Prospect Info: [2022 - 1st OA] Juraj Slafkovsky (LW) Part 2

[ReHabs]

Reading this thread, I am 100% certain we would have driven MacKinnon out of town because of his production in his first 4 seasons.

Did “we” drive Galchenyuk or Kotkaniemi out of town?

What is this self-flagellation. “We” are the biggest fanboys in the NHL, Tom Kostipoulous was a legit star in Montréal.

 

[Andy]

Did “we” drive Galchenyuk or Kotkaniemi out of town?

What is this self-flagellation. “We” are the biggest fanboys in the NHL, Tom Kostipoulous was a legit star in Montréal.

Galchenyuk and KK arent 1st overall picks.

 

[ReHabs]

Not sure why so many of you keep bringing up Shane Wright. He’s not a Hab, get over it.

The Habs had their pick and chose Slafkovsky. We should learn to live with that and all that it entails.

Galchenyuk and KK arent 1st overall picks.

To this day Andrew Kostitsyn has fanboys and moonlight dreamers. Who are you kidding? Slafkovsky will have die hard believers until the end of time no matter what happens.

Only the club and media run players out of town and they do it very well. Most Habs fans are still rooting for Drouin ffs!

 

[417]

Not sure why so many of you keep bringing up Shane Wright. He’s not a Hab, get over it.

Agreed here...but one could ask why you keep bringing up....

The Habs had their pick and chose Slafkovsky. We should learn to live with that and all that it entails.

We have exactly 1 game worth to live with and some of, namely you, have already labelled what he is and what he will never become.

 

[ReHabs]

Agreed here...but one could ask why you keep bringing up....


We have exactly 1 games worth to live with and some of, namely you, have already labelled what he is and what he will never become.

I didn’t bring up Shane Wright, that’s a lie.

The most I’ve said and will continue to say is that isn’t he absence of a clear option the Habs should’ve gone with a potential 1D or 1C.

I have no clue what Slaf will become but many of you sure as hell wanna lower standards and manage expectations and it’s only been 1 pre-season game. Goes to show how much confidence you have in him.

 

[Andy]

Not sure why so many of you keep bringing up Shane Wright. He’s not a Hab, get over it.

The Habs had their pick and chose Slafkovsky. We should learn to live with that and all that it entails.


To this day Andrew Kostitsyn has fanboys and moonlight dreamers. Who are you kidding? Slafkovsky will have die hard believers until the end of time no matter what happens.

Only the club and media run players out of town and they do it very well. Most Habs fans are still rooting for Drouin ffs!

They werent first overall picks.

 

[Kennerback]

Reading this thread, I am 100% certain we would have driven MacKinnon out of town because of his production in his first 4 seasons.

We’re in Montreal, we want results from a #1 pick now. Some players take more time to develop. We can just hope they’re able to deal with the constant scrutiny and abuse until they make it. That’s just the way the cookie crumbles.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

I’m not surprised he had a mediocre first game. Imagine it was a nervous day for him. Hopefully he got the jitters out of the way and can be much better next time.

 

[ReHabs]

They werent first overall picks.

I don’t think that’s relevant to the content of your claim. If Slaf hits 63 pts this year I don’t think a single person would have grounds to complain about him.

And off that high he would have diehard forever fans who would argue up and down even if he did only achieve 50pt seasons afterwards. Much like Galchenyuk’s 30g season is oft referenced or Saku Koivu’s mythical half year is never allowed to be forgotten.

We are starved for talent.

We’re in Montreal, we want results from a #1 pick now. Some players take more time to develop. We can just hope they’re able to deal with the constant scrutiny and abuse until they make it. That’s just the way the cookie crumbles.

I don’t understand — did Galchenyuk, Drouin, or Kotkaniemi endure constant abuse and expectations of immediate greatness? Were any of them run out of town by the fans?

Why is it any different with Slafkovsky?

 

[WeThreeKings]

I don’t think that’s relevant to the content of your claim. If Slaf hits 63 pts this year I don’t think a single person would have grounds to complain about him.

