2022-2023 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread

[Bobby Orrtuzzo]

I love the concept of a Blues Hall of Fame. There are a ton of guys I'd like the organization to honor that don't rise to the level of number retirement. I also like that the inaugural class includes the 8 retired numbers and two non-players. I also like that they opened up a fan vote to help determine an additional player (or players?) to join those 8 in the inaugural class.

But their self-described criteria for induction as a player is bizarre. They claim that a player must have won a Cup or a major award as a Blue, which would eliminate most of the guys that you can vote on to join inaugural class. Berenson, CuJo, Oates, Unger, Tkachuk, Turgeon, Backes, Arbour, and Babych all fall short of that criteria, but are included as candidates. That's two-thirds of the candidates.

Details of the announcement aside, I think this is great. I love when teams have a level of 'honor' that falls short of numbers in the rafters. I'd like everyone on that list to be honored by the team in an official capacity even though I wouldn't retire any of their numbers.


All 8 guys with retired numbers are going in automatically (along with Sid Salomon Jr and Dan Kelly). At least one other person will be joining that class, but they didn't specify how many more people would be going in.

Oh I missed the part about all the retired numbers, that makes sense.

If they truly do the “must’ve won a cup or major award” thing is true, it’s basically gonna be just the 18-19 team and like 5 other guys

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Toropchenko is skating with lines already, what in the terminator recovery

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Big announcement?

McDrai for Kostin. Book it!

 

[TK 421]

Toropchenko is skating with lines already, what in the terminator recovery

Toropchenko at home rehabbing.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Toropchenko at home rehabbing.

View attachment 590494

It’s not a shoulder.

 

[Reality Czech]

Toropchenko is skating with lines already, what in the terminator recovery

I wonder if that means "Hasta la Vista, baby" to Klim Kostin's chances of making the team.

Speaking of Kostin... There was some debate in the other thread about the need for toughness on the team. Call it an enforcer or not, but I wonder if Kostin could potentially fill that role. I wonder if he's willing or able to be a guy whose only role is too play 5-10 high energy minutes a night, drop the gloves when necessary and hit everything that moves. Basically can he play a Ryan Reaves type role if it's clear he doesn't have top 9 skill?

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I wonder if that means "Hasta la Vista, baby" to Klim Kostin's chances of making the team.

Speaking of Kostin... There was some debate in the other thread about the need for toughness on the team. Call it an enforcer or not, but I wonder if Kostin could potentially fill that role. I wonder if he's willing or able to be a guy whose only role is too play 5-10 high energy minutes a night, drop the gloves when necessary and hit everything that moves. Basically can he play a Ryan Reaves type role if it's clear he doesn't have top 9 skill?

The big issue with asking Kostin to play a power forward toughness role is that they've been asking him to do that and he just ignores it.

 

[BlueDream]

I wonder if that means "Hasta la Vista, baby" to Klim Kostin's chances of making the team.

Speaking of Kostin... There was some debate in the other thread about the need for toughness on the team. Call it an enforcer or not, but I wonder if Kostin could potentially fill that role. I wonder if he's willing or able to be a guy whose only role is too play 5-10 high energy minutes a night, drop the gloves when necessary and hit everything that moves. Basically can he play a Ryan Reaves type role if it's clear he doesn't have top 9 skill?

He technically should have the ability to do that because he's a big, tough dude who is actually a really good fighter. But I don't think he has the drive or awareness to do it, so it won't happen. He doesn't really bring the energy that you would hope. If he did, then I think the Blues would be happy to have him carve out a 4th line role, but unfortunately there's just something missing there, or something that isn't clicking in his head.

So yeah, I expect Toropchenko to basically take his spot.

 

[Reality Czech]

The big issue with asking Kostin to play a power forward toughness role is that they've been asking him to do that and he just ignores it.

Yeah I guess so. It comes down to how willing he is to do that, plus I'm not sure he has the killer instinct to be effective in that role.

He should take note of Barbashev, who first had to make himself useful as a fourth line grinder until his game developed enough to be more than that.

