2023-2024 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread

[Mike Liut]

I think the only way we can turn this team around is with a complete 2-3 year tank job. It will be painful, but how else are we going to add the necessary pieces to return to be an elite team again? There is no other way. We have some nice pieces on the current team and in the minors, but nowhere near enough elite level talent that is needed to compete for a cup. It will require trading Buch and possibly Parayko Too, but it needs to happen. Otherwise we’ll be stuck In a decade long floundering position.

 

[stl76]

I think the only way we can turn this team around is with a complete 2-3 year tank job. It will be painful, but how else are we going to add the necessary pieces to return to be an elite team again? There is no other way. We have some nice pieces on the current team and in the minors, but nowhere near enough elite level talent that is needed to compete for a cup. It I’ll require trading Buch and possibly Parayko Too, but it needs to happen. Otherwise we’ll be stuck In a decade long floundering position.

Smart trades & signings, good player development, excellent drafting, and a bit of luck. There’s no guarantee, but it is absolutely possible to do without deliberate tanking. Heck there’s not even a guarantee if we deliberately tank.

 

[Quaz]

Smart trades & signings, good player development, excellent drafting, and a bit of luck. There’s no guarantee, but it is absolutely possible to do without deliberate tanking. Heck there’s not even a guarantee if we deliberately tank.

There is no guarantee that a player taken in the top 5 will work out, so purposely tanking (unless you are Chicago) isn't necessarily going to work out. I would rather get into the playoffs and gain some playoff experience for the younger guys. Buchnevich, Kyrou, and Thomas could still benefit from more playoff games.

 

[Majorityof1]

There is no guarantee that a player taken in the top 5 will work out, so purposely tanking (unless you are Chicago) isn't necessarily going to work out. I would rather get into the playoffs and gain some playoff experience for the younger guys. Buchnevich, Kyrou, and Thomas could still benefit from more playoff games.

How valuable is getting spanked and swept in the first round for playoff experience? Which young guys are getting the experience? Tucker? Neighbours on the 4th line? Thomas won a cup. Buch and kyrou have 20 games. 4 more won't make a big difference.

A Top 5 pick isn't a gurantee but it is a better chance of hitting big than a late teens, early 20s pick.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

How valuable is getting spanked and swept in the first round for playoff experience? Which you guys are getting the experience? Tucker? Neighbours on the 4th line? Thomas won a cup. Buch and kyrou have 20 games. 4 more won't make a big difference.

A Top 5 pick isn't a gurantee but it is a better chance of hitting big than a late teens, early 20s pick.

personally, it's not the playoff experience that i think this team needs. it's more talent. but it also needs to recapture our culture, which while the playoffs won't specifically address, it's the fighting for playoffs, battling hard, playing the right way that i think we need to focus on. if we do that and still suck because we are light on talent this year, so be it. if we want to deal buchy to get more talent, i am on board. but i don't want the team to dog it like they did much of last season, as i don't see that as path to success.

 

[TK 421]

I think the only way we can turn this team around is with a complete 2-3 year tank job. It will be painful, but how else are we going to add the necessary pieces to return to be an elite team again? There is no other way. We have some nice pieces on the current team and in the minors, but nowhere near enough elite level talent that is needed to compete for a cup. It I’ll require trading Buch and possibly Parayko Too, but it needs to happen. Otherwise we’ll be stuck In a decade long floundering position.

There's really not one set way to achieve on ice success, it takes a variety of things all working in concert so if we view it more as a multi faceted approach rather than we must tank or support another similar type of absolutism I think we're coming closer to a realistic view of what it actually takes.

For instance when you look at the general desire around here to fix the defense personnel you have different suggestions as to how the Blues should go about doing that. Some state this should be addressed in the draft. Others suggest we'll have to trade for that player since we don't have anyone ready or even present in the current D prospects. Still others suggest signing a UFA though for the most part the Blues don't tend to be active early in UFA or in on most big fish. None of these people are wrong because it will take a combination of these three ways to execute changing a roster into a winner.

When you look at our prospect pool and see zero top pair potential D men and a single top 4 potential guy in Lindstein you come to the realization that even IF we draft high and hit big in '24 on a top pair potential D we're still waiting several years until that player is helping the NHL roster and there's tons of risk in counting on him to pan out as a top pair guy. Of course you want to add these type of players in the draft so you can increase your chances of success but finding a target for trade in an overlapping approach should also be something your GM is pursuing along with looking for that ideal UFA signing(shivers at thought of UFA contract). Both of the latter options involve much less risk as you're dealing in known commodities and also has the huge benefit of being an immediate help on ice vs waiting on prospects to develop. With 7 1st round picks from the last 4 drafts the Blues are in a ideal position to deal from that wealth to get a targeted LD BUT they have cap constraints and many NTC's that prevent Doug from exercising certain potential trades right now. If he's careful about not adding to the problem he could let some of these D contracts expire and gradually free up enough money to find a creative solution to adding that top pair D through trade or UFA while drafting and developing that player in house at the same time.

 

[Mike Liut]

K

Smart trades & signings, good player development, excellent drafting, and a bit of luck. There’s no guarantee, but it is absolutely possible to do without deliberate tanking. Heck there’s not even a guarantee if we deliberately tank.

im not saying we deliberately tank, I’m just saying I’d rather keep moving players that don’t fit our next window. If our next window starts in 3-4 years, what is the purpose of keeping players like Buch, Saad, Parayko, Binny and Faulk, who I feel all have trade value, unlike Leddy and Krug.

