Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion

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How many years in a row are we going to fall for a player's performance in meaningless games down the stretch of a season where the Sharks have already been eliminated? We should put about as much stock into post-deadline games as we do into preseason games. Bordeleau looked completely out of his depth at the beginning of last season and wasn't even that great in the AHL. I think that says way more about who he is at this stage.
I think the annoying part for some is you act like you’re 100% objective in your player evaluations. You’ll spend pages and pages trying to explain the logic of certain moves or player opinions, when its obvious to everyone (except you apparently) that you're not completely objective and you have certain players that you either like or don't like for whatever reason.
 
Kunin throws hits that leave him out of position, is a terrible penalty killer, isn't good at fighting (though, full marks for being willing) and isn’t leading anyone to anything of any significance

The idea that he's more valuable than a younger player who is at least a serviceable injury call up in Bordeleau just because he does more things but does them very poorly is ridiculous

Zadina has also not established himself as a depth player, he got regular healthy scratches on the 2024 Sharks, he's the one we should be questioning tendering a QO, not Bordeleau
If GMMG wants to build his own version of Florida and New York then Kunin would be great on the 4th line. Can definitely agree about Zadina. He's already played 262 NHL games, I doubt he's getting much better.
 
Can we spend 4 pages arguing about Patrick Rissmiller next?

Grier filled the team with marginal NHLers and garbage other teams didn’t want because the last two seasons his goals were entirely different.

This all changes now that Celebrini and Smith are coming to the Sharks — meaning this summer his job is to cut as many replacement level guys and bring in actual NHLers (likely older vet guys as we’ve all been saying) to help Smith/Celebrini/Muhk grow and get comfortable in the NHL.

That said, I’d prefer to let go Zadina over Bordeleau if only because Bordeleau genuinely improved and looked far better when he came to back to play. Yes, it was the end of the year, but I think it was pretty obvious he had changed his game and had grown a lot. I’d rather reward that guy with another opportunity to see if he can continue his growth (and if not trade him/make him a Cuda vet) over Zadina who I like but who, let’s face it, has had virtually no growth ever.

But honestly, I don’t super care if all of them are gone, just give my boy Gushchin a chance…
 
Can we spend 4 pages arguing about Patrick Rissmiller next?

Grier filled the team with marginal NHLers and garbage other teams didn’t want because the last two seasons his goals were entirely different.

This all changes now that Celebrini and Smith are coming to the Sharks — meaning this summer his job is to cut as many replacement level guys and bring in actual NHLers (likely older vet guys as we’ve all been saying) to help Smith/Celebrini/Muhk grow and get comfortable in the NHL.

That said, I’d prefer to let go Zadina over Bordeleau if only because Bordeleau genuinely improved and looked far better when he came to back to play. Yes, it was the end of the year, but I think it was pretty obvious he had changed his game and had grown a lot. I’d rather reward that guy with another opportunity to see if he can continue his growth (and if not trade him/make him a Cuda vet) over Zadina who I like but who, let’s face it, has had virtually no growth ever.

But honestly, I don’t super care if all of them are gone, just give my boy Gushchin a chance…
Grier was right to try and fill in the blanks with cast offs and such. The Sharks were juggling in and out various AHLers with very poor results. They were completely overwhelmed
 
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Joking aside, I like the improvements Bordeleau showed at the end of the year. But it could just be Peterson again...he needs to maintain that play.
 
Can we spend 4 pages arguing about Patrick Rissmiller next?
I was vaguely wondering who from the past would be a relevant comp to this discussion. Great deep cut name pull here.

The other names would be to, like, go back to 1993 and argue about (checks internet) who among John Carter, Mike Sullivan, or Mike Peterson should stay or go.
 
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Totally. Zetterlund, Granlund, Sturm and Blackwood have been solid. Thrun and Emberson have shown some nice flashes. And we’ll see how these draft picks perform soon enough.

