Hodge
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- Apr 27, 2021
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Walman-Karlsson pairing would be -5 every game
Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion
- Thread starter WTFetus
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He could be if we got someone to play the top pair with Walman. I think Fabbro is a better skater that can do more than Ceci tends to do. Better with the puck is the primary reason. I’m not sure what the team’s plan is on defense but I wouldn’t be surprised with a major overhaul if they land the top pick and go with Schaefer. I think they’ll graduate Dickinson if they don’t get Schaefer but maybe could bring in both but they’d need to move Liljegren as he wouldn’t make sense with either.
Grinner
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- May 31, 2022
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That ship had sailed. Thank goodness
Why? The guy has no interest in playing for a rebuilding team and will be a terrible locker room presence for our young guys while he's checked out. No, thank you.
Star Platinum
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- May 11, 2024
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I think Karlsson is the exact opposite of the type of guys the Sharks need. The Sharks don't need empty calorie offensive defenders, they need solid defenders that can get pucks back, be effective in front of the net, and make solid outlet passes without panicking.
Karlsson is the last guy we need. Dude is the opposite of the identity Grier is building.
What would Celebrini think about Karlsson being checked out in the D zone?
What would Celebrini think about Karlsson being checked out in the D zone?
timorous me
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- Apr 14, 2010
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The biggest thing is that Fabbro won't turn 27 until this summer, so you could give him more years than he probably should get (say, five years) and he likely wouldn't really go downhill during the life of the contract--including the years of the deal where he'd hopefully be part of a playoff contender.
Ceci, meanwhile, will be 32 in December (I know, feel free to laugh at me saying that when it's January, but that is only a couple months into next season), so while I think he's generally fine and likely will be something like that for another year or two, you can't be giving him more than a two-year extension or you're asking for trouble.
There's also something that would be kind of nice about locking down a guy like Fabbro, not a star but a solid player, to be part of the team not just on a short-term basis, like just about all the veterans around right now, but as part of something more--part of the foundation, even if just a small part.
OrrNumber4
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- Jul 25, 2002
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The Sharks also need someone who can facilitate offense from the point with aplomb. Karlsson's also a great outlet passer. Last I remember, he's still a net positive player. Not worth 11.5, but maybe 6-8...
Also...there's not much else out there. The best bet is to go bargain hunting...and not for the player who can be the next "guy", but someone who can be a stopgap.
Even if you manage to snag a Schaefer or Nemec or Casey, or it's a Dickinson or Cagnoni who is the answer, they'll need the forward equivalent of a Granlund/Toffoli.
Last edited:
- Oct 12, 2020
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Trade Ferraro and the UFA's. Maybe even Thrun as a sweetener on a trade.
Start building with
Walman - ?
? - ?
Mukhamadullin - Liljegren
7th D: Vlasic/Cagnoni/Dickinson
Walman should be 2nd pair but I don't think Sharks can upgrade the 1st pair from FA alone without risking taking some terrible deals in the long run.
Pionk and Fabbro should be pretty good targets, but overpayment is unavoidable in that case.
Start building with
Walman - ?
? - ?
Mukhamadullin - Liljegren
7th D: Vlasic/Cagnoni/Dickinson
Walman should be 2nd pair but I don't think Sharks can upgrade the 1st pair from FA alone without risking taking some terrible deals in the long run.
Pionk and Fabbro should be pretty good targets, but overpayment is unavoidable in that case.
one2gamble
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- Dec 24, 2007
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grier is probably going to have to strike gold with some euro dman because there just isnt much available that will actually help
weastern bias
worst team in the league
Even if you like the idea of Karlsson, the player, on this team (I personally don't) there's just too much baggage between Karlsson, the person, and the Sharks for that to be anything other than a total disaster
It's a non-starter anyway, he has a full NMC, he'd never green light a trade to come back to San Jose
It's a non-starter anyway, he has a full NMC, he'd never green light a trade to come back to San Jose
I'm not even sure what the needs are on the blue line at this time. Are we giving someone like Cagnoni or Mukhamadullin another chance on next year's 3rd pairing or is someone like Dickinson or Schaefer getting that chance? Would we have enough confidence in Schaefer to step in at a higher pairing? Figuring that out is the base line of next season's blue line and helps determine who you bring in as their partner.
one2gamble
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one would think Cags and Muk will get extra looks post trade deadline but I cant imagine they have any faith in cags.