 

[Mike Liut]

Do you know what’s going to suck? The Hawks out tanked us last year and got Bedard and this year they’ll out tank us and get the best dman on the board. Friggen Hawks

 

[Meatball]

We trash, huh?

 

[Mike Liut]

We trash, huh?

Im afraid so. Might be a .500 team if Binny keeps playing great. Otherwise we’re a 70 pt team who should be major sellers at the TDL.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Woo top 5 pick

 

[stl76]

K


im not saying we deliberately tank, I’m just saying I’d rather keep moving players that don’t fit our next window. If our next window starts in 3-4 years, what is the purpose of keeping players like Buch, Saad, Parayko, Binny and Faulk, who I feel all have trade value, unlike Leddy and Krug.

I think there is a purpose to keeping some good veteran players: maintain a good environment for developing younger players. That said, I’m open to moving most of the guys you mentioned in the right deal. Not all of them and not all at once, but most of them individually if a good deal present itself. And FWIW, it seems like Armstrong is as well.

On a related note, would hate to see him go, but I think it’s more and more likely we see Buch traded at some point.

EDIT: just for the record tho, I don’t think we necessarily have to trade the players we are talking about for picks and prospects. The right deal for Buch or anyone else may involve younger NHL player(s), not just futures.

 

[Brian39]

Do you know what’s going to suck? The Hawks out tanked us last year and got Bedard and this year they’ll out tank us and get the best dman on the board. Friggen Hawks

They are also in year 7 of a playoff drought (excluding the bubble playoffs where they made the playoffs as the 12 seed in the West and in at least year 3 of being genuinely atrocious.

It is also well worth noting that in order to 'win' the tank, they actively traded away a bunch of talented young-to-youngish guys who absolutely could have made major contributions in the 'back to contending' cycle of the rebuild. All of DeBrincat, Dach, and Hagel are currently 26 or under. They have done a great job stockpiling picks/prospects and should have a lot of talent coming up around Bedard and whoever they draft this year.

But it took a long period of pain plus a good chunk of luck and they have basically no players of value beyond their prospects. They still have a long road to get out of the perpetual basement.

 

[stlbluz]

When do the Blues have their bonding trip & dinner where the rookies get stuck with the bill? I haven't hear much about that the last couple/few years.

 

[BlueDream]

When do the Blues have their bonding trip & dinner where the rookies get stuck with the bill? I haven't hear much about that the last couple/few years.

For the past few years they’ve done it during the week before the regular season starts. They went somewhere in Texas this year.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Dorian out in Ott. Today’s punishment final straw. I mention it here bc infamous blues exec Peter chiarelli is rumored as potential replacement in ottawa.

 

[joe galiba]

Dorian out in Ott. Today’s punishment final straw. I mentio it here bc infamous blues exec Peter chiarelli is rumored as potential replacement in ottawa.

the only question now is who is DA going to get from them for cheap

 

[Beauterham]

the only question now is who is DA going to get from them for cheap

Apparantly Pinto is going to be suspended for quite a while for gambling on (non-NHL) hockey games. That, plus the fact that the Sens still haven't been able to sign him due to no capspace will definitely hurt his value. He might very well be a bargain for a team that doesn't mind having to wait for his suspension to end.

 

[joe galiba]

Apparantly Pinto is going to be suspended for quite a while for gambling on (non-NHL) hockey games. That, plus the fact that the Sens still haven't been able to sign him due to no capspace will definitely hurt his value. He might very well be a bargain for a team that doesn't mind having to wait for his suspension to end.

I would be fine with that, but if Chiarelli is GM, I was thinking more along the lines of Chychrun and Tkachuk for Hayes and Krug with Ottawa retaining

 

[TK 421]

Dorian out in Ott. Today’s punishment final straw. I mention it here bc infamous blues exec Peter chiarelli is rumored as potential replacement in ottawa.

This is our chance to pass the curse on to someone else! Chia is like the benighted Monkey's Paw and only some of us can sense his evil. It's time brothers, the curse will be lifted(maybe).

 

[mk80]

the only question now is who is DA going to get from them for cheap

I could be wrong but don’t the Sens have some intriguing D prospects?

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

I could be wrong but don’t the Sens have some intriguing D prospects?

They have Sanderson who is a stud, but none of the other d they picked in last 5-6 years have developed as they hoped.

 

[Meatball]

I guess it'll be another few years before we're serious contenders again. Much as I love Kyrou, Thomas, and Parayko, they're complimentary pieces on a serious contender (like the 2019 team) and not 1st line talent. I could be wrong, but I'm not seeing it.

Blow it up before it's too late.

 

[Snubbed4Vezina]

Delete

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

I guess it'll be another few years before we're serious contenders again. Much as I love Kyrou, Thomas, and Parayko, they're complimentary pieces on a serious contender (like the 2019 team) and not 1st line talent. I could be wrong, but I'm not seeing it.

Blow it up before it's too late.

i don't think it's fair to blame the only good players for how bad we are. they would have been frontline players in 2019. buchy and faulk too. problem is in 2019 we had 5-6 forwards at that level, not 3. and we had better d depth too. we're at least 3-4 guys on the level of our best guys from being legit contender, and that's if we get better play from bottom half the lineup than we get now.