea how anyone can defend her.

This is all irrelevant. And it's long been an irrelevant whataboutism spouted by people who think this team is well managed to try and distract from the atrocities.

Nobody is even defending her. Nobody loves her. Everyone realizes she simply doesn't matter in the slightest.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Yes, it does matter a lot. If you're going to be bad, don't compound it by erasing the fans' fond memories of the team's identity and history when you were good.

In one season without Camillo, Hilferty and Jones have done an excellent job rebuilding the spirit of the team and fan engagement that fell apart while she was in charge of the business side.

No, don't compound it by ruining those memories by using them as a shield and reason to justify the continued existence of the people destroying the team.

 

[Magua]

I want to go to the Flyers draft party this summer so Mr. Hilferty personally buys me a beer. He does things like that. Because he cares. I want to look into his eyes as he hands it to me; I want to shake his manicured hand and tell him:

"Dan, when you took over as Governor of the Flyers in the middle of May in 2023, the city of Philadelphia was in the middle of a Sixers playoff collapse, the Phillies were struggling to get it going after losing in the World Series the season before, and the Eagles had just come off of a tight Super Bowl loss. Vibes were at an all-time low in the city, but they might have been the lowest in our tight-knit hockey community. After a decade of middling rosters that would either get bounced in the first round of the playoffs, or miss the playoffs all together, everything just reached a breaking point. At every press conference between 2021 and 2023, Dave Scott and Chuck Fletcher seemed to be standing in front of a burning building telling us it actually wasn’t on fire. On game day or during open practices in Voorhees, Scott was invisible, seemingly not there or just disinterested on what was taking place. The Flyers, an organization that would always pride itself on feeling like a family, not just in-house but with the fans as well, felt like a corporate hockey team with no connection between the front office, the players, and the fans. Fans felt like the front office just didn’t care.​

​

"This season, that feeling changed. YOU brought the feeling of Ed Snider back into the franchise. All season you have been open and honest with the media, which the fans appreciated after years of tiptoeing around questions. When fans would visit the Flyers Training Center in Voorhees, you would take time out of your day to meet with them, shake their hands, take pictures with them, and just talk hockey or whatever else with them; it didn’t feel like you were a corporate suit put there to run a team, but it felt like you were just another fan like the rest of us. It helped the fans connect with the team again. Most importantly, the feeling in the locker room after wins returned. Seeing the front office go down and shake the players hands was something Flyers fans vividly remember about the Ed Snider Flyers. Not only did the fans feel connected to the team again, but I’m sure the players felt appreciated too (especially after the former Governor called players by their wrong names in press conferences). You brought the feeling the Flyers should have back, even in a season that was classified as the beginning of a 'rebuild.' Thank You."​

​

And then make out as everything around us fades away.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Why should anybody give even half a damn about the Snider family being offended? Who cares? What on earth does that have to do with the team being good? It has zero impact on anything except some deep behind the scenes stuff, all of which is irrelevant to everything.


And what "spirit of the team?" The spirit of losing out when the games matter the most? Great. Grand spirit.


The spirit of lying to the fans about a rebuild, and admitting it, because they still think we are dumber than them? Awesome spirit, glad we can have another decade of that shit.

The spirit of entitlement that's completely and wholly unearned? Great. That sure gets them nowhere.


The team could stand to scrap all that "spirit." The better word for it is "hubris." They've rebuilt the team hubris, and nothing more. And they're already selling the future out to attain their egomaniacal stroking.

 

[Fight4yourRight]

I want to go to the Flyers draft party this summer so Mr. Hilferty personally buys me a beer. He does things like that. Because he cares. I want to look into his eyes as he hands it to me; I want to shake his manicured hand and tell him:

