2023-2024 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread

[TheDizee]

I guess it'll be another few years before we're serious contenders again. Much as I love Kyrou, Thomas, and Parayko, they're complimentary pieces on a serious contender (like the 2019 team) and not 1st line talent. I could be wrong, but I'm not seeing it.

Blow it up before it's too late.

Thomas is #1 material. Wins face offs and under the right leadership and core can be a big piece.

Parayko is a superb complementary D-man and you need people like him to win cups. He is a #2 though and will never be a #1.

Kyrou is what he is. He will never excel vs top talent on the ice against him bc he floats and won't work hard enough.

 

[wiscrev]

Thomas is #1 material. Wins face offs and under the right leadership and core can be a big piece.

Parayko is a superb complementary D-man and you need people like him to win cups. He is a #2 though and will never be a #1.

Kyrou is what he is. He will never excel vs top talent on the ice against him bc he floats and won't work hard enough.

This+

 

[Linkens Mastery]

So when is Schenn gonna start showing up? 1 Points in 8 games, -6, only 8 shots on the season, below 50% faceoff. He's been visibly on multiple of out scoring chances against. Last night he blindly threw a puck straight to McKinnon, A few days ago he couldn't corral a puck then sent it over Krugs stick directly to a Malkin sprinting out of the penalty box. Dude needs to be much f***ing better.

 

[Mike Liut]

So when is Schenn gonna start showing up? 1 Points in 8 games, -6, only 8 shots on the season, below 50% faceoff. He's been visibly on multiple of out scoring chances against. Last night he blindly threw a puck straight to McKinnon, A few days ago he couldn't corral a puck then sent it over Krugs stick directly to a Malkin sprinting out of the penalty box. Dude needs to be much f***ing better.

Schenn is in serious decline

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Schenn is in serious decline

I don't believe that. I think getting the Big Shiney C on his chest is weighing him down and he needs to get ahold of his thick skull.

 

[ezcreepin]

Schenn is in serious decline

So when is Schenn gonna start showing up? 1 Points in 8 games, -6, only 8 shots on the season, below 50% faceoff. He's been visibly on multiple of out scoring chances against. Last night he blindly threw a puck straight to McKinnon, A few days ago he couldn't corral a puck then sent it over Krugs stick directly to a Malkin sprinting out of the penalty box. Dude needs to be much f***ing better.

Nahhhhh, he's always had stretches of unbelievably bad play. Last year he had a 5 game stretch going 0-0-0 and -8, 4 game stretch going 0-0-0 and -5, and 6 game stretch going 0-0-0 and -7. In those 15 games, he had 15 shots. I don't know what his faceoff % was in those games, but he's never been great at it, though I will grant that he's losing skill there. He's also never been a +/- darling while on the Blues, but he could hit upwards of -30 or -40 if he doesn't start to get going. I don't think he's in a "massive" decline, but he might be slowing down a bit. Still had 65 points last year and 21 goals so *shrug*

I don't believe that. I think getting the Big Shiney C on his chest is weighing him down and he needs to get ahold of his thick skull.

It could be that, but he may just not have good chemistry with anyone. The powerplay has been atrocious and he does get a fair amount of points on there, so maybe that's a place to get him going.

 

[Klank Loves You]

Schenn is as good as torch bearer as anyone until we are ready to contend again. Keeping a winning culture when you're not winning is hard. If Schenn can maintain that, and teach the kids coming up about the mentality it takes to win, then ill swallow that contract.

 

[BlueDream]

So when is Schenn gonna start showing up? 1 Points in 8 games, -6, only 8 shots on the season, below 50% faceoff. He's been visibly on multiple of out scoring chances against. Last night he blindly threw a puck straight to McKinnon, A few days ago he couldn't corral a puck then sent it over Krugs stick directly to a Malkin sprinting out of the penalty box. Dude needs to be much f***ing better.

When is anyone going to show up?

Kyrou has 3 points, Hayes has 2, Buchnevich 2, Saad 2, Parayko 1, Faulk 1, Krug 0.

I mean the entire team is complete garbage. Good luck to Schenn for keeping his sanity captaining this roster because it wouldn’t be fun.

 

[Brian39]

When is anyone going to show up?

Kyrou has 3 points, Hayes has 2, Buchnevich 2, Saad 2, Parayko 1, Faulk 1, Krug 0.

I mean the entire team is complete garbage. Good luck to Schenn for keeping his sanity captaining this roster because it wouldn’t be fun.

Kyrou having 1 goal, 2 assists, and 26 shots is a hell of a lot better of a performance than Schenn's 0 goals, 1 assist, and 14 shots. Especially since 2 of his 3 points came at even strength.

Saad is playing better defensively than Schenn while also scoring 2 goals. He's also playing 1:18 a night less on the PP.

Buch missed 2 games with injury (plus most of a 3rd and clearly didn't look right in his first game back). I have a hard time looking at his (still better than Schenn's) production and saying he's on the level Schenn has been this year.

Kevin Hayes is a middling 3C who we pay half of what we pay Schenn. My expectations for how he should show up is a hell of a lot different than Schenn in his first 8 games after getting a C.

The other 3 are D men who I don't expect to outscore Schenn. On the season as a whole, our D has been far from our problem this year.

I think Schenn is underperforming expectations a hell of a lot more than everyone on this list.

 

[BlueDream]

Kyrou having 1 goal, 2 assists, and 26 shots is a hell of a lot better of a performance than Schenn's 0 goals, 1 assist, and 14 shots. Especially since 2 of his 3 points came at even strength.

Saad is playing better defensively than Schenn while also scoring 2 goals. He's also playing 1:18 a night less on the PP.

