2022-2023 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread

[Xerloris]

after dicking around with the draft simulator I am 100% convinced that we need to finish BARE MINIMUM #9 which is 5% lottery chance. The amount of times #9 jumps to #1 and 2 in the sim easily quadruples that of #11.

 

[Vladys Gumption]

While this season is most definitely failing because of poor roster construction, I’m starting to wonder if we should make a coaching change as well. I think Berube is a really good coach and I don’t want to see him go, but I’m quite concerned by our lack of ability to make adjustments to correct our biggest deficiencies. Sure our defense sucks, but we keep seeing the same goals over and over again. And at some point you have to adjust to cover for it. We’re just not seeing the quality team defensive play we’ve been known for over the last decade. I dunno maybe it does nothing, but it’s been on my mind for a while.

 

[PocketNines]

Giving Berube a team to coach dependent on Thomas and Kyrou to be the driving core where your best defenseman is Faulk or Parayko is not fair to Berube. A waste of his talents, there is only so much those guys can do. Berube will probably go to a Canadian team when Armstrong eventually fires him and lead it to the first Cup for a Canadian team in awhile

 

[bleedblue1223]

Our coaching staff is in a unique scenario. I think they had the right idea with MacTavish, a Berube staff to be at its best needs an experienced x's and o's type of guy, MacTavish was just a horrible selection for that. I'm fine giving Berube more time, assuming they can properly fill the role that Monty left, but that's going to be a difficult role to keep filled because every time you find a good fit, they will quickly get a HC job, and getting Monty was probably already pretty unique.

It just sucks that Monty can't be our HC.

And judging Army on his coaching selections, it's pretty hit and miss. Yeo and MacTavish were huge misses. Berube was great, and Monty was great, but his coaching was never a question, it was his drinking.

 

[PocketNines]

Yeah but at least he is in Boston gearing up for a Cup run and super familiar with Blues players and how they might boost that run, so the Blues may well still get something out of it.

 

[Brian39]

While this season is most definitely failing because of poor roster construction, I’m starting to wonder if we should make a coaching change as well. I think Berube is a really good coach and I don’t want to see him go, but I’m quite concerned by our lack of ability to make adjustments to correct our biggest deficiencies. Sure our defense sucks, but we keep seeing the same goals over and over again. And at some point you have to adjust to cover for it. We’re just not seeing the quality team defensive play we’ve been known for over the last decade. I dunno maybe it does nothing, but it’s been on my mind for a while.

I have concerns about the coaching, but I wouldn't consider a coaching change until after he's had an offseason to adjust his system and put it into place during training camp. We had plenty of defensive issues last season, but we were objectively successful as a whole last season. We had 109 points and were +29 at 5 on 5. There is a clear argument to be made that our success was due to an unsustainable shooting percentage, but I think everyone here would agree that the number of grade A++++ chances we generated last year was significantly higher than the number we've seen this year. There is also an argument to be made that Jim Montgomery was the driver of success last year and you can point at Boston's improvement this year to support that. Or maybe Berube's message has simply gotten stale. That happens all the time in this league.

I have a lot of time for those arguments and they might very well be correct. Berube very well might not be a long term solution here. This season has been a train wreck and we are wildly underperforming expectations.

But I don't turf a coach with Berube's resume of recent success based on one season of underperforming expectations. The team was 7-9-3 when he took over in 2018/19 and they went 38-19-6 under Berube (106 point pace). Then they won the Cup. The following season, we had the 2nd best record in the league when COVID shut the season down. The 94 points in 71 games that year was good for a 108 point pace. The bubble year wasn't nearly as good, but we still made the playoffs with a 9 point cushion (in an awful division in a weird year). And then last year we earned 109 points, beat a good Minnesota team in round 1 and took the eventual Cup champs a 6 game series (worth noting that they went 16-4 in the playoffs last year). All told, he made the playoffs 4 straight years, coached his team to a 106+ point pace in 3 of those seasons and delivered a Cup win.