"Dan, when you took over as Governor of the Flyers in the middle of May in 2023, the city of Philadelphia was in the middle of a Sixers playoff collapse, the Phillies were struggling to get it going after losing in the World Series the season before, and the Eagles had just come off of a tight Super Bowl loss. Vibes were at an all-time low in the city, but they might have been the lowest in our tight-knit hockey community. After a decade of middling rosters that would either get bounced in the first round of the playoffs, or miss the playoffs all together, everything just reached a breaking point. At every press conference between 2021 and 2023, Dave Scott and Chuck Fletcher seemed to be standing in front of a burning building telling us it actually wasn’t on fire. On game day or during open practices in Voorhees, Scott was invisible, seemingly not there or just disinterested on what was taking place. The Flyers, an organization that would always pride itself on feeling like a family, not just in-house but with the fans as well, felt like a corporate hockey team with no connection between the front office, the players, and the fans. Fans felt like the front office just didn’t care.​

​

"This season, that feeling changed. YOU brought the feeling of Ed Snider back into the franchise. All season you have been open and honest with the media, which the fans appreciated after years of tiptoeing around questions. When fans would visit the Flyers Training Center in Voorhees, you would take time out of your day to meet with them, shake their hands, take pictures with them, and just talk hockey or whatever else with them; it didn’t feel like you were a corporate suit put there to run a team, but it felt like you were just another fan like the rest of us. It helped the fans connect with the team again. Most importantly, the feeling in the locker room after wins returned. Seeing the front office go down and shake the players hands was something Flyers fans vividly remember about the Ed Snider Flyers. Not only did the fans feel connected to the team again, but I’m sure the players felt appreciated too (especially after the former Governor called players by their wrong names in press conferences). You brought the feeling the Flyers should have back, even in a season that was classified as the beginning of a 'rebuild.' Thank You."​

​

And then make out as everything around us fades away.

Hawt.

 

[FlyerNutter]

And to address your other points, Gauthier told them he wasn't going to sign. Somehow they kept that quiet and traded a 20-year-old 5th overall pick for a 22-year-old 6th overall pick and what should be an early 2nd rd pick.

That's making the best of a bad situation.

They also jettisoned Hayes, DeAngelo, and Provorov, so saying they only moved one player, Walker, seems disingenuous. They got Grans, a 2nd, and Walker for Provy (and taking Petersen), then turned Walker into a 1st rd pick. That seems pretty good and rebuilding-oriented to me.

I just do not understand how people claim the Flyers' problem is clinging to the past, when literally they tried getting away from their past, it was a disaster, and it's immediately gotten way better when they went back to their roots.

As for how they'll get high-end talent? How did Boston get Bergeron, Marchand, and Krejci?

Appreciate the response.

I disagree, but that’s aight. It’s just… you addressing that point last. The high end talent gap, and the plan to rectify it.

That’s so exhibit A of what’s wrong with this team. They don’t care about it. It will figure itself out. They will win with enough intangibles - and effort to overcome any talent deficiency.

They aren’t doing that man. They’ve tried it. The same people, hired by the same advocates, the same scouts. They aren’t becoming Boston.

Lastly, just to touch on marketing. Know how easy it would be if they had a couple guys that weren’t just above average secondary players?

They have Matvei. Maybe. If he comes over. This isn’t a path to anything worthwhile, other than cheering on effort - and a culture that I find pathetic. Did I always? No. I loved that my team was the “bad boy” one, but with time I see that it’s those same philosophies, that same culture, that same Flyer country club family - that has pushed them to irrelevance to me as a fan.

f*** them, ya know?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Why should anybody give even half a damn about the Snider family being offended? Who cares? What on earth does that have to do with the team being good? It has zero impact on anything except some deep behind the scenes stuff, all of which is irrelevant to everything.


And what "spirit of the team?" The spirit of losing out when the games matter the most? Great. Grand spirit.


The spirit of lying to the fans about a rebuild, and admitting it, because they still think we are dumber than them? Awesome spirit, glad we can have another decade of that shit.

The spirit of entitlement that's completely and wholly unearned? Great. That sure gets them nowhere.


The team could stand to scrap all that "spirit." The better word for it is "hubris." They've rebuilt the team hubris, and nothing more. And they're already selling the future out to attain their egomaniacal stroking.

You hate the identity of the organization. You hate Snider and Clarke. Of course you would give Val Camillo, who also wanted to erase organizational traditions, history, and identity, a free pass,

Well she lost a lot of fan support while she was in charge, and you can be disingenuous and act like it was all about the team, but tons of it was her complete and utter disregard (bordering on disdain) for team history. Great for you and this board, not so good for the huge legions of Philadelphia fans who take pride in Ed Snider and the Flyers' proud history.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Appreciate the response.