Buch missed 2 games with injury (plus most of a 3rd and clearly didn't look right in his first game back). I have a hard time looking at his (still better than Schenn's) production and saying he's on the level Schenn has been this year.

Kevin Hayes is a middling 3C who we pay half of what we pay Schenn. My expectations for how he should show up is a hell of a lot different than Schenn in his first 8 games after getting a C.

The other 3 are D men who I don't expect to outscore Schenn. On the season as a whole, our D has been far from our problem this year.

I think Schenn is underperforming expectations a hell of a lot more than everyone on this list.

Schenn is top 5 on the team in xG, scoring chances and high danger chances. Has the 3rd best Fenwick despite only getting 39% o-zone starts. He’s 2nd on the team in both hits and penalties drawn, so he’s been physically involved as usual.

We are usually playing decently well when he’s out there and I think when he’s been with Saad and Kapanen, that has been one of our more effective lines this season.

The puck isn’t going in for him right now but this talk about him declining and how he can’t skate is ridiculous.

Hard disagree that he’s performing worse than anyone else on that list. Kevin Hayes is borderline useless, I don’t care what he’s getting paid. Vrana is useless aside from his shot. The defense is ABSOLUTELY still a problem, and it’s crazy to act like it’s not just because our offense sucks now too. Faulk and Krug need to produce, especially because they don’t give us enough defensively, and they’re not. Our powerplay quarterbacks deserve a lot of blame for how poor our powerplay is.

 

[BadgersandBlues]

Schenn is 11th in xGF% at 40.6%. He's 12th in SCF% at 42.11%. He's 13th in HDCF% at 40% even.

He's supposed to be the 4th best forward on this team at worst. He is super underperforming right now. He's not the only one, but he's probably the one most off where he should be.

Ok I did some more digging b/c I was a little bored:

On a per/60 basis, Schenn is 16th on our team in HDSCF - generating only 7.18. The only players generating less then him are Bortuzzo, Tucker, Sundqvist, Neighbors, and Peru.

His other rate stats aren't as bad - but he's still well below a lot of guys that don't have the pedigree/expectations that he does. He's been arguably our worst player compared to projections so far.

 

[taylord22]

The other 3 are D men who I don't expect to outscore Schenn. On the season as a whole, our D has been far from our problem this year.

I may be wrong and/or in the minority here, but my issue with the D is the lack of puck support in the offensive zone and our general lack of High-Low decision making. The times where we have established a cycle and went up-high for soft ice, it's very frequently the D that turn the puck over. So many precious OZ cycles look like 3-4 on 5.

I prefer favoring goal suppression over offense and have generally been happy with the DZ play at 5 on 5; but I feel like we're watching our top 2-lines do a lot/cover a lot of ice to make up for our shortcomings on the blue-line. I suspect we'll see improvement in this area, but it has been alarming.

The forwards play a role here, don't get me wrong. Our skill depth -up front- is lower than it has been in a long-long time, but — the D reads in the OZ have been an issue the last two seasons. Struggling to decide if that's personnel, or if it's system and coaching. Maybe both.

 

[ezcreepin]

Can someone please explain to me how Barrett Jackman won the Calder back in 2003. I really don't understand other than maybe they valued defensive play and +/- more than they do now. Also how tf did Lidstrom NOT win the Calder his rookie year???

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Can someone please explain to me how Barrett Jackman won the Calder back in 2003. I really don't understand other than maybe they valued defensive play and +/- more than they do now. Also how tf did Lidstrom NOT win the Calder his rookie year???

Al MacInnis

 

[bleedblue1223]

2003 was a down year for rookie scoring on the forwards, and Jackman played a big defensive role that MacInnis also played a big part in.

 

[Thallis]

Can someone please explain to me how Barrett Jackman won the Calder back in 2003. I really don't understand other than maybe they valued defensive play and +/- more than they do now. Also how tf did Lidstrom NOT win the Calder his rookie year???

Jackman was perfect for the clutch & grab era

 

[Frenzy31]

Jackman was perfect for the clutch & grab era

I think the other player was Dats or possibly Zetterberg. Canadian d vs foreign o.

 

[STL fan in MN]

I think the other player was Dats or possibly Zetterberg. Canadian d vs foreign o.

Yeah, Zetterberg got robbed.

Jackman did have a very good rookie season but yeah, being paired with HHOFer MacInnis really helped.

Lidstrom got “screwed” out of the Calder in 1992 because Pavel Bure scored 34 goals, 60 pts in only 65 games. But certainly arguable that Lidstrom’s 60 points over a full season as a d-man was even more impressive.

 

[kimzey59]

I think the other player was Dats or possibly Zetterberg. Canadian d vs foreign o.

It was Zetterberg(Datsyuk was in his 2nd season).
Rick Nash came in 3rd.

An exceptionally bad year for rookie scorers and Jackman got the benefit of playing with Al MacInnis who had an outstanding 02-03 season(#2 in Norris voting).

 

[542365]

There was a thread about it years ago on the main boards and almost everyone agreed that Jackman deserved it over Zetterberg for what it’s worth.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

How is Krug a +3 on the season. Lol wtf

 

[Beauterham]

How is Krug a +3 on the season. Lol wtf

Not only that, but with not a single point in 10 games.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Not only that, but with not a single point in 10 games.

I wonder what the highest +/- is without scoring a point

 

[bleedblue1223]

Only 1 full-time player doesn't have a point and it's not Binnington, it's freaking Krug.

Such a terrible move by Army.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Only 1 full-time player doesn't have a point and it's not Binnington, it's freaking Krug.

Such a terrible move by Army.

But but, he's a +3