Couture could possibly come out of this the Sharkest Shark of all time. Swimming in the deep waters that is post 2020 Sharks hockey but refusing to ever drown.
Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion
- Thread starter WTFetus
- Start date
Alaskanice
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Alaskanice
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Gecklund
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I mean will he change anything? Even with him we have a below average top 6, bad bottom 6, and league worst defense.
You could add any single player in the league to this team and I don’t really know how much difference he will make.
Alaskanice
Registered User
I believe it’s a trickle down theory.
We get Couture back and the top 2 lines get better. Add in Granlund and that adds to it.
I’m not saying that this makes us world beaters but overlooking how important Logan and others returning are is.. overlooking. It will help our PP and our PK.
Gecklund
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I do think our PP will improve because I think we will go back to the 5 forward look with Couture at the point. I don’t think anything else will be any more than marginally better though. Even with Granlund.
Alaskanice
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Gecklund
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Never said they weren’t. Couture is a fine second liner and Granlund is a fine middle sixer. Granlund is a slight upgrade on Peterson and Couture is good and an upgrade over whoever we decide to trot out at 2C that day but neither of those guys are going to make much of a difference. Maybe we lose 3-0 instead of 4-0 or 4-1 instead of 4-0. That’s it though.
Alaskanice
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Gecklund
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Okay and WHY do you disagree? WHAT do you disagree with? What do you think is going to happen? You say improve in literally every area which I don’t get but whatever. What does that mean? Are you going to provide literally any details or just THEYRE GOING TO BE BETTER!
Alaskanice
Registered User
I can’t provide details since they’ve yet to play. I do know that having certain players on the top lines isn’t ideal. Replacing them with these two players will improve the PP and PK. Both can change the outcomes of games.
Bottom lines will be better, players playing on lines that better suit them.
I think Couture’s legacy is perfectly fine on the team. The team doesn’t need him though because they’re rebuilding and doing better in the standings is counterproductive to getting better talent at this stage for our team. They need more players like Will Smith and there’s only one way to get them. Sucks but that’s the price of doing everything you can to extend the competitive window.
I agree with you that Couture makes the team better in a lot of ways. I just think the team around him is too bad to change the outcomes any. We’re not a half full or half empty cup situation. The glass is empty and he’s not getting any younger but if he wants to stay, it’s fine. They could use his trade return but they can wait too. This is normal business of hockey stuff.
hohosaregood
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Our PK will probably be better. He sells out to block shots.
Funny how the conversation quickly ended about a certain prospect the sharks have after his next 2 games.
- Jun 23, 2020
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I'm not sure Couture is worth that much on the trade market, anyway. If you compare him to Karlsson, he's older, also injury prone, signed for the same term, and nowhere near as impactful when healthy, and Karlsson returned a 1st and a bunch of cap dumps.
Now, in any comparison of one player's value to another, you have to remember that trade value is not linear to expected return based on some set market, but is extremely volatile. This was my objection to the statements about the trade value of cap space in comparison to the Marleau TOR-CAR trade - just because Marleau returned a 1st, doesn't mean that every trade to clear up $6 million in cap space will return a 1st. Trades are not a large-scale money economy where prices are set by the invisible hand - they're a very small barter economy where prices wildly fluctuate based on whether anyone has eggs right now.
However, given Couture's talents, contract, and drawbacks, I'm not convinced he would actually return a 1st - especially if we don't want to retain any. I think we'd get some cap dumps and something like a 2nd or a mediocre prospect (someone like Emberson or Makiniemi or Robins - probably not going to be better than depth, and probably less than a 50% chance to hit even that).
Now, in any comparison of one player's value to another, you have to remember that trade value is not linear to expected return based on some set market, but is extremely volatile. This was my objection to the statements about the trade value of cap space in comparison to the Marleau TOR-CAR trade - just because Marleau returned a 1st, doesn't mean that every trade to clear up $6 million in cap space will return a 1st. Trades are not a large-scale money economy where prices are set by the invisible hand - they're a very small barter economy where prices wildly fluctuate based on whether anyone has eggs right now.
However, given Couture's talents, contract, and drawbacks, I'm not convinced he would actually return a 1st - especially if we don't want to retain any. I think we'd get some cap dumps and something like a 2nd or a mediocre prospect (someone like Emberson or Makiniemi or Robins - probably not going to be better than depth, and probably less than a 50% chance to hit even that).
Hodge
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- Apr 27, 2021
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Where did this idea that Granlund is a "very good player" come from? He's terrible. That's why Pittsburgh forced him on us.
Chinaski89
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The bust talk about Smith after 1 point in 2 games. Hard to continue that talk now that he got 4 points in the next 2 games.
WTFetus
Marlov
It's almost as if there's a separate Prospects Thread, rather than talking about him in the Sharks Roster discussion thread.
Shocking.
I think if the team had their way, they wouldn’t trade Couture or Hertl until Burns’ retention slot frees up and they ask out. At that point, you’re able to retain more for a two year or less duration and justify asking a 1st back for Couture. Hertl too though the retain formula might change a bit with his term then.
Yep, there's a good chance he's going to be another tank commander alongside Kunin and Hoffman when he's back...but it's better to have him eat up minutes while rebuilding than force Peterson into playing center where he doesn't belong (assuming Bordeleau goes down to the AHL when Couture is back).
- Oct 12, 2020
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I was one of those people, making my statement based on his previous achievements.
He was a big part of Finland winning 2022 gold medal game, and was 60 point player just couple of years ago. Also I thought the Pittsburgh was kinda of a one off and it's not like this team has helped him ''do his thing''.
Sharks are collectively a bad team unfortunately. Granlund is not a game changer, but he is a good playmaker that needs good players around him. Also not to go onto his personal life, but I think he had a divorce drama during his off time.
Anyway I admit he has not been good enough, but there is still time for him to make himself useful in some way. If it doesn't work, then so be it.
jMoneyBrah
Registered User
This team misses Couture for sure; but I’m not anticipating it making much of a difference in the results. I don’t think much will be gained adding to the offensive end until the Sharks defense is massively upgraded.
The Sharks defense is consistently pinned in their own zone and generally reduced to flipping the puck up ice. Breakouts are more often than not stifled in the neutral zone before they really get rolling. Right now the Sharks game is the hockey equivalent of a field possession game in football; except the Sharks lack a short-game QB or workhorse RB, and they are just repeatedly punting out of their own end zone.
Maybe if they added a couple of quick strike forwards they could play a counter attack game; but Couture isn’t that, they don’t have anything like that coming through the pipeline, and, like, I’m not sure other teams are lining up to trade away players like that. Even then, if they don’t have a defense group that can pass those players into space I don’t know that it really makes a difference in the end.
The Sharks defense is consistently pinned in their own zone and generally reduced to flipping the puck up ice. Breakouts are more often than not stifled in the neutral zone before they really get rolling. Right now the Sharks game is the hockey equivalent of a field possession game in football; except the Sharks lack a short-game QB or workhorse RB, and they are just repeatedly punting out of their own end zone.
Maybe if they added a couple of quick strike forwards they could play a counter attack game; but Couture isn’t that, they don’t have anything like that coming through the pipeline, and, like, I’m not sure other teams are lining up to trade away players like that. Even then, if they don’t have a defense group that can pass those players into space I don’t know that it really makes a difference in the end.
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