2022-23 Roster Discussion

[BarnabyJones PI]

pk has been a remarkable improvement compared to the last few years. i attribute a lot to the change in coach staff/system or style. how this team/org made little to no changes year after year while the PK was one of the worst in the league is beyond me.

Kyle Connor shouldn't have been out there. I don't mind him jumping in at the tail end of a PK like now, but not just rolling him out as often as they were, hoping that he'd eventually make great strides in that area. I'd also not just put this on him, because I don't think that any of the Top 6 should be out there.

It gets the bottom 6 more ice time, more responsibility, more integrated in what they're doing collectively, better "team" building, etc.

 

[Jet]

Why not? Better than losing every game. And it isn’t just 20 games it is being part of a playoff run and maybe another cup. Star players are ultra competitive and choose being in the fight 100% of the time over an early tee time.

Yeah and you'd think a guy like that has to be pretty bored/ frustrated with the current situation in Chicago. He might consider it an adventure

 

[Channelcat]

We've basically got 4 offense drivers and 3 are on the same line. I'd personally like to see Connor and Perfetti swap and maybe also drop Wheeler down to the third. Even a guy like Kuhlman would be better with 55 than Wheeler is right now.

Perf-Pld-Ehlers
Connor-55-Kuhlman
Menno-17-Old man Wheeler

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

Harkins called back up on emergency basis, Heinola sent down.

 

[Adam da bomb]

We've basically got 4 offense drivers and 3 are on the same line. I'd personally like to see Connor and Perfetti swap and maybe also drop Wheeler down to the third. Even a guy like Kuhlman would be better with 55 than Wheeler is right now.

Perf-Pld-Ehlers
Connor-55-Kuhlman
Menno-17-Old man Wheeler

I think Pld and Kc already showed they have great chemistry.
Connor Pld wheeler
Perf. Schief. Ehlers
Menno 17. Barron

 

[Channelcat]

I think Pld and Kc already showed they have great chemistry.
Connor Pld wheeler
Perf. Schief. Ehlers
Menno 17. Barron

Agreed, this is a great option too. It still balances the lines nicely.

 

[voyageur]

Harkins called back up on emergency basis, Heinola sent down.

The flu must be hitting some of the forwards hard.

 

[garret9]

Just thought this might be intriguing for trade and roster discussion:

 

[voyageur]

Just thought this might be intriguing for trade and roster discussion:

I think the statistical information must be flawed because it doesn't correspond with the Jets record.

Definitely there is some tradeoff for roles, and the Jets have some players with good defensive metrics and poor xG stats, Maenalanen being one of them. If the Jets come to a point where they have to waive a player on the current roster, who would you choose out of AJF, Kuhlman and Capobianco?

 

[Buffdog]

Just thought this might be intriguing for trade and roster discussion:

All teams win off of their elite players

Some don't win in spite of elite players

Also, it's strange when people talk like goaltending isn't a part of the team

 

[surixon]

Just thought this might be intriguing for trade and roster discussion:

Sorry Garett but this doesn't compute. You tell me how a player pacing above 50 points that has now gotten their Xgf underlying metrics to close to break even is fourth line quality.

This is the issue I have with these metrics and they did the same thing to JoMo back when he was a rookie as well. They attribute most of the success to the proven player and penalize the younger one.

I'll gladly take 50 plus points and break even metrics from a second line player.

Wheeler is also pacing well above 3RW levels and his possesion metrics are also leveling out at break even rates.

So hard to really find any value in your analysis in a line that is beating their matchups, killing it in terms of outscoring and scoring chance generation. If it wasn't for that one Vegas game they'd be killing it from an XGF and HDCF as well.

 

[Jet]

Just thought this might be intriguing for trade and roster discussion:

My counter to this is practically every team has this. You have players who are outperforming, performing as expected, and underperforming. A team like Boston just has more guys outperforming (I would think). That's why having more good players gives you a better chance of winning - because even those who are underperforming have a higher baseline than a replacement.

I disagree that depth is our weakness. I think we have a lot of NHL quality players. I think the Jets roster weakness is in the middle of the lineup. You go from top tier players to a lot of mid low to low tier players. Good news is a good portion of the lower end players are young and inexperienced, and have the potential to grow into better players.

To me, stuff like this is what worries me about advanced stats. Depending on the story you want to tell, you can paint a bleak picture.

 

[Jet]

All teams win off of their elite players

Some don't win in spite of elite players

Also, it's strange when people talk like goaltending isn't a part of the team

The goaltending thing always makes me laugh.

It would be like a baseball fan saying 'you only won because of your elite ace' or a football fan saying 'you only won because you have a great QB'.

That never happens because all 3 sports have a position that is unequally important to the team's success. Baseball probably not quite as much as the other two, but you get the point.

If you want to win more, go and get an elite goalie, simple

 

[Guffman]

Sorry Garett but this doesn't compute. You tell me how a player pacing above 50 points that has now gotten their Xgf underlying metrics to close to break even is fourth line quality.

Ever since he was promoting Dano and Petan with his ”statistical analysis”, I don’t trust any analysis coming from him.

Saying Peretti is playing like a fourth line player just adds to Garett’s mystique of bizarre statistical conclusions.