And off that high he would have diehard forever fans who would argue up and down even if he did only achieve 50pt seasons afterwards. Much like Galchenyuk’s 30g season is oft referenced or Saku Koivu’s mythical half year is never allowed to be forgotten.

We are starved for talent.

I don’t understand — did Galchenyuk, Drouin, or Kotkaniemi endure constant abuse and expectations of immediate greatness? Were any of them run out of town by the fans?

Why is it any different with Slafkovsky?

Yes, the Galchenyuk, Drouin and Kotkaniemi threads were a cesspool of overreaction and nonsense. Galchenyuk and Kotkaniemi were run out of the organization by inept coaches and general manager. Drouin literally went on a mental health leave. It would have been a matter of time without the OS that the fans would have helped the Habs jettison KK out.

I don't think the right question is.. why is it any different with Slafkovsky but why are we constantly looking to prove that a promising young player sucks and fixate on every single shift of that journey to find something bad to complain about?

And don't give me the whole.. I'm skeptical of Slaf but want him to succeed. That's about as believable as me saying the same thing about Ryan Poehling. I wanted to be right more even if I said the politically correct thing after bashing him. No one can fixate negatively on every minute detail for a player/prospect but also be genuinely cheering for their success.

 

[Andy]

I don’t think that’s relevant to the content of your claim.

It's very relevant

 

[417]

I didn’t bring up Shane Wright, that’s a lie.

I didn't say you did...so that's not a lie. In fact, I literally just wrote that I agree with you, there's really no need to keep bringing up Wright.

But if that's true...there's even less reason to bring up his Liiga production, yet there you are, like a broken record, every other day about his Liiga production or lack their of.

The most I’ve said and will continue to say is that isn’t he absence of a clear option the Habs should’ve gone with a potential 1D or 1C.

Not sure I agree with drafting based on position, but that's a fair take...no issues there.

I wouldn't be so dogmatic about it but it's a fair take.

I have no clue what Slaf will become but many of you sure as hell wanna lower standards and manage expectations and it’s only been 1 pre-season game. Goes to show how much confidence you have in him.

yet you've consistently made post that say the opposite.

But to to answer your specific post, if it's about me...I don't know a whole lot about Slafkovsky, so yes, i'm going to wait to start to form a legitimate opinion on him and not use rookie tournament games, intra-squad games and 1 preseason game, as my sample size.

I don't think that has anything to do with my confidence in him and more to do with just common sense. I like information, before I reach conclusions. As much information as I can get and that's available.

 

[Jeffrey Pedler]

They werent first overall picks.

They were top 5 picks in their draft years though. You should expect big things, from someone being picked in the top 5.

 

[Andy]

They were top 5 picks in their draft years though. You should expect big things, from someone being picked in the top 5.

Disagree.

 

[Kennerback]

I don’t think that’s relevant to the content of your claim. If Slaf hits 63 pts this year I don’t think a single person would have grounds to complain about him.

And off that high he would have diehard forever fans who would argue up and down even if he did only achieve 50pt seasons afterwards. Much like Galchenyuk’s 30g season is oft referenced or Saku Koivu’s mythical half year is never allowed to be forgotten.

We are starved for talent.

I don’t understand — did Galchenyuk, Drouin, or Kotkaniemi endure constant abuse and expectations of immediate greatness? Were any of them run out of town by the fans?

Why is it any different with Slafkovsky?

Slaf will be judged based on the highest standards right away. I’m not criticizing fans. I’m just saying that’s the way it is in Montreal.

I don’t know what 3OAs or Drouin have to do with this. The only 2 comparables are Wickenheiser and Lafleur.

 

[Mrb1p]

Fan: "OMG this organization sucks at development, when are they going to put a focus on properly developing players!!!!!???"

Same fan: "OMG Slafkovsky is nothing like Jaromir Jagr, he's got no hockey sense, his decision making is bad and he's raw.".

How can the same people who constantly complain about lack of development, also expect players to be fully developed before even playing a single game.

That kind of duality must be a hell of an existence.



Both of him.

Its a false dillema you raise. Jagr looked like Jagr at 18. Crosby looked like Crosby. Ovi like Ovi.

