U18: 2021 WJC18

[VictorLustig]

Playing against Canada again....sigh. At least we get to see a good bronze medal game.

 

[Hinterland]

Round robin, who cares.

I don't think this is the mindset NHL teams are looking for. The kids now get their 2nd chance and they better use it.

 

[Mestaruus]

According to the IIHF site Russia will play the winner of Canada / Czech

Nope. Rules say Canada is seed #1 and faces #4 seed.

 

[David OSullivan]

You just described international hockey when Canada can bring their full team.

Not true. Canada send the best they can like every other nation at every tournament and get beat all the time. US defending world junior champions and Sweden defending u18 champs.

No one ever denies the depth Canada has and that they have no. 1 talent pool but you need to get off your high horse a little because you guys are far from unbeatable as SOME fans think yee are.

 

[spintheblackcircle]

I liked Sjoberg last night, he can move.

 

[Macman]

According to one analysis, Canada spends 14 times as much money on youth hockey than the rest of the hockey world combined. The mystery is why they don't win more often than they do? For example, with all their best players on board, they ended up losing the 2021 WJC to the USA, which is mainly indifferent about hockey in comparison to other sports.

Yeah, it's a real mystery why teams can't win every game or tournament.

 

[BadgerBruce]

Not true. Canada send the best they can like every other nation at every tournament and get beat all the time. US defending world junior champions and Sweden defending u18 champs.

No one ever denies the depth Canada has and that they have no. 1 talent pool but you need to get off your high horse a little because you guys are far from unbeatable as SOME fans think yee are.

Exactly.

Plus, Canada’s entry is definitely not its “full team.” Realistically, it’s about 70%.

The Quebec League didn’t release any of the 5-6 skaters who would have been automatic Team Canada roster selections.

Think they aren’t that good? No big loss? Those Quebec boys beat Team Ontario to win the 2019 Canada Winter Games, and the Ontario entry had Wright, Othmann, McTavish, Clarke, Stillman, Pinelli, Del Mastro, Zhilkin, and Gaudreau in net.

Yeah, they’re good. And not in this tournament.

 

[Tomas W]

I don't think this is the mindset NHL teams are looking for. The kids now get their 2nd chance and they better use it.

My point is, next game is more important. Not that Sweden isnt up for a very tough task.

 

[David OSullivan]

Exactly.

Plus, Canada’s entry is definitely not its “full team.” Realistically, it’s about 70%.

The Quebec League didn’t release any of the 5-6 skaters who would have been automatic Team Canada roster selections.

Think they aren’t that good? No big loss? Those Quebec boys beat Team Ontario to win the 2019 Canada Winter Games, and the Ontario entry had Wright, Othmann, McTavish, Clarke, Stillman, Pinelli, Del Mastro, Zhilkin, and Gaudreau in net.

Yeah, they’re good. And not in this tournament.

Every country can say x y z is the reason they didn't win a tournament.

You think other teams don't get injuries or players tied up in other tournaments or complain about population size or scheduling or other sports cutting their budget etc. Etc. Etc.

It's 5 year old stuff to come up with these excuses.

The team you have sent to tournaments is the best you could send at the time. Same as every other nation. You won a lot of tournaments because you were the best side in the tournament. You lost a lot of tournaments because you were not the best team in the tournament. Its really that simple.

 

[Tuoppi]

Anti jinxing ? We all need Bedard vs Michkov final

Many especially NA writers focus too much on few star players when its a TEAM effort.

 

[VictorLustig]

I liked Sjoberg last night, he can move.

Really good energy guy. Wouldn't surprise me if he's in the discussion for a WJC spot next year.

 

[goldenbladz1]

According to one analysis, Canada spends 14 times as much money on youth hockey than the rest of the hockey world combined. The mystery is why they don't win more often than they do? For example, with all their best players on board, they ended up losing the 2021 WJC to the USA, which is mainly indifferent about hockey in comparison to other sports.

anything can happen in single elimination playoff tournaments. If it was best of 3, 5 or 7 it's less likely they would lose.

 

[Dominance]

According to one analysis, Canada spends 14 times as much money on youth hockey than the rest of the hockey world combined. The mystery is why they don't win more often than they do? For example, with all their best players on board, they ended up losing the 2021 WJC to the USA, which is mainly indifferent about hockey in comparison to other sports.

F. You must cite your work.

 

[newmanager]

Very unusual year as Canada normally doesn't send their best to this tourney. They usually only send their good players to the Gretzky-Hlinka which,
of course, they usually dominate.

 

[Czechboy]

Not true. Canada send the best they can like every other nation at every tournament and get beat all the time. US defending world junior champions and Sweden defending u18 champs.

No one ever denies the depth Canada has and that they have no. 1 talent pool but you need to get off your high horse a little because you guys are far from unbeatable as SOME fans think yee are.

I actually looked up the results of that last best on best Olympics (2014) and World Cup which Canada won. Most the scores were in the 3-1 range. Eg. close games. Then you look at that best on best Olympic experiment and realize they didn't medal 2 out of 5 times at all. Of course we're not allowed to mention the Canada Cup they lost or the 2005 World Championships which was best on best due to a lockout.

