Rumor: 2021-22 Trade Rumors and FA Part V: To Giroux or not to Giroux

[hockeyfish]

I actually double-majored in virology and terrorist organization studies. I also just so happen to exclusively wear suspenders and bowties

Are you by any chance an expert on Russian/Ukrainian relations, because the internet could use your help right about now.

 

[EdAVSfan]

Personally, I think guys like JJ and EJ will struggle more in regular season.

once playoffs roll around and refs lose their whistles. These guys can be draped all over players with no penalty.

 

[S E P H]

Anybody see the asking price for Brandon Hagel rumored on the main boards? Supposedly came from Frank Seravalli. What’s the price for a Jost or a JTC now lol?
For some reason I can’t copy the link.

I suspect the price to drop, when you have so many teams that are looking to be sellers, Hagel type of players should flood the market decreasing the value.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I think adding Giroux to line 2 would put the Avs over the edge. Line him at at 2RW and move Burakovsky to the third line.

Landeskog - MacKinnon - Rantanen
Nichushkin - Kadri - Giroux
Burakovsky - Newhook - LOC
Jost - Helm - NAK


Also, the Johnson and Johnson pairing is an absolute burning pile of shit. Those guys are going to get DOMINATED in the playoffs. One of the two might be able to get by with a better partner, but EJ and JJ are a problem right now.

I wouldn’t at all be surprised if EJ found the fountain of youth in the playoffs. The guy knows this is his moment and possibly last chance to get it done with this team. He’s been up and down this year, but he’s definitely had some warrior type blocks late in games that can be useful in the playoffs.

JJ should be getting 3rd pairing minutes, but the Avs seem to like him more than the fan base does. Even when Byram was healthy he was playing a decent amount.

Even though he’s a loveable goon, MacDermid worries me a lot more than those guys.

 

[Richard88]

I was thinking Giroux won't be traded til his 1000th game with Philly but if Calgary has already cast the first die, it might happen sooner then later.

Why does Calgary moving early for Toffoli affect