 

[Reality Czech]

He technically should have the ability to do that because he's a big, tough dude who is actually a really good fighter. But I don't think he has the drive or awareness to do it, so it won't happen. He doesn't really bring the energy that you would hope. If he did, then I think the Blues would be happy to have him carve out a 4th line role, but unfortunately there's just something missing there, or something that isn't clicking in his head.

So yeah, I expect Toropchenko to basically take his spot.

You pretty much summed it up. I think we all like Torpo, but he's not really mean enough to fill that role. But at this point he definitely offers a lot more than Kostin. It's kind of crazy how he looked like he belonged right away. Guess some guys just get it while others never do.

 

[BrokenFace]

I love the concept of a Blues Hall of Fame. There are a ton of guys I'd like the organization to honor that don't rise to the level of number retirement. I also like that the inaugural class includes the 8 retired numbers and two non-players. I also like that they opened up a fan vote to help determine an additional player (or players?) to join those 8 in the inaugural class.

But their self-described criteria for induction as a player is bizarre. They claim that a player must have won a Cup or a major award as a Blue, which would eliminate most of the guys that you can vote on to join inaugural class. Berenson, CuJo, Oates, Unger, Tkachuk, Turgeon, Backes, Arbour, and Babych all fall short of that criteria, but are included as candidates. That's two-thirds of the candidates.

Details of the announcement aside, I think this is great. I love when teams have a level of 'honor' that falls short of numbers in the rafters. I'd like everyone on that list to be honored by the team in an official capacity even though I wouldn't retire any of their numbers.


All 8 guys with retired numbers are going in automatically (along with Sid Salomon Jr and Dan Kelly). At least one other person will be joining that class, but they didn't specify how many more people would be going in.

I think Tkachuk lead the league in goals the last season before they started awarding the Rocket, but your point stands. It's hard to find the right balance between making formerly great hockey players feel included in the current organization while still having a strict standard.

I think all the ex players who stayed in town or who work with or contribute to the Blues in some capacity is an underrated aspect of the team's success. We are not an O6 team nor are we in a huge market, but we do have a uniquely strong alumni base that seems very engaged with the current team. That's very valuable itself.

 

[Majorityof1]

I was looking at the roster and musing about what the opening night roster will look like. With the most recent round of cuts, here is where the roster sits

Forwards (21): Locks (9) - Acciarri, Barbashev, Buchnevich, Kyrou, O'Reilly, Saad, Schenn, Tarasenko, Thomas,
Injuries (4) - Angello. Frk, Toropchenko, Washkurak
Still Fighting (7) - Alexandrov, Brown, Highmore, Kostin, Leivo, Neighbours, Walker,
PTO (1) - Pitlick

Defense (11): Locks (6) - Bortuzzo, Faulk, Krug, Leddy, Mikkola, Parayko
Injuries (2) - Perunovich, Scandella
Still Fighting (3) - Kessel, Rosen, Tucker

Goalies (4): Locks (2) - Binnington, Griess
Still fighting/waiting to be cut (2) - Ellis, Hofer

The goalies are locked and have been locked. I highly doubt either youngster steals Griess' spot. I can't even say if Ellis sticking around means he beat Zherenko for the AHL backup job, as Zherenko was sent to Springfield.

The D is probably pretty locked in too. Scandella and PErunovich's injuries made for a clear top 6. Rosen has the inside track to be the 7th man. It also helps that we probably want Tucker and Kessel getting reps in the AHL not sitting in the press box as they have less experience than Rosen. Barring a move or Perunovich being ready to come back before the season, I'd say its obvious who the 7 are.

The forwards are a bit more open. I am assuming the 3 injured guys are still injured on opening night. Angello might have been sent down if possible, so I doubt he changes the equation if healthy. That leaves 9 guys fighting for 5 spots.

I'd say Brown is nearly a lock. I only listed guys who got definite NHL contracts or were regulars last year for us. Pitlick probably earned a spot. He's 2nd on the team in pre-season points and has looked good all around. I think they have Neighbours in the top couple but don't want him on the 4th line, so he gets sent down.