 

[MardyBum]

All teams win off of their elite players

Some don't win in spite of elite players

Also, it's strange when people talk like goaltending isn't a part of the team

Look at the Avs lines last year or Bolts previous years for the kind of lines you need to be a legitimate contender, and I want this team to be a legitimate contender.

Luckily, with no more LTIR issues, we will have some cap space to add better depth at the TDL.

 

[DRW204]

 

[Buffdog]

Look at the Avs lines last year or Bolts previous years for the kind of lines you need to be a legitimate contender, and I want this team to be a legitimate contender.

Luckily, with no more LTIR issues, we will have some cap space to add better depth at the TDL.

If you look at cup winners, they tend to have either:

1. Semi-generational talent (upper level elite) like avs (Mackinnon Landeskog), Tampa (Stamkos Kucherov) pens (Crosby Malkin) Chicago (toews kane)

Or

2. Elite goaltending

Most often both. The higher the level of the elite talent (Pittsburgh), the less elite the goalie seems to have to be.

They all also have a cornerstone D man

I wouldn't call schief, PLD, Connor and ehlers upper elite but it's certainly solid. Jomo is showing signs of being that dman and helle can be good enough to make up for the fact that our forward core isn't semi-generational

 

[DRW204]

If you look at cup winners, they tend to have either:

1. Semi-generational talent (upper level elite) like avs (Mackinnon Landeskog), Tampa (Stamkos Kucherov) pens (Crosby Malkin) Chicago (toews kane)

Or

2. Elite goaltending

Most often both. The higher the level of the elite talent (Pittsburgh), the less elite the goalie seems to have to be.

They all also have a cornerstone D man

I wouldn't call schief, PLD, Connor and ehlers upper elite but it's certainly solid. Jomo is showing signs of being that dman and helle can be good enough to make up for the fact that our forward core isn't semi-generational

id say: we have genreational goaltending and, this year bordering on elite top-6 and 1 elite dman.

 

[KingBogo]

And Ville's roller coaster goes back up.

 

[MardyBum]

The goaltending thing always makes me laugh.

It would be like a baseball fan saying 'you only won because of your elite ace' or a football fan saying 'you only won because you have a great QB'.

That never happens because all 3 sports have a position that is unequally important to the team's success. Baseball probably not quite as much as the other two, but you get the point.

If you want to win more, go and get an elite goalie, simple

The Jets win a bunch because of Hellebuyck.

He added Helle along with some elite F's, and it's true. That still makes him part of the team though lol. It's just our defensive play is middle of the pack, so you can't say we're winning because of an elite defense. It's solid defense, some elite players, and an elite goalie, not "depth" atm.

If you look at cup winners, they tend to have either:

1. Semi-generational talent (upper level elite) like avs (Mackinnon Landeskog), Tampa (Stamkos Kucherov) pens (Crosby Malkin) Chicago (toews kane)

Or

2. Elite goaltending

Most often both. The higher the level of the elite talent (Pittsburgh), the less elite the goalie seems to have to be.

They all also have a cornerstone D man

I wouldn't call schief, PLD, Connor and ehlers upper elite but it's certainly solid. Jomo is showing signs of being that dman and helle can be good enough to make up for the fact that our forward core isn't semi-generational

I think the core of the Jets is good enough to be the core of a stanley cup winning team, especially with Hellebuyck, just need to surround that with better depth now. Two of the Avs most important players were Lehkonen and Nuke.

Nuke was a reclamation project they got for free after Dallas bought him out. A guy who had good underlying numbers but had zero finish.

Lehkonen was the best acquisition at last years TDL, another really good two way forward with great underlying numbers, also didn't cost a first and he was an RFA so allowed them to retain him.

I hope Chevy makes a few shrewd deals around the TDL.

 

[surixon]

And Ville's roller coaster goes back up.

Well I hope they plan on playing him in a couplemof games otherwise they should have just left him down.

 

[MardyBum]

Well I hope they plan on playing him in a couplemof games otherwise they should have just left him down.

Yeah I imagine he'll get in on at least one game on this road trip, otherwise what is the point.

 

[LowLefty]

And Ville's roller coaster goes back up.

I think it is a good move to get Ville into as many game as possible before the PO's - and they need to get him into the odd game against top competition - I hope they do.
It's important that they determine if he is ready for a PO run against the best under PO conditions.
Development, experience and growth aside, I think it's up to Bones to sort out who he can feel comfortable with when the chips are down and where the younger guys can step in if needed (injuries). He needs to sort out his depth as we work through the back half.
It's all about winning at this point.

 

[KingBogo]

Well I hope they plan on playing him in a couplemof games otherwise they should have just left him down.

Agreed, for his sake it is much better to play then sit in the PB. Might also be precautionary as they are going on a 5 game road trip? Or maybe, he is one of the players teams are asking about as Chevy is shaking trees on what might be available as we get closer to the TD, and they want to scout him?

 

[Jet]

Yeah I imagine he'll get in on at least one game on this road trip, otherwise what is the point.

I think the point is you don't have to make a last minute move and have Ville potentially playing the night before for the Moose and then traveling to play with the Jets if there is an injury. Plus there's an added benefit of increased pay for him, and practicing and being around the players and coaches.

So, even if he doesn't play, there are measurable benefits to bringing him on the road trip