Olympics: 2022 Beijing Olympics

[Havre]

Obviously I wouldn't know, but the more I read about this the less likely I find it that she has used this as a PED.

Either way just a sad story.

 

[BMann]

Hope Latypov gets a thumping. Throwing away the gold. His three team mates should be giving him the cold shoulder. Completely screwed up.

 

[Havre]

That is biathlon. Like J. Bø in the pursuit I think he was a bit unlucky with the wind, then he got nervous and I think he started to notice the cold (J. Bø struggled to load his exta shots because he was freezing).

Not sure if a thumping works, but I guess there are some cultural differences here.

To me the mental aspect is what makes biathlon so special. Extremely frustrating on the first stage as a Norwegian, but clearly more "rewarding" on the last.

 

[kihei]

I tend to agree. There is also precedent here as other athletes who have tested positive for the same substance were subsequently banned for, I believe, 8 or 9 months(a bobsledder I think for one)..She may have legitimately not known what she was taking, and she may have tested clean in Beijing, but it doesn't change the fact that she was given an illegal substance at a high level event by coaches/staff that certainly did know. Just because she's a great skater/the favorite and underage shouldn't mean she gets a free pass to cheat, and hopefully the full investigation will be done fairly and with all the evidence. I won't hold my breath on that though.

I thought the adjudicating panel made
the right decision. She is fifteen. She may have just done what she was told, trusting her coaches, and there are a lot of questions still to be sufficiently resolved. To ban her at this stage could destroy her emotionally. Let the investigation move forward and then if there is a guilty verdict at least the world spotlight will have shifted to other matters. I think this approach is the humane thing to do.

 

[Hanji]

I thought the adjudicating panel made
the right decision. She is fifteen. She may have just done what she was told, trusting her coaches, and there are a lot of questions still to be sufficiently resolved. To ban her at this stage could destroy her emotionally. Let the investigation move forward and then if there is a guilty verdict at least the world spotlight will have shifted to other matters. I think this approach is the humane thing to do.

Correct.

And, like always, our hypocrisy is shining through.

Everything in the Valieva case turns on this: she is 15 | 3 Wire Sports

 

[JTBF81]

I thought the adjudicating panel made
the right decision. She is fifteen. She may have just done what she was told, trusting her coaches, and there are a lot of questions still to be sufficiently resolved. To ban her at this stage could destroy her emotionally. Let the investigation move forward and then if there is a guilty verdict at least the world spotlight will have shifted to other matters. I think this approach is the humane thing to do.

But I guess all the other skaters who put in all the time and effort while doing it without doping should just be like oh well, if she's not getting punished, guess we should start doping as well?? What about their emotional state seeing someone get to compete who tested positive? She's also 15, not 5, by now she should have some understanding that everything she takes could be damaging. I realize she was likely just taking what her coaches/trainers were giving her, but some culpability is also with her. If the full investigation exonerates her and her team, great, have the ceremony then and let her and Russia keep any medals she was a part of, but if she took an illegal substance, she deserves to have the medals stripped and be suspended, just like others recently did for the same medication. The only reason she should've been taking this was for a heart condition, which it seems pretty clear she doesn't have from what I've read and heard.

 

[BMC]

Valieva team claim positive test may be due to grandfather’s heart medication

Quick, write up a back-dated prescription for heart medication for her grandpa.

Unfreakingbelievable even for the Russians.

I mean they actually expect people to believe this. Wow.

Yet why not? They keep getting away with it. When the IOC banned Russia from the Olympics they never should have allowed their athletes to compete period, instead of allowing them to compete under "Russian Olympic Committee" with no anthem, flag etc. It should have been an outright ban.

 

[BMC]

I thought the adjudicating panel made
the right decision. She is fifteen. She may have just done what she was told, trusting her coaches, and there are a lot of questions still to be sufficiently resolved. To ban her at this stage could destroy her emotionally. Let the investigation move forward and then if there is a guilty verdict at least the world spotlight will have shifted to other matters. I think this approach is the humane thing to do.

I think it would be less emotionally traumatizing to be disqualified from skating now rather than to win the competition only to have the investigation confirm the use of a banned substance, have the gold medal stripped and her be held up to the world as a cheater. Her reputation in the skating community could never recover from that.

I'm not unsympathetic to her, I get she's only 15 and yeah she probably just did what her coach told her to do. However, her competitors and the sport itself must receive equal consideration too.