Definitely number 1 in the world but this notion that they consistently destroy everyone when they send their best is laughable at best. I also feel these comments are best saved for after winning the Gold and not before a semifinal. Some of the comments on here after the first game against Sweden were hillarious. I hope people aren't expecting another 12-1 tomorrow. I may be in the minority but I think the defending gold medal champs can make a game of it and keep it much closer than 12-1.

 

[J bo Jeans]

According to one analysis, Canada spends 14 times as much money on youth hockey than the rest of the hockey world combined. The mystery is why they don't win more often than they do? For example, with all their best players on board, they ended up losing the 2021 WJC to the USA, which is mainly indifferent about hockey in comparison to other sports.

1 game finals is the answer. Does Canada lose to that US WJ team in a best of 7?

 

[Czechboy]

Very unusual year as Canada normally doesn't send their best to this tourney. They usually only send their good players to the Gretzky-Hlinka which,
of course, they usually dominate.

It's half the story... US sends their best team to the U18 while Canada does not. Canada sends their best team to the Hlinka while US does not.

I think they US aren't medalling at this tourney for the first time in 15 years. Canada has a similar record at Hlinka. U18 has 2 tourneys and neither is actually a best on best.

For the record, the U20 is pretty wide open and no really dominant nation anymore....

 

[David OSullivan]

1 game finals is the answer. Does Canada lose to that US WJ team in a best of 7?

It could yes.

Games are played on the ice. Not on paper. That's the thing you are not seeing.

There's 2 truths here.

1. Canada have an unbelievable talent pool of players. The best.

Nobody denies it.

Where I draw the line is when some Canadian fans think they are some unbeatable dominant force as a team. You get beaten all the time. What you have become absolute experts at is making excuses for the losses like those tournaments don't count in some way. Like other teams don't face same issues. It really is crazy stuff.

It's not all Canadian fans. Snipes for example is a very level headed Canadian fan and a cool guy. But my god. There are a lot that submit to this dominant force vibe when in fact plenty of the other big 5 are winning tournaments. You are literally the current champion at no international level right now.

It may sound like I'm bashing your team here. I'm not. Canada's best is usually the best team. They are incredibly talented but you can be beaten. All I'm saying. Nothing is a forgone conclusion. Not even this tournament. Not even with your Québec boys although I'm sure you ll have that excuse ready to go if things don't go your way.

Ah. It feels good to get that off my chest. Now I need to go speak to a therapist as to why I pick arguments with strangers on the Internet.

 

[Mathieukferland]

I actually looked up the results of that last best on best Olympics (2014) and World Cup which Canada won. Most the scores were in the 3-1 range. Eg. close games. Then you look at that best on best Olympic experiment and realize they didn't medal 2 out of 5 times at all. Of course we're not allowed to mention the Canada Cup they lost or the 2005 World Championships which was best on best due to a lockout.

Definitely number 1 in the world but this notion that they consistently destroy everyone when they send their best is laughable at best. I also feel these comments are best saved for after winning the Gold and not before a semifinal. Some of the comments on here after the first game against Sweden were hillarious. I hope people aren't expecting another 12-1 tomorrow. I may be in the minority but I think the defending gold medal champs can make a game of it and keep it much closer than 12-1.

There have been 12 best on best tournaments between Olympics, Canada Cup, and World Cup. Canada has won 9 of them. I rest my case. That being said Lysell needs to repeat his brilliance for tre kronor to have any chance tomorrow.

 

[Svedu]

It's half the story... US sends their best team to the U18 while Canada does not. Canada sends their best team to the Hlinka while US does not.

I think they US aren't medalling at this tourney for the first time in 15 years. Canada has a similar record at Hlinka. U18 has 2 tourneys and neither is actually a best on best.

For the record, the U20 is pretty wide open and no really dominant nation anymore....

View attachment 429632

Well, that list there says that Canada, Finland and USA has been a bit more dominant than Russia and Sweden this last decade? Even if it's quite close between these five at u20´s, i would say that these countries have produced bigger talents and that those gold medals actually tells us something.
They tell us that in a best of the best tournament in a couple of years Finland would join as a favorite behind Canada and US. I do think Finland will surpass Russia and Sweden for a couple of years, even if it's really close.
I mean three gold medals each against Sweden and Russias one? Nowadays Finland have better goalies and forwards than Sweden. The weaker D´s will be strong in a couple of years as well with: Heiskanen, Heinola, Niemelä, Vaakanainen, Välimäki, Juolevi, Laaksonen, Jokiharju, Salo, Viro, Malinen etc

When Russia won they had Kuznetsov and Tarasenko. Kuznetsov is one of the biggest talents I´ve ever seen at the WJC´s.