Even guys that needed a few years to establish themselves looked special.

Jack Hughes was phenomenal every time he had the puck and would complete passes that could remind one of the Great one.

Even closer to home, Caufield and Suzuki looker every bit as special the first time they hit the ice. Now, granted these guys were 20 and Caufield has the talent level or a top pick in a 5'6 body but the point stands.

As of now, today, can you answer with an Aye or Nay if Slafkovsky impressed you as much, or gave you the same feeling as young Cole?

My reasoning is that Slafkovsky is going to be an awesome player, not unlike Weber was for the Habs, but like Weber, the Habs overpaid market value to acquire him. Wether that is important or not is another debate that Im willing to have.

 

[Mrb1p]

and in some case who they wanted was an imaginary superstar player that wasn't available in the 2022 draft.

We have Slaf now, lets be happy the Habs won't have to play against him. Just ask the poor Devils first line last night, they couldn't generate any offense when he was on the ice and it's not because he's a star defensively. He just want the puck and gets in the way.

I want to preface this by saying that I am obviously happy about Slaf, who shouldnt be happy about a free top 6 player?

With that said, in regards to your first point, people have a right to be disappointed that the draft was shit (I have my doubts about this, but lets pretend like we know theres no top players, for the exercise. ) and the Habs got, yet again, shafted (for the third time in a decade) with a "bad" draft year.

Its a bit of a semantic and ideological debate but you could very well stretch that definition to a lot, and I mean, a lot of bad players. The best example being Kotkaniemi.

And then we'd say ''HE WOULDN'T HAVE DONE IT HERE,'' while simultaneously saying that Michel Therrien was good at developing players because ''MacKinnon got 64 points his rookie season.''

We can't have nice things.

Sounds like the Shane Wright excuses already

 

[Kennerback]

I didn’t bring up Shane Wright, that’s a lie.

The most I’ve said and will continue to say is that isn’t he absence of a clear option the Habs should’ve gone with a potential 1D or 1C.

I have no clue what Slaf will become but many of you sure as hell wanna lower standards and manage expectations and it’s only been 1 pre-season game. Goes to show how much confidence you have in him.

I have the utmost confidence in Slafkovsky. Trying to lower standards and manage expectations won’t work in Montreal.

 

[417]

Its a false dillema you raise. Jagr looked like Jagr at 18. Crosby looked like Crosby. Ovi like Ovi.

And Slafkovsky, like Slafkovsky.

So no false dillema.

He's not Jagr, there's only one Jagr.

If you read an article and let a guy convince you that he was going to be or let Jagr's comments himself, convince you he was going to be as well.

That's on you (not saying that's the case, have no clue if you were expecting a Jagr-like performance last night)

Even guys that needed a few years to establish themselves looked special.

Jack Hughes was phenomenal every time he had the puck and would complete passes that could remind one of the Great one.

This simply isn't true.

My favorite Hab of all time is Andrei Markov...I think he's the one of the NHL's most underrated players of his generation. Love absolutely everything about him, never seen anyone since who approaches his level of hockey sense.

I also recall Andrei Markov's first year in Montreal.

If wasn't pretty

Disclaimer: Yes, I understand Markov was a late pick.

Even closer to home, Caufield and Suzuki looker every bit as special the first time they hit the ice. Now, granted these guys were 20 and Caufield has the talent level or a top pick in a 5'6 body but the point stands.

What did you think of Caufield last year when he had 1 goal through 30 games?

As of now, today, can you answer with an Aye or Nay if Slafkovsky impressed you as much, or gave you the same feeling as young Cole?

I can't recall how I felt first time I watched Caufield...probably because it doesn't matter to me. I don't focus on the NOW with 18-19-20-21 yr old kids.

My reasoning is that Slafkovsky is going to be an awesome player, not unlike Weber was for the Habs, but like Weber, the Habs overpaid market value to acquire him. Wether that is important or not is another debate that Im willing to have.

Maybe you're right...I also don't see NHL superstar with Slafkovsky but whether or not the Habs overpaid market value to acquire him has to be measured against the peers he was drafted with.