 

[BMC]

But I guess all the other skaters who put in all the time and effort while doing it without doping should just be like oh well, if she's not getting punished, guess we should start doping as well?? What about their emotional state seeing someone get to compete who tested positive? She's also 15, not 5, by now she should have some understanding that everything she takes could be damaging. I realize she was likely just taking what her coaches/trainers were giving her, but some culpability is also with her. If the full investigation exonerates her and her team, great, have the ceremony then and let her and Russia keep any medals she was a part of, but if she took an illegal substance, she deserves to have the medals stripped and be suspended, just like others recently did for the same medication. The only reason she should've been taking this was for a heart condition, which it seems pretty clear she doesn't have from what I've read and heard.

If she had a heart condition there's no way she could have become a world class level skater.

 

[Fantomas]

Considering that Russian athletes are the most strictly tested at the Olympics, what would be the point of doping which can then be easily detected through testing?

Occam's razor, no one was cheating and this is just something that happened by accident. The investigation will likely confirm that and haters can go suck a nut.

 

[Havre]

Considering that Russian athletes are the most strictly tested at the Olympics, what would be the point of doping which can then be easily detected through testing?

Occam's razor, no one was cheating and this is just something that happened by accident. The investigation will likely confirm that and haters can go suck a nut.

Even more so when she was caught with something that is questionable even improves her. The statements I have seen from people who should know is that it has zero effect. But there might be different views on that of course. I haven’t followed it so closely.

I’m not sure if that drug might be used to cover up something else though. That could change how I view this.

 

[JTBF81]

Considering that Russian athletes are the most strictly tested at the Olympics, what would be the point of doping which can then be easily detected through testing?

Occam's razor, no one was cheating and this is just something that happened by accident. The investigation will likely confirm that and haters can go suck a nut.

Except she tested positive at a high level Russian event in December. Yes, she's tested clean so far in Beijing, but after all the scrutiny Russia has faced with their state sponsored doping program, they'd be quite stupid to do it at the games. The point remains that she did in fact test positive for a drug that is banned by WADA according to reports, and if the full investigation proves either her or her team did in fact cheat this way, she and Russia should have their results in these two events vacated and medal placement advanced to the next team/individual in the order of finish.

 

[Fantomas]

Even more so when she was caught with something that is questionable even improves her. The statements I have seen from people who should know is that it has zero effect. But there might be different views on that of course. I haven’t followed it so closely.

That's precisely the thing. Many of the so-called "performance-enhancing drugs" aren't performance-enhancing at all. Once you read up seriously on the subject, it becomes apparent that the fight against doping is needly excessive, sometimes arbitrary and often politically motivated.

And absolutely no one benefits, especially the athletes.

Doping is not an issue in figure skating. There are actual serious moral-ethical dilemmas in the sport, particularly the exploitation of young teenage (tween) girls for national sporting supremacy. Girls who suffer debilitating injuries due to overtraining. As usual, the media is obsessed with the wrong thing.

 

[kihei]

But I guess all the other skaters who put in all the time and effort while doing it without doping should just be like oh well, if she's not getting punished, guess we should start doping as well?? What about their emotional state seeing someone get to compete who tested positive? She's also 15, not 5, by now she should have some understanding that everything she takes could be damaging. I realize she was likely just taking what her coaches/trainers were giving her, but some culpability is also with her. If the full investigation exonerates her and her team, great, have the ceremony then and let her and Russia keep any medals she was a part of, but if she took an illegal substance, she deserves to have the medals stripped and be suspended, just like others recently did for the same medication. The only reason she should've been taking this was for a heart condition, which it seems pretty clear she doesn't have from what I've read and heard.

So she is kicked out and then "the full investigation exonerates her and her team." What could then possibly right that wrong? Let her skate; let the investigators do their job. There are questions that need to be resolved. No need to react in the heat of the moment.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

I know when I was 15 I always used to mistakenly take my grandparents heart medication. Real easy to mix up!!

 

[Neil Patrick Harris]

The solution to all this is to not let minors compete at the Olympics.

You can't reconcile the need to have stringent, inviolable rules with the need to protect underage athletes from those same rules. It just doesn't work.

I sympathize with Valieva. She's fifteen, and ultimately the product of the system around her. Society has (largely) accepted that people her age cannot be held wholly responsible for their actions in many, many circumstances. I doubt very much she personally made the choice to dope knowing the consequences that could arise. Yet she's the one who has to stand in the spotlight now, rather than those that led her to this unenviable position.