Everything but 7th defensemen, we have 7 of them already on the nhl roster.
Best part of Karlsson returning to San Jose would be all the 1st round picks that the Pens would have to include with him. Worst part would be finding a way to get Hoffmann back to get Karlsson to leave again.
Hodge
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- Apr 27, 2021
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There's nothing to figure out here. None of Mukhamadullin, Dickinson, Schaefer or Cagnoni (lol) should be expected to make the team next year.
We need to add at least two defensemen who are better than everyone currently on the roster and can push Walman-Ceci and Ferraro-Liljegren down to the 2nd and 3rd pair.
This won't make the team competitive overnight but it's the bare minimum to avoid taking a disastrous step back.
Possibly but they may want to keep all the waiver exempt guys that are healthy contributors to the Barracuda's success down there to get them into the playoffs. If all they do is move the expiring contracts in Ceci and Rutta, they could just call up someone like Schuldt or Carlsson to fill in while Cagnoni and Mukhamadullin finish the season with the Barracuda in a winning atmosphere. I'm not sure why they wouldn't have any faith in Cagnoni but it's certainly possible that circumstances make it where he gets bypassed by other talents coming around like Dickinson and Schaefer.
You have a better chance at Dickinson or Schaefer stepping in and being top pairing defensemen next year than the Sharks do at finding two acquirable top pairing defensemen in one offseason.
Hodge
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Even if that's true it doesn't matter. We can't count on 18 and 19 year olds to improve the defense unless we're okay with risking another season just like this one or worse.
We don't need legit top pairing defensemen just defensemen who are better than Walman and Ceci. That can't be that hard.
- Jun 23, 2020
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The odds have always been that this would be the case; if Cagnoni turns into anything useful, we should be quite happy - this is a possible outcome, just has never been a probable outcome.
Still a very useful flyer to take with a lottery ticket.
I'm not talking about counting on 18 and 19 year olds to improve the defense but we should be okay with having another season like this one if that's how it turns out. All I really want them to accomplish on the blue line is to get a developing young defenseman on the 3rd pairing with a veteran. The top four can be whatever. I think they're at a point where they can put a little more commitment to developing defensemen rather than just running vets up and down the lineup.
I agree it's very useful. I just think that between Cagnoni having a solid rookie season in the AHL, Mukhamadullin looking good enough with his NHL opportunity, and the possibility of having either Dickinson or Schaefer win a spot, they should map out the 3rd pairing to be for a developing player. I'm not sure how much movement they can actually do on the defensemen that they have with all of Ferraro, Liljegren, Thrun, Vlasic, and Walman all with an extra year. I'm not sure how much turnover to really expect there.
The way people are acting like Schaefer is already a shark is alarming. At best the team has a 1 in 4 chance at drafting him and that’s even if that’s who Grier is targeting in the draft.
- Jun 23, 2020
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I'd like to buy out Vlasic - no, we don't need the cap space, but his contract forces us to fill a roster spot with a decrepit corpse that could be better filled with someone who might just have a future, and his cap penalty won't extend into the period where we'd actually need the cap space (27-28 for Celebrini, Smith, and Askarov, plus Eklund a year earlier). I'd also buy out Goodrow for the same reason (plus his buyout cap hit is tiny).
Considering the position the Sharks are in right now (they've essentially assured themselves a bottom-2 finish already), it's reasonable to discuss what the team looks like with any of the top four draft prospects. That one in four chance is better than any other team. I don't think we need to reel in the draft talk as part of this. While the prospects don't have good odds of making their respective teams for next season, any of them would have pretty good odds to make our team next season.
I agree on the buyouts but won't care if Grier decides against it. If they want to make as many strides towards a more competitive team next season, they would buy them out. But if Grier's expectations next season are still pretty low then I'm okay with keeping Vlasic and Goodrow just to run down the clock on their contracts. I'd even be in favor of burying them in the minors if they were going to be professional about it. Neither should expect to have the value of being tradeable this offseason even with a retention slot. I would prefer them not to be on the Sharks next year though.