Finland had a huge goalie in Saros and still quite the goalie. Great captain and MVP in Teräväinen, quite the player today as well. Ristolainen, Lindell and Honka and a good team defensively.
Then they had Aho, Puljujärvi, Hintz, Rantanen, Laine, Juolevi, Niku, Kapanen, Kähkönen etc. Those players right there are nothing but elite talent, at least most of them.
2019: Luukkonen, Lassi Lehtinen, Vaakanainen, Jokiharju, Heinola, Heponiemi, Kakko, Lundell, Tolvanen, Ylönen, Laaksonen, Kupari, (we missed Kotkaniemi and Vesalainen). My point is? Not did only Finland play good as a team with a good coaching staff. The actual roster was pretty damn good both in 2016 and 2019.
Next year if everyone is healthy you will see studs like Lambert, Malinen, Kemell, Räty etc.

US have produced elite players for quite long now. Matthews, Hughes, Seth Jones etc. They've won because of superior talent.

Canada? Don´t even need to name their talents because it's obvious.

 

[Svedu]

So, the semifinals.

I believe Sweden and Russia will win tomorrow.

 

[Czechboy]

There have been 12 best on best tournaments between Olympics, Canada Cup, and World Cup. Canada has won 9 of them. I rest my case. That being said Lysell needs to repeat his brilliance for tre kronor to have any chance tomorrow.

Did you include 2005 World Championships?

Let's call it 9 out of 13.

I agree Canada is number 1 in hockey and said that so I'm not sure what case you are resting? The comment that 'this is what it looks like when Canada sends their best players' isn't true. MOST of Canada's 9 best on best golds were in close games and finishes. Some fans on here (maybe not you) seem to think Canada will win the next 2 games 10-0 and win Gold easily.

Maybe they will but that would be the exception to the rule.

Feel free to look up the final few games of those 9 best on best wins, if you see blowout after blowout let me know.

This isn't 1990's basketball and the rest of the world isn't Angola playing the dream team.

 

[Czechboy]

Well, that list there says that Canada, Finland and USA has been a bit more dominant than Russia and Sweden this last decade? Even if it's quite close between these five at u20´s, i would say that these countries have produced bigger talents and that those gold medals actually tells us something.
They tell us that in a best of the best tournament in a couple of years Finland would join as a favorite behind Canada and US. I do think Finland will surpass Russia and Sweden for a couple of years, even if it's really close.
I mean three gold medals each against Sweden and Russias one? Nowadays Finland have better goalies and forwards than Sweden. The weaker D´s will be strong in a couple of years as well with: Heiskanen, Heinola, Niemelä, Vaakanainen, Välimäki, Juolevi, Laaksonen, Jokiharju, Salo, Viro, Malinen etc

When Russia won they had Kuznetsov and Tarasenko. Kuznetsov is one of the biggest talents I´ve ever seen at the WJC´s.

Finland had a huge goalie in Saros and still quite the goalie. Great captain and MVP in Teräväinen, quite the player today as well. Ristolainen, Lindell and Honka and a good team defensively.
Then they had Aho, Puljujärvi, Hintz, Rantanen, Laine, Juolevi, Niku, Kapanen, Kähkönen etc. Those players right there are nothing but elite talent, at least most of them.
2019: Luukkonen, Lassi Lehtinen, Vaakanainen, Jokiharju, Heinola, Heponiemi, Kakko, Lundell, Tolvanen, Ylönen, Laaksonen, Kupari, (we missed Kotkaniemi and Vesalainen). My point is? Not did only Finland play good as a team with a good coaching staff. The actual roster was pretty damn good both in 2016 and 2019.
Next year if everyone is healthy you will see studs like Lambert, Malinen, Kemell, Räty etc.

US have produced elite players for quite long now. Matthews, Hughes, Seth Jones etc. They've won because of superior talent.

Canada? Don´t even need to name their talents because it's obvious.

My view hasn't changed in years. There are 5 gold medal nations, any single one of them could win gold at any tournament and I woulnd't call it an upset.

Eg. at the next Olympics which are best on best, if Finland wins the gold I wouldn't be the least bit surprised. The big 5 are miles ahead of the rest currently. However, the difference amongst the big 5 isn't as big as people think IMO. It's extremely close with Canada as the favourite by a slight margin.

 

[Yakushev72]

It's half the story... US sends their best team to the U18 while Canada does not. Canada sends their best team to the Hlinka while US does not.

I think they US aren't medalling at this tourney for the first time in 15 years. Canada has a similar record at Hlinka. U18 has 2 tourneys and neither is actually a best on best.

For the record, the U20 is pretty wide open and no really dominant nation anymore....

View attachment 429632

My point is, given Canada's massive expenditures on youth hockey, winning 3 of 10 U20 Championships is no demonstration of dominance. Some years (2013 and 2021, in this case), Canada has all of its best players on the roster, but even in those cases where they have 2 or 3 U20 eligibles in the NHL, you would think the massive imbalance in players, rinks, and other resources between them and their competitors would result in consistent dominance, but the record shows it does not!

 

[57special]

Sure would be nice to read some posts about the 2021 U18's. I thought the SWE/USA game was pretty poor in quality.