That was just an attempt to make a point that Grier has a lot to do before I think he’s “crushing it.”
Saying he's been crushing it is certainly premature to me, but I think the enthusiasm for how he's done has more to do with the big picture of where the franchise was when he came in versus most of the players he's acquired. Do I care about the specifics of guys you listed in that post above--like that he took a chance on Lindblom or Nutivaara? Not really. Even something like the Benning signing has to be taken in the context of nobody wanting to join the Sharks at the time, so, hey, there's a mildly cromulent guy most of the time (excepting his high-visibility f***ups).

It's really about Grier having a plan and acting on it. And, I'd say, convincing Plattner to go along with the full tear-down.

Obviously winning the lottery this year helps his resume, but that required good fortune. Outside of that, though, it's been about Grier moving on players who were of little use to the team going forward in a rebuild--and in some cases actual hindrances with their contracts--and actually getting valuable assets in return.

I'm a fan of the Meier, Karlsson, and Hertl trade returns, and the fact that he made those three trades and did some nice restocking of the cupboard in the process is way more important to me than the signings he's made that were never likely to be all that successful.

And on top of that, the draft from last summer (which I count as his first real draft) is looking very good a year out; I'd say that Smith, Musty, Halttunen, Pohlkamp, and Cagnoni have all kicked on nicely in that time. No guarantees, but obviously that development is great to see.

So, back to the "crushing it" idea: like I said, it's too early for me to make such a proclamation, but in terms of what really matters for the rebuild? Very happy so far.
 
Can we spend 4 pages arguing about Patrick Rissmiller next?
You reminded me of his absolute mugshot on hockeydb...

1717083753724.png


Kinda reminds me of Brad Hamilton... not sure why.

1717083961077.png
 
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Can we spend 4 pages arguing about Patrick Rissmiller next?

Grier filled the team with marginal NHLers and garbage other teams didn’t want because the last two seasons his goals were entirely different.

This all changes now that Celebrini and Smith are coming to the Sharks — meaning this summer his job is to cut as many replacement level guys and bring in actual NHLers (likely older vet guys as we’ve all been saying) to help Smith/Celebrini/Muhk grow and get comfortable in the NHL.

That said, I’d prefer to let go Zadina over Bordeleau if only because Bordeleau genuinely improved and looked far better when he came to back to play. Yes, it was the end of the year, but I think it was pretty obvious he had changed his game and had grown a lot. I’d rather reward that guy with another opportunity to see if he can continue his growth (and if not trade him/make him a Cuda vet) over Zadina who I like but who, let’s face it, has had virtually no growth ever.

But honestly, I don’t super care if all of them are gone, just give my boy Gushchin a chance…
I’ll believe Grier wasn’t trying when I see who he brings in this year. I really suspect that he liked some of those castoffs and believed in them or why bother keeping them now
 
Can we spend 4 pages arguing about Patrick Rissmiller next?

Grier filled the team with marginal NHLers and garbage other teams didn’t want because the last two seasons his goals were entirely different.

This all changes now that Celebrini and Smith are coming to the Sharks — meaning this summer his job is to cut as many replacement level guys and bring in actual NHLers (likely older vet guys as we’ve all been saying) to help Smith/Celebrini/Muhk grow and get comfortable in the NHL.

That said, I’d prefer to let go Zadina over Bordeleau if only because Bordeleau genuinely improved and looked far better when he came to back to play. Yes, it was the end of the year, but I think it was pretty obvious he had changed his game and had grown a lot. I’d rather reward that guy with another opportunity to see if he can continue his growth (and if not trade him/make him a Cuda vet) over Zadina who I like but who, let’s face it, has had virtually no growth ever.

But honestly, I don’t super care if all of them are gone, just give my boy Gushchin a chance…
I prefer 4 pages of Nolan Schaffer or Jan Caloun myself
 
Clearly you're correct and Mike Grier is wrong. What does he know? All he's done is brought this franchise back from the dead in less than 2 years.
Technically, what Grier has done to this point is take the franchise off life support and let it die with dignity. Now he's in the Dr. Frankenstein phase of discovering whether he can reanimate the corpse.
 

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