I disagree, but that’s aight. It’s just… you addressing that point last. The high end talent gap, and the plan to rectify it.

That’s so exhibit A of what’s wrong with this team. They don’t care about it. It will figure itself out. They will win with enough intangibles - and effort to overcome any talent deficiency.

They aren’t doing that man. They’ve tried it. The same people, hired by the same advocates, the same scouts. They aren’t becoming Boston.

Lastly, just to touch on marketing. Know how easy it would be if they had a couple guys that weren’t just above average secondary players?

They have Matvei. Maybe. If he comes over. This isn’t a path to anything worthwhile, other than cheering on effort - and a culture that I find pathetic. Did I always? No. I loved that my team was the “bad boy” one, but with time I see that it’s those same philosophies, that same culture, that same Flyer country club family - that has pushed them to irrelevance to me as a fan.

f*** them, ya know?

Nothing personal, Nutter. I like you. I just don't want to spend years of tanking praying for a savior that probably won't come, especially with the lottery rules. Just try to keep getting better, find the Bergerons and Marchands and Pastrnaks and Krejcis (and Bobby Clarkes) who slip.

 

[FlyerNutter]

You hate the identity of the organization. You hate Snider and Clarke. Of course you would give Val Camillo, who also wanted to erase organizational traditions, history, and identity, a free pass,

Well she lost a lot of fan support while she was in charge, and you can be disingenuous and act like it was all about the team, but tons of it was her complete and utter disregard (bordering on disdain) for team history. Great for you and this board, not so good for the huge legions of Philadelphia fans who take pride in Ed Snider and the Flyers' proud history.

I think me personally, I’d respect that culture - that Flyer family a lot more if they gave me something.

They have given me nothing but failure, and asked me to watch boring hockey for a decade. The same perpetual retool strategies, and the same defense first coaches.

Why should I, as a 33 year old fan respect them? I understand they have support from many who have more of a… fan foundation of cheering for them, but I’ll very happily give them a consistent middle finger because they have done the same to me.

I don’t care about a cup, but I do care about being given a couple of stars to follow the careers of, because for some reason every other team can give that to their fanbase - except the Flyers. Give me that, and a plan I can believe in. Sure. I’ll support those men, and their culture.

Right now they deserve, and have earned nothing. The plan is the same old swamp bullshit, so yes. f*** ‘em.

 

[Beef Invictus]

You hate the identity of the organization. You hate Snider and Clarke. Of course you would give Val Camillo, who also wanted to erase organizational traditions, history, and identity, a free pass,

Well she lost a lot of fan support while she was in charge, and you can be disingenuous and act like it was all about the team, but tons of it was her complete and utter disregard (bordering on disdain) for team history. Great for you and this board, not so good for the huge legions of Philadelphia fans who take pride in Ed Snider and the Flyers' proud history.

I do not hate Snider. I hate Clarke because he is the root of all rot in this team.

I do not like Camillo "erasing" tradition. I do like that she doesn't sully and ruin it by hiding behind it like the fat slobs have for a decade. Those traditions and histories are better off for it. It's better for them to stand on their own instead of being caught up in what's happening right now.

She did not lose that fan support. The average fan likely has no clue who she is/was. The team lost support because they were excruciating to watch. That's kinda the whole point of sports, you know? Not all this very extracurricular stuff. Incidentally, this year is the first year in ages where the team has actually been watchable. That's why you see interest returning; interest you didn't see last year with the same people in charge. Everything revolves around the actual games. Those are the meat. Everything else is a vegetable; shitty, ruinous for your health, worth ignoring.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Nothing personal, Nutter. I like you. I just don't want to spend years of tanking praying for a savior that probably won't come, especially with the lottery rules. Just try to keep getting better, find the Bergerons and Marchands and Pastrnaks and Krejcis (and Bobby Clarkes) who slip.