And that's not something that can be answered in the short-term and trying to get ahead of that curve is pointless.

I remember watching an AAU basketball game that my friend was playing in, and there were a bunch of pro/european scouts watching and I had the opportunity to speak to some of them.

All of them were universal in one thing, that it takes hours and hours of viewing a player before you can start to determine if what you see in a single game is a "one off" or "a habit".

That always stuck with me so when I read people say "Slafkovsky needs to do this _______ (insert whatever here) my mind always goes back to that.

How do you know that's not just a "one off" rather than "an habit" and more importantly, if it's the latter, is that something he or you (as a coach) can correct and eliminate and even turn into a strength?

Not telling you anything you don't know, I know your post history enough to know that you know what you're talking about.

I just get confused at how quickly people come to conclusions based on very little information.

I don't even think Slafkovsky himself realizes the potential he has, that's normal, he's 18.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Sounds like the Shane Wright excuses already

How very dare you.

 

[Mrb1p]

And Slafkovsky, like Slafkovsky.

So no false dillema.

He's not Jagr, there's only one Jagr.

If you read an article and let a guy convince you that he was going to be or let Jagr's comments himself, convince you he was going to be as well.

That's on you (not saying that's the case, have no clue if you were expecting a Jagr-like performance last night)

This simply isn't true.

My favorite Hab of all time is Andrei Markov...I think he's the one of the NHL's most underrated players of his generation. Love absolutely everything about him, never seen anyone since who approaches his level of hockey sense.

I also recall Andrei Markov's first year in Montreal.

If wasn't pretty

Disclaimer: Yes, I understand Markov was a late pick.

What did you think of Caufield last year when he had 1 goal through 30 games?

I can't recall how I felt first time I watched Caufield...probably because it doesn't matter to me. I don't focus on the NOW with 18-19-20-21 yr old kids.

Maybe you're right...I also don't see NHL superstar with Slafkovsky but whether or not the Habs overpaid market value to acquire him has to be measured against the peers he was drafted with.

And that's not something that can be answered in the short-term and trying to get ahead of that curve is pointless.

I remember watching an AAU basketball game that my friend was playing in, and there were a bunch of pro/european scouts watching and I had the opportunity to speak to some of them.

All of them were universal in one thing, that it takes hours and hours of viewing a player before you can start to determine if what you see in a single game is a "one off" or "a habit".

That always stuck with me so when I read people say "Slafkovsky needs to do this _______ (insert whatever here) my mind always goes back to that.

How do you know that's not just a "one off" rather than "an habit" and more importantly, if it's the latter, is that something he or you (as a coach) can correct and eliminate and even turn into a strength?

Not telling you anything you don't know, I know your post history enough to know that you know what you're talking about.

I just get confused at how quickly people come to conclusions based on very little information.

I don't even think Slafkovsky himself realizes the potential he has, that's normal, he's 18.

I don't let anyone's opinion convince me. Maybe except when it comes time to indulge on food, then anybody can convince me.

Youre right on Markov, theres a few players that cannot be contained in this definition. Markov, Petry, Benn, Marchand, Wheeler. Especially Marchand. All of those guys showed signs very early of special skillsets though. Maybe Marchand, never did, I guess.

Generally, the public eye (Or in this case, a few guys on this board and a few guys in the media) can corroborate your opinions on a player, thats mostly what I use to validate mine. (Sometimes people are just stupid, sometimes Im just stupid. )


I absolutely loved every second of 1 goal Cole btw, he was great almost every game and it was insane he didnt score a goal lol.

 

[morhilane]

I want to preface this by saying that I am obviously happy about Slaf, who shouldnt be happy about a free top 6 player?

With that said, in regards to your first point, people have a right to be disappointed that the draft was shit (I have my doubts about this, but lets pretend like we know theres no top players, for the exercise. ) and the Habs got, yet again, shafted (for the third time in a decade) with a "bad" draft year.

Its a bit of a semantic and ideological debate but you could very well stretch that definition to a lot, and I mean, a lot of bad players. The best example being Kotkaniemi.