If I'm in charge, he gets an offseason, training camp, and a decently long evaluation period in the fall to demonstrate that he's a good enough coach to fix the issues.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Another thing with Berube, how much of a role did Robinson play on the defense on that Cup run. I think Berube is a good player/man manager, but if his staff is always dependent on his assistants being the drivers for the x's and o's, I'm not sure how sustainable that will be.

And to Brian's point, I'd give him a good chunk of next season before a change is seriously considered.

 

[PocketNines]

I am very wary of reverse engineering the Cup and deciding Berube wasn't THE major coaching force that brought us that Cup because he was

 

[bleedblue1223]

I am very wary of reverse engineering the Cup and deciding Berube wasn't THE major coaching force that brought us that Cup because he was

No, he absolutely was, his player management skill was absolutely the driving force behind correcting that team. I think the difference between the 18/19 team and what we currently having moving forward is that our coaching needs are pretty different. The 2019 team had all the pieces, once Binnington showed up, the team had everything a Cup winner needed. Berube was able to pull them together, get them confident, and push the right buttons.

Moving forward, unless we luck into Bedard, we are going to need a coaching staff get more out of a team than exists. We aren't going to have a Cup caliber defensive core and we'll need a coach to get more out of them. We likely won't have a Selke caliber center to lean on. Hell, even a seek and destroy 4th line that can also score a little bit and matchup against top lines.

It's not that Berube wasn't responsible for 2019 or isn't a really good coach, I'm just uncertain if he's the best fit for what we'll have, especially compared to 2019 when he was the perfect fit for that group.

 

[Brian39]

Yeah but at least he is in Boston gearing up for a Cup run and super familiar with Blues players and how they might boost that run, so the Blues may well still get something out of it.

I wonder if Boston makes a deadline acquisition. They are absolutely rolling with the roster they have and I don't really see a clear 'need.' They've got 'rings in the room' already, all three top 9 lines are performing extremely well, and Coyle has been fantastic as a shutdown 3C this year. Rentals that make you better on paper don't always actually improve a team and there is an argument that there just isn't any tangible room for improvement from what the Bruins are this year.

They've already given up their 2nd round picks in 2023 and 2024 and they have one of the weakest prospect pools in the league. They should be willing to go all-in for a send-off Cup for Bergeron and Krejci, but I think there is real reason to look at their lineup and wonder how much one of the top deadline rentals would upgrade what they have. Even in an all-in year, is it worth giving up a 1st round pick in a great draft for a guy who only improves your team on paper? People are writing about them going after the prizes of the deadline marketplace, but I wonder if they target a swiss army knife instead of a clear top 6 guy.

Barbie feels like a guy that would fit into that organization and they know first hand that he is willing to do anything and everything it takes to win a Cup. Monty knows his game well and Barbie had a career year while Monty was here. I could see Barbie having success as a complimentary piece on any line in their top 9 and he can absolutely have success on a 4th line.

A winger gets injured anywhere in the top 9? Barbie can plug the hole. A center gets hurt? Barbie can slide in to the 3C spot in a pinch. You need him to finish chances created by others? He's a career 17% shooter and never finished a season below 11.5%. Need a guy to run around and punish opponents who hold onto the puck a bit too long? Ask Sam Girard or anyone we played in 2019 how fun it is to see Barby coming on the forecheck. His versatility makes a lot of sense for the type of add Boston might be looking to make and he very well might fit into their salary structure for an extension to be a middle 6 center for them next year and beyond.

Barbie seems like a good fit and Mason Lohrei fits the mold of what we are probably looking for. He's a big LHD that should turn pro this summer or next.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I wonder if Boston makes a deadline acquisition. They are absolutely rolling with the roster they have and I don't really see a clear 'need.' They've got 'rings in the room' already, all three top 9 lines are performing extremely well, and Coyle has been fantastic as a shutdown 3C this year.