No matter what path they take, there will be no savior(s)[let's be honest, the team needs more than Michkov] until everyone managing and scouting the team is replaced. Anything less and we will get more of the same we've been getting for an eternity. We've already spent years in purgatory. They're going nowhere, because the same people who keep the team in purgatory are allowed to do so forever and ever. These guys are routinely, habitually blowing the easy decisions and assessments. They aren't going to make the good decisions to find Bergerons. They don't even know who the actual good players on their own team are. There is no prayer of them finding them outside of the organization and bringing them (and then keeping and developing) in at the rate required to become good.

 

[kudymen]

I want to go to the Flyers draft party this summer so Mr. Hilferty personally buys me a beer. He does things like that. Because he cares. I want to look into his eyes as he hands it to me; I want to shake his manicured hand and tell him:

"Dan, when you took over as Governor of the Flyers in the middle of May in 2023, the city of Philadelphia was in the middle of a Sixers playoff collapse, the Phillies were struggling to get it going after losing in the World Series the season before, and the Eagles had just come off of a tight Super Bowl loss. Vibes were at an all-time low in the city, but they might have been the lowest in our tight-knit hockey community. After a decade of middling rosters that would either get bounced in the first round of the playoffs, or miss the playoffs all together, everything just reached a breaking point. At every press conference between 2021 and 2023, Dave Scott and Chuck Fletcher seemed to be standing in front of a burning building telling us it actually wasn’t on fire. On game day or during open practices in Voorhees, Scott was invisible, seemingly not there or just disinterested on what was taking place. The Flyers, an organization that would always pride itself on feeling like a family, not just in-house but with the fans as well, felt like a corporate hockey team with no connection between the front office, the players, and the fans. Fans felt like the front office just didn’t care.​

​

"This season, that feeling changed. YOU brought the feeling of Ed Snider back into the franchise. All season you have been open and honest with the media, which the fans appreciated after years of tiptoeing around questions. When fans would visit the Flyers Training Center in Voorhees, you would take time out of your day to meet with them, shake their hands, take pictures with them, and just talk hockey or whatever else with them; it didn’t feel like you were a corporate suit put there to run a team, but it felt like you were just another fan like the rest of us. It helped the fans connect with the team again. Most importantly, the feeling in the locker room after wins returned. Seeing the front office go down and shake the players hands was something Flyers fans vividly remember about the Ed Snider Flyers. Not only did the fans feel connected to the team again, but I’m sure the players felt appreciated too (especially after the former Governor called players by their wrong names in press conferences). You brought the feeling the Flyers should have back, even in a season that was classified as the beginning of a 'rebuild.' Thank You."​

​

And then make out as everything around us fades away.

Ah man I had to

Dear Mr. Hilferty,

I hope this message finds you in the best of spirits. It is with a profound sense of respect and admiration that I write to express my deepest gratitude for your unparalleled leadership and unwavering commitment to the Philadelphia Flyers. Your visionary approach has not only advanced the team to unprecedented levels of success but has also reinvigorated our beloved city and its passionate hockey fans.

Under your guidance, the Flyers have flourished, becoming a beacon of excellence in the sports world. Your dedication to not just maintaining but elevating every facet of the organization is truly awe-inspiring. Moreover, your personal integrity and charisma have not only enriched our club but have also set a gold standard in leadership that others aspire to.

I am incredibly grateful for your tireless efforts and for the personal kindness you extend to everyone around you. It is leaders like you who transform good organizations into great ones, and for that, you have my utmost appreciation and respect.

Thank you once again for everything you do for our team and community. It is an honor to be associated with a leader of your stature and grace.

 

[trostol]

once more..so the dolts in the back hear

Rebuilding≠Tanking

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Maybe Ed Snider shouldn’t have sold most of the team to Comcast. Maybe Ed Snider’s family shouldn’t have sold their remaining shares upon his death to Comcast.

Who gives a shit what those people have to say? If they wanted a say then they shouldn’t have sold out.

 

[Beef Invictus]

It also needs to be pointed out (again!) that there are outcomes besides "Buffalo" and "Montreal" and "Vancouver" and "Philadelphia" when it comes to rebuilding.

Note that a few years ago, Colorado and Edmonton would have been on that list too. They aren't now. It's almost like there is a way upward, even if you're badly managed and can't fully capitalize on it.