The last couple spots are really a toss up. I'd guess Walker, Leivo and Kostin still. But I wouldn't be surprised to see anyone. Neither Highmore nor Wash have have any points. Alexandrov has the one goal. Their advanced stats aren't anything to write home about. On the flip side, Walker leads the team and Leivo is very high on all the fancy advanced stat percentages (CF%, XGF%, etc). So I'd put them after Brown as the next closest.

I personally still give the last spot to Kostin based on inertia of being on the squad last year, and I still think he brings something with his hitting, I have no clue what Berube and Arsmtrong will do. Berube definitely does not seem happy with Kostin, so I could see anybody getting the 14th spot. It doesn't matter much as they'd just be warming the seat for Toropchenko.

Edit: Thanks for pointing out Washurak's injury. I missed it. Fixed the chart.

 

[MissouriMook]

@Brian39 Washkurak should be in your list of injured forwards. He's week-to-week, I believe, but I wouldn't see him in the Opening Night roster equation even when healthy.

I feel like the last 5 spots at forward will be Leivo, Brown, Walker, Pitlick (if he signs) and Kostin if Toropchenko isn't ready for opening night. If Toropchenko is ready or close, I think we have to listen to what Chief has been saying and assume that Kostin is the odd man out. At the moment, I think the only thing that can save Kostin if Toropchenko is on the active roster and not IR is if someone else signs Pitlick before we do.

Man, even 2 years ago, who would have guessed that Kostin would lose a roster spot to Toropchenko? I also think there is a good chance they go with Tucker to be the 7th D over Rosen if we don't sign or claim someone off waivers. I know Tucker is waivers exempt and Rosen isn't, I just feel like the coaching staff sees something that they would like to nurture for a while on the NHL roster.

 

[STL fan in MN]

You can add Washkurak to the injured list. He’ll be out about another month at least.

 

[Brian39]

The big issue with asking Kostin to play a power forward toughness role is that they've been asking him to do that and he just ignores it.

Kostin was 7th on the team and 3rd among forwards in hits last year despite playing in just 40 games. Everyone's favorite bottom sixer Toropchenko had 2.46 hits per game last year. Dakota Joshua's 77 hits in 30 games was good for 2.56 per game. Kostin had 2.25 hits per game and did that in about 1:40 less TOI per game than Torpo. Kostin and Torpo each fought once lasst year. Kostin fought Scott Mayfiled (6'5", 220 lbs and 13 career NHL fights) while Torpo fought Jasperi Kotkaniemi (6'2", 201 lbs and 2 career NHL fights). Joshua fought twice last year, fighting two guys who can genuinely throw.

There is plenty of room for more physicality (among many other improvements) in Kostin's game, but I agree with @Majorityof1's take from another thread that the narrative around Kostin has become detached from his actual contributions. It is simply not true that Kostin has just ignored requests to be physical. He isn't running around like Blais did in 2018/19 and 2019/20, but no one does that reliably (including Blais, who can't stay healthy).

Kostin is hanging around the fringe of a 14 forward NHL roster and there is a genuine complaint that he doesn't do any single thing/role well enough to beat guys out for a job. But this narrative that he just does literally nothing and is completely useless has gotten a bit out of hand.

 

[Majorityof1]

@Brian39 Washkurak should be in your list of injured forwards. He's week-to-week, I believe, but I wouldn't see him in the Opening Night roster equation even when healthy.

I feel like the last 5 spots at forward will be Leivo, Brown, Walker, Pitlick (if he signs) and Kostin if Toropchenko isn't ready for opening night. If Toropchenko is ready or close, I think we have to listen to what Chief has been saying and assume that Kostin is the odd man out. At the moment, I think the only thing that can save Kostin if Toropchenko is on the active roster and not IR is if someone else signs Pitlick before we do.

Man, even 2 years ago, who would have guessed that Kostin would lose a roster spot to Toropchenko? I also think there is a good chance they go with Tucker to be the 7th D over Rosen if we don't sign or claim someone off waivers. I know Tucker is waivers exempt and Rosen isn't, I just feel like the coaching staff sees something that they would like to nurture for a while on the NHL roster.

You can add Washkurak to the injured list. He’ll be out about another month at least.

Thanks. I fixed the list in my post.

I apparently need to post more. Mook sees a big long post and assumes it's @Brian39 lol. I'll take my post getting mistaken for one of his as a great compliment.