It's fine to be biter that the Habs can never have nice things, but you are somewhat taking it on Slaf and he's not responsible. He didn't draft himself and he didn't dictate how the scouts would see the draft.

As for the choice of Slaf over X, I'll wait to see more of development camp to judge anyone. Slaf played one game where he was very nervous, didn't play his best game and had some issues with the speed (according to him). Lets see how the second one goes.

 

[417]

I don't let anyone's opinion convince me. Maybe except when it comes time to indulge on food, then anybody can convince me.

Youre right on Markov, theres a few players that cannot be contained in this definition. Markov, Petry, Benn, Marchand, Wheeler. Especially Marchand. All of those guys showed signs very early of special skillsets though. Maybe Marchand, never did, I guess.

None of these players were 1st overall picks playing in the NHL at 18yrs old.

So the circumstances aren't quite the same, hence why it's really pointless trying to draw parallel conclusions either way.

It's like...why did Sidney Crosby or Steve Yzerman become better players, AFTER their most productive years?

Things click for players at different periods, there's really no rhyme or reason to it and often, it never clicks at all.

Generally, the public eye (Or in this case, a few guys on this board and a few guys in the media) can corroborate your opinions on a player, thats mostly what I use to validate mine. (Sometimes people are just stupid, sometimes Im just stupid. )

But even then, in those cases, they probably don't have enough of a sample size to have their opinions on said players be anything but anectdotal.

Its like Eric Engels, who I like btw, after the intra-squad game sent a tweet saying that Slafkovsky was the best player on the ice?

Hmmm...didn't agree with it, just like I don't agree with folks who want to act like Slafkovsky looked bad last night. If it wasn't for the expectations and the name, no one would think this.

but none of this drives development...and that's really all that matters

I absolutely loved every second of 1 goal Cole btw, he was great almost every game and it was insane he didnt score a goal lol.

Fair - I didn't find he looked great btw, and it's not because he wasn't scoring goals. He just wasn't doing the things that I know he excels at when he's on his game to score goals (also that DD wasn't playing him, but don't get me started on that again).

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Its a false dillema you raise. Jagr looked like Jagr at 18. Crosby looked like Crosby. Ovi like Ovi.

Even guys that needed a few years to establish themselves looked special.

Jack Hughes was phenomenal every time he had the puck and would complete passes that could remind one of the Great one.

Even closer to home, Caufield and Suzuki looker every bit as special the first time they hit the ice. Now, granted these guys were 20 and Caufield has the talent level or a top pick in a 5'6 body but the point stands.

As of now, today, can you answer with an Aye or Nay if Slafkovsky impressed you as much, or gave you the same feeling as young Cole?

My reasoning is that Slafkovsky is going to be an awesome player, not unlike Weber was for the Habs, but like Weber, the Habs overpaid market value to acquire him. Wether that is important or not is another debate that Im willing to have.

yeah Slaf is just REALLY question mark-y for me. And you can't help but feel when a guy's question mark-y even on first impression chances are historically, it's probably not a good thing.

I'm not hating at all. I'm okay with the gamble all in all in what seems like a weak draft but you want a #1 pick to assure you more. Nothing wrong with that.

Critiques are fine. I don't particularly like trollish ones. It's usually just the tone of them that irk me. Or at least they used to.

My first real viewing of Suzuki was his piss poor WJCs where oddly enough I kind of felt reassured. You could see something there. CC was just too good too fail. He drastically improved his skating in his D+2 which was revelatory and I felt more confident than I ever had in a Habs prospect probably since PK.

Slaf looks far better than KK and Galchenyuk imo. you can see he has that certain jam which those top notch guys have but other things are kind of sticking out that aren't so good. See JeffreyLC's post. I think he nailed it. Slaf is just a real wild card for me. Feels like a real 50/50.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Boys you guys are overthinking this. My expectations are that this kid will bust solely because of the name of our organisation and the bad offensive mojo around it. Keep them expectations low like me and you are sure to not be dissapointed! Go slaf go! If we win the cup with him putting up 40 points in year 5-6 that's a win at first overall don't care what anybody tells me.

And anyways bedard or michkov can be our PPG stud while slaf asserts dominance on smaller humans