2023-24 Roster Thread 1: Entering the Starting Gate

[Beef Invictus]

Given there were 2 years left on the AV deal, Torts was pretty secure with a 4x4.
And he delivered what was promised, this was a better, more disciplined team despite getting much younger with less talent (no G, no Couts, no Atkinson) than the previous season.

I think the Kraken fans are pretty entertained.
I think Flyer fans would love a fast, aggressive team that hounds opponents over 200 ft and makes things happen with a smothering forecheck.
Not every fan is enthralled with "figure skater" hockey.

So, like the Hurricanes, who do all that and are also a better team because of the figure skating?

Or TB, who do all that, and are also a better team because of their figure skaters?

 

[BernieParent]

Bernie, I respectfully disagree. I don't think the reason Tortorella called it a rebuild from Day 1 was out of a conniving ulterior motive to give himself as much time as possible.

I mean, Torts could have ruined his chances in the interview process considering Dave Scott and Chuck Fletcher only a few months earlier had called it a retool, with Scott indicating he thought it could be turned around fast. So it took some balls that could have cost him the opportunity. If he wanted to lie out of self-interest, I'd think he'd have told them what they wanted to hear in the interview process.

I think Torts is simply a blunt person. He calls it like he sees it, and from Day 1 he saw the Flyers as a rebuild.

Thanks, GB. I appreciate both your respect and your disagreement. I should have underlined that I see this as a both-and situation. It is known that Tortorella speaks what he thinks, sometimes way too bluntly. I am glad that he was the squeaky wheel to stand up and say this team needs an overhaul. At the same time, it can't be overlooked that this is an ideal scenario for him that he helped to create. It is like his near-immediate diagnosis of locker-room issues as a principal issue to address.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Guys guys calm down

Professor Deadhead clearly knows what he's talking about. We're drowning in success right now as an organization with *so many* avenues to become a winning team soon.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

Briere isn't a robot who learned the game of hockey from those guys. He's a former player who understands the game. He learned the business side of things from them sure, but as far as assessing talent and puzzling in the pieces he thinks will work going forward, that's yet to be seen.

Briere wanted shittruck..

hes the godam same as the old bois club.

its why he was hired...

 

[renberg]

Tortorella might have seen the job as a reload when signed his contract. Then he came to camp and saw Farabee, Atkinson and Couturier going to be either out or playing at a diminished level and realized that it was worse than he had thought. Then came the Hayes and Provorov incidents along with the TDA flame out. At that point, a rebuild became the only way to go.
The roster is a total grease fire. It looks like there is the possibility that Hayes, Provorov and possibly Hart are on the trading block. If Farabee, Atkinson and Couturier can come back to play close to pre injury expectations, the situation up front should be decent. However the defense is a real issue. Assuming that Provorov is moved out, there aren't three NHL quality pairings to be had. Then if Hart is moved and Ersson made the starter along with Sandstrom, goal tending is a gamble. This is a rebuild not a reload.

 

[Petr Svoboda Mullet]

Can someone explain the rationale of moving on from Hart? He’s only 24 and controllable.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Can someone explain the rationale of moving on from Hart? He’s only 24 and controllable.

Why pay a goalie a substantial contract for a window where they're going to be terrible?

They should be trying to get assets for whatever they can at this point.

Let it burn.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

Can someone explain the rationale of moving on from Hart? He’s only 24 and controllable.

he deserves to play for a real NHL franchise...

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Can someone explain the rationale of moving on from Hart? He’s only 24 and controllable.

There's still a question of, "How good is Hart?"

And if you're keeping him, he's due a huge contract, cap hit, and commitment after this season.

Meanwhile, you've got Ersson and Kolosov in the wings.

Hart's career stats to this point aren't special. But he's flashed brilliance on bad teams and probably has his best hockey ahead of him.

There are teams much closer to competing (e.g., Edmonton, even Ottawa, maybe LAK), with goaltending problems, who may be willing to give up a good bit to solidify their netminding for the next decade.

I'd be willing to gamble on Ersson and Kolosov if there's a strong offer for Hart.

 

[deadhead]

Thanks, GB. I appreciate both your respect and your disagreement. I should have underlined that I see this as a both-and situation. It is known that Tortorella speaks what he thinks, sometimes way too bluntly. I am glad that he was the squeaky wheel to stand up and say this team needs an overhaul. At the same time, it can't be overlooked that this is an ideal scenario for him that he helped to create. It is like his near-immediate diagnosis of locker-room issues as a principal issue to address.