 

[MissouriMook]

Thanks. I fixed the list in my post.

I apparently need to post more. Mook sees a big long post and assumes it's @Brian39 lol. I'll take my post getting mistaken for one of his as a great compliment.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I wonder if that means "Hasta la Vista, baby" to Klim Kostin's chances of making the team.

Speaking of Kostin... There was some debate in the other thread about the need for toughness on the team. Call it an enforcer or not, but I wonder if Kostin could potentially fill that role. I wonder if he's willing or able to be a guy whose only role is too play 5-10 high energy minutes a night, drop the gloves when necessary and hit everything that moves. Basically can he play a Ryan Reaves type role if it's clear he doesn't have top 9 skill?

The only role he can fill is Bad Guy Who Dies First in the upcoming Missing in Action IV: The Klim Kut.

 

[ort]

I also don’t mind the idea of a hall of fame. But they have to keep it pretty exclusive or it won’t mean much. Maybe one entry every year? Every other year?

I’m guessing they will have an actual physical hall of fame at enterprise? That would be kinda fun.

 

[Brian39]

I also don’t mind the idea of a hall of fame. But they have to keep it pretty exclusive or it won’t mean much. Maybe one entry every year? Every other year?

I’m guessing they will have an actual physical hall of fame at enterprise? That would be kinda fun.

I would prefer for it to not be extremely exclusive. Pat Maroon wasn't here long and wasn't an amazing player. But I want him and/or that game 7 2OT winner featured in a Blues Hall of Fame. Gunnar was a serviceable vet, but I want him and/or his OT winner enshrined in a Blues Hall of Fame. Maroon's was literally a series winner in a game that looked like we were going to get goalied. We don't win the Cup Final if we go down 2-0 in that series. Both deserve a place in a team Hall of Fame.

But even if you want exclusivity,. all 10 guys in the 'vote for who else deserves it' poll they put up should go in at some point. So should Petro, ROR, Binnnington, Tarasenko, Berube, and Army when they retire. Even if you do two a year, that's almost a decade before you start having to make real decisions.

 

[ort]

I think one per year would be the right balance. Put in all the retired numbers (as they are) and then select on one per year.

My vote for first guy to in goes to Bouwmeester. Integral part of cup win, forced to retire after such a scary incident, amazingly popular in the room and an all around good guy. They need a cup winner in asap, and between Steen, Gunnar and Bouw, I choose Bouw.

 

[izzy]

I also don’t mind the idea of a hall of fame. But they have to keep it pretty exclusive or it won’t mean much. Maybe one entry every year? Every other year?

I’m guessing they will have an actual physical hall of fame at enterprise? That would be kinda fun.

I think best way to do it is maybe do a big 4 or so initially and then maybe like 1 a year after that

 

[Xerloris]

Any guesses as to who goes in first?

Limiting it to 4 like the cardinals do, I’ll go:

Hull
Plager
Federko
Pronger

I think the first 3 are locks, the 4th spot could also be Sutter or MacInnis

The Blues Hall of Fame will recognize 10 automatic inductions, including the eight players that have had their numbers retired:

• Al MacInnis
• Bob Gassoff
• Bob Plager
• Barclay Plager
• Sid Salomon Jr., original team owner

• Brian Sutter
• Brett Hull
• Bernie Federko
• Chris Pronger
• Dan Kelly, legendary broadcaster

 

[execwrite1]

The Blues Hall of Fame will recognize 10 automatic inductions, including the eight players that have had their numbers retired:

• Al MacInnis
• Bob Gassoff
• Bob Plager
• Barclay Plager
• Sid Salomon Jr., original team owner

• Brian Sutter
• Brett Hull
• Bernie Federko
• Chris Pronger
• Dan Kelly, legendary broadcaster

As an old-timer, love your list. Great recognition of the Blues history.

I would put Gassoff in a separate category, not the main Hall.

 

[Xerloris]

As an old-timer, love your list. Great recognition of the Blues history.

I would put Gassoff in a separate category, not the main Hall.

Sorry but I didn't mean to represent this as my own list. This is directly from the Blues website and it's official.