They've already given up their 2nd round picks in 2023 and 2024 and they have one of the weakest prospect pools in the league. They should be willing to go all-in for a send-off Cup for Bergeron and Krejci, but I think there is real reason to look at their lineup and wonder how much one of the top deadline rentals would upgrade what they have.

Barbie feels like a guy that would fit into that organization and they know first hand that he is willing to do anything and everything it takes to win a Cup. Monty knows his game well and Barbie had a career year while Monty was here. I could see Barbie having success as a complimentary piece on any line in their top 9 and he can absolutely have success on a 4th line. His versatility makes a lot of sense for the type of add Boston might be looking to make and he very well might fit into their salary structure for an extension to be a middle 6 center for them next year and beyond.

Barbie seems like a good fit and Mason Lohrei fits the mold of what we are probably looking for. He's a big LHD that should turn pro this summer or next.

Yeah, I'd be on board with a Barbie/Lohrei deal. Could also see them being interested in Acciari too. Pieces that will be relatively cheaper with a high likelihood of just fitting in without missing a beat.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

I have concerns about the coaching, but I wouldn't consider a coaching change until after he's had an offseason to adjust his system and put it into place during training camp. We had plenty of defensive issues last season, but we were objectively successful as a whole last season. We had 109 points and were +29 at 5 on 5. There is a clear argument to be made that our success was due to an unsustainable shooting percentage, but I think everyone here would agree that the number of grade A++++ chances we generated last year was significantly higher than the number we've seen this year. There is also an argument to be made that Jim Montgomery was the driver of success last year and you can point at Boston's improvement this year to support that. Or maybe Berube's message has simply gotten stale. That happens all the time in this league.

I have a lot of time for those arguments and they might very well be correct. Berube very well might not be a long term solution here. This season has been a train wreck and we are wildly underperforming expectations.

But I don't turf a coach with Berube's resume of recent success based on one season of underperforming expectations. The team was 7-9-3 when he took over in 2018/19 and they went 38-19-6 under Berube (106 point pace). Then they won the Cup. The following season, we had the 2nd best record in the league when COVID shut the season down. The 94 points in 71 games that year was good for a 108 point pace. The bubble year wasn't nearly as good, but we still made the playoffs with a 9 point cushion (in an awful division in a weird year). And then last year we earned 109 points, beat a good Minnesota team in round 1 and took the eventual Cup champs a 6 game series (worth noting that they went 16-4 in the playoffs last year). All told, he made the playoffs 4 straight years, coached his team to a 106+ point pace in 3 of those seasons and delivered a Cup win.

If I'm in charge, he gets an offseason, training camp, and a decently long evaluation period in the fall to demonstrate that he's a good enough coach to fix the issues.

I support Berube returning, but MacT and MVR need to go.

 

[PJJJP]

I support Berube returning, but MacT and MVR need to go.

Yeah send those bozo's somewhere else after the season has ended. They are vital components in our tank

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Blues place Peca on waivers, hourly his injuries are behind him.

 

[Majorityof1]

Blues place Peca on waivers, hourly his injuries are behind him.

Did anyone ever say what was wrong? He just started the year on IR and has been there the whole time. Nobody even knew he was hurt until someone noticed he wasn't at training camp. then we heard nothing until now.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Did anyone ever say what was wrong? He just started the year on IR and has been there the whole time. Nobody even knew he was hurt until someone noticed he wasn't at training camp. then we heard nothing until now.

I never seen anything. While thing has been very silent

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

I never seen anything. While thing has been very silent

Another weird thing is he has already played handful of games this year in Springfield. Why put him on waivers now?

 

[Majorityof1]

Another weird thing is he has already played handful of games this year in Springfield. Why put him on waivers now?

Probably a conditioning assignment. Why they did a conditioning assignment first, I don't know. But since he was hurt in the offseason, he starts off on the NHL roster (season opening IR - no cap implications). He has to clear waivers at some point. You can send him down without waivers for 2 weeks. If he has played games before, and hasn't cleared waivers. That is the only way.