 

[JTBF81]

So she is kicked out and then "the full investigation exonerates her and her team." What could then possibly right that wrong? Let her skate; let the investigators do their job. There are questions that need to be resolved. No need to react in the heat of the moment.

Sure, it's a reasonable approach to take if there's any doubt. From what I read it seemed that the Swedish lab confirmed the positive test from 12/25 at the Russian championship. Yes, it took the lab a long time to confirm(allegedly because of a covid outbreak among employees in the lab), but I'm sure that will come out in the full investigation.

It's only because of this delay that there should be any question of her being allowed to compete, not the fact that she's 15 or what damage it could do to her emotionally(maybe her coaches/trainers shouldnt have been giving her the drug and there would be no reason for concern over her emotional and possibly physical well being). However, my point of contention is that if she tested positive for a banned, illegal substance that was then seemingly confirmed by a major lab backed by the doping agencies, why should she not face similar consequences as any other athlete who has tested positive. I'm sure if it was some non gold medal favorite athlete who was a year older(and thus not considered a minor by the international organization/courts) they would have made the same ruling....She's an amazing skater and athlete, and I hope she wasn't being given banned substances for advantage, but all the evidence so far points to the contrary.

Hopefully a thorough and fair investigation is done, and if she was actually clean, great, but unless samples were corrupted or serious lab error occurred, 2 positive confirmations of tbe same sample seems at least reasonably accurate. I think it's reasonable to think she didn't know or was led to believe she was taking something else, but even so, if she is found to have been given this substance, it doesn't make her win in the singles(very likely) or Russia's win in the team event legitimate. For a nation that had state backing of doping their athletes and then basically received no real punishment(wow so they can't hear their anthem or wear the colors/compete under "Russia"), it really can't be said to be a big surprise if this is yet another case of it.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Considering that Russian athletes are the most strictly tested at the Olympics, what would be the point of doping which can then be easily detected through testing?

Occam's razor, no one was cheating and this is just something that happened by accident. The investigation will likely confirm that and haters can go suck a nut.

....actually, Occam's Razor in this case is that the ROC is really good at doping. She may be an unwitting pawn, but given that to do what she does is only really possible for someone very young it's more likely than not she was provided an edge. Russia has no credibility here.

 

[Albatros]

I gave Valiyeva the benefit of the doubt initially due to her young age, but after hearing the absurd explanations about getting three different meds in her system after accidentally drinking from her grandpa's glass it's evident that she was using the substances as a PED cocktail for doping purposes. Should be banned like any other violator. Her coaches too for that matter.

 

[Havre]

....actually, Occam's Razor in this case is that the ROC is really good at doping. She may be an unwitting pawn, but given that to do what she does is only really possible for someone very young it's more likely than not she was provided an edge. Russia has no credibility here.

And all Germans are nazis? I mean if you don’t believe things have or even can change that would be the logical conclusion. The same would go for American athletes of course. Can’t trust them considering their history of using PEDs.

We believe the new Russian doping-system is to give their athletes substances that most likely got zero effect on their performances? Seems odd since Russia are so good at it.

Not defending what Russia clearly did. And anti doping seems to be a bit of a joke in general. Kenya being a “good” example the last couple of years. Kenyan runners were “allowed” to dominate year after year without anyone really questioning testing schemes etc. then suddenly a bunch are caught. I just don’t think it is that obvious Russia are now worse than others.

 

[Havre]

At least Norway won't win this relay or

Unfortunately this is what you often get with Eckhoff. When her shooting is good she is the best in the world, but normally it isn't. Two penalty laps in one shooting is quite frankly laughable, but it happens... and the other day Norway won because of something similar so....

Hoping Sweden can take this.

 

[AB13]

Don’t hate relays anymore.

 

[Oberyn Martell]

I am happy with the medal but I feel sooo sorry for Eckhoff. She is such a nice girl and doesn't deserve this

 

[Brunkmeister]

Called it.

 

[Havre]

I am happy with the medal but I feel sooo sorry for Eckhoff. She is such a nice girl and doesn't deserve this

Yeah. Eckhoff is cool. Tandrevold as well. So many top athletes are just boring, but they are quite funny.

I think she'll manage. She had 1-1.5 years with solid shooting, but we all know this can happen with her. When she shoots well she might win a relay for Norway - when she shoots like today we might lose because of her (at least a medal). It's fine. Rather have someone that occasionally win you something than a bunch of skiers that are solid, but that will never win you anything.