It's also an ideal situation to do a rebuild right, and not declare "job finished" the moment they push for a playoff spot (something I'd worry about as a Senator's fan).

 

[flyersnorth]

I am just wondering, and it’s nothing personal - but who actually finds the Flyers philosophical/strategic approach to playing the game entertaining?

It’s a boring as shit product. The STH crowd in large part reeks of those unwilling to let go of the past, or admit the team they support is indeed run by people who have no competent bone in their body.

So what's the problem here?

I mean, Seattle had McCann and Dunn as their top scorers this year. Hak was a dullard here. But they are having some success. It's the Blues model.

I guarantee one thing - if the Flyers land Bedard or Fantilli, it will not be a boring product. One guy really can change everything. They won't be contenders overnight, but one elite star puts butts in seats.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

So what's the problem here?

I mean, Seattle had McCann and Dunn as their top scorers this year. Hak was a dullard here. But they are having some success. It's the Blues model.

I guarantee one thing - if the Flyers land Bedard or Fantilli, it will not be a boring product. One guy really can change everything. They won't be contenders overnight, but one elite star puts butts in seats.

The organizational philosophy and the man behind the bench won't let Bedard be Bedard though. They'll try to change him in ways that they absolutely shouldn't.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Tortorella doesn't want a Bedard. He wants a 10 goal PK specialist.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The organizational philosophy and the man behind the bench won't let Bedard be Bedard though. They'll try to change him in ways that they absolutely shouldn't.

Is that's what's wrong with Toronto? Sheldon Keefe not letting Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, and Rielly be themselves?

 

[Beef Invictus]

"Oh yeah!? Well whatabout..."

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Is that's what's wrong with Toronto? Sheldon Keefe not letting Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, and Rielly be themselves?

I'll answer this question if you answer the questions about Hakstol in Seattle.

 

[kudymen]

How do we get the organization from perpetual mediocrity?
...What mediocrity? Just look that I have one example of something bad elsewhere!

#Doing-A-Zito

 

[Beef Invictus]

How do we get the organization from perpetual mediocrity?
...What mediocrity? Just look that I have one example of something bad elsewhere!

#Doing-A-Zito

And by "something bad" they mean a situation better than ours in every single conceivable way

 

[kudymen]

And by "something bad" they mean a situation better than ours in every single conceivable way

Would you stop being a fan if your favorite franchise improved?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I'll answer this question if you answer the questions about Hakstol in Seattle.

You have questions about a Jack Adams finalist who took a 2nd year expansion team who wasn't expected to make the playoffs into a 2nd round lead against Dallas after knocking off the defending Cup champion Avalanche in round 1 after losing their 40-goal-scorer in game 3?

 

[kudymen]

 

[Beef Invictus]

You have questions about a Jack Adams finalist who took a 2nd year expansion team who wasn't expected to make the playoffs into a 2nd round lead against Dallas after knocking off the defending Cup champion Avalanche in round 1 after losing their 40-goal-scorer in game 3?

Byslma won a Jack Adams. It's generally a reward for whichever coach lucks into the best shooting or save percentages.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

You have questions about a Jack Adams finalist who took a 2nd year expansion team who wasn't expected to make the playoffs into a 2nd round lead against Dallas after knocking off the defending Cup champion Avalanche in round 1 after losing their 40-goal-scorer in game 3?

No, I have had questions about what specifically you so dearly love about what he's done with the team this year.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Do we really believe that Bowman and Lemaire only deserved two Adamses, and Sullivan/Cooper should have none? While Byslma and the living meltdown Patrick Roy have one?

It's got to be one of the poorest awards for gauging actual quality. Like leaning on the Lady Byng to determine who the best player is. The voters are lazy. They aren't diving into effectiveness and usage of schemes, deployment of available talent, compensating for injury, planning for opposition, etc.

 

[kudymen]

Byslma won a Jack Adams. It's generally a reward for whichever coach lucks into the best shooting or save percentages.

Certain Mr. Vigneault won in 2006-07, was runner-up in 1999-00, 2010-11, 2014-15, 2019-20. No wonder the Flyers had so much success with that guy. Look at all the Adams nominations.



Edit - hell. The turrible 2022-23 (this season which aint over yet!) nomminee Gerrard Gallant has already been fired
Edit2 - wrong Gallant season lol. Still a finalist in 21-22, 15-16 and winner in 17-18, wheee