 

[Celtic Note]

No, he absolutely was, his player management skill was absolutely the driving force behind correcting that team. I think the difference between the 18/19 team and what we currently having moving forward is that our coaching needs are pretty different. The 2019 team had all the pieces, once Binnington showed up, the team had everything a Cup winner needed. Berube was able to pull them together, get them confident, and push the right buttons.

Moving forward, unless we luck into Bedard, we are going to need a coaching staff get more out of a team than exists. We aren't going to have a Cup caliber defensive core and we'll need a coach to get more out of them. We likely won't have a Selke caliber center to lean on. Hell, even a seek and destroy 4th line that can also score a little bit and matchup against top lines.

It's not that Berube wasn't responsible for 2019 or isn't a really good coach, I'm just uncertain if he's the best fit for what we'll have, especially compared to 2019 when he was the perfect fit for that group.

Just to add to the Berube isn’t an X’s and O’s guy point, I also think he inherited a team that went though a series of coaches that preached a defense first mindset to the point where many of his players had that ingrained in them.

Berube doesn’t seem the type to drive that message and the X’s and O’s behind it. That isn’t necessarily a bad thing as he is a player manager / motivator. But, with a lot of young guys coming up we need a coaching staff that can break the colts/mustangs/whatever horse gets broken (I clearly know nothing about).

Ott doesn’t seem that guy. He is more of a player’s friend / hype man.

MacT just is a useless dinosaur as far as I am concerned.

I don’t actually know what Van Ryn does. I thought he was a transition D coach, but our D cannot transition (maybe personnel is the bigger issue). Regardless, he isn’t getting them there.

I am willing to give Berube more opportunity, as I think he understands the right direction to steer the boat. He just needs the right team to help him get the team there and I think we have to clean house to make that happen.

 

[PJJJP]

Pretty good night for the tank. Ducks are about to win, the red wings/canadiens game went to OT, Sabres won, Flyers got a point, and Blackhawks won. Also good that Penguins, Capitals, sabres, and preds picked up points. Makes them move closer to staying in the hunt for the wild card which means more teams could be buying.

 

[PocketNines]

These games help other people understand it's not ROR. He wasn't his usual self no doubt, but it was starting to take on the "Blues are bad because ROR fell off a cliff" narrative.

Berube so pissed at the 5 skaters on the third goal. Repeating "5 veteran players" in a terse, abrupt press conference. Also called out the Kyrou turnover in the second period. Honestly he deserves better than this. He'd be snapped up quickly if fired that's for sure.

We got the Cup though. If they hadn't and we were sitting in this spot, dear lord that would be painful.

 

[ValHaller]

I credit Pietrangelo's leadership to some extent for the successful mindset that led to the Cup. There is only so much any coach can do without a #1 two-way franchise defenseman. Unless your forward core includes Crosby, Malkin, and a 92 point Kessel, you're not likely to have too much playoff success in the modern NHL without that key piece.

So can you really blame Berube? No, not really. Does this mean he isn't part of the problem? No, not really. Changing coaching staff is rearranging deck chairs until the defense is solved. That may take a fortunate trade or it may take 5-10 years to draft and develop. So what do you do?

 

[Spektre]

The defense on this team is beyond atrocious. Everyone seems to likes Berube but a better coach would tighten up the D. I love run and gun wide open hockey but someone has to play D besides the goalie. Army will probably never do it but Hitchcock or someone of that ilk needs to be hired to fix this team's D mindset no matter who the personal is next year and beyond.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

The defense on this team is beyond atrocious. Everyone seems to likes Berube but a better coach would tighten up the D. I love run and gun wide open hockey but someone has to play D besides the goalie. Army will probably never do it but Hitchcock or someone of that ilk needs to be hired to fix this team's D mindset no matter who the personal is next year and beyond.

Biggest issue with this team is coaching.

 

[Frenzy31]

Biggest issue with this team is coaching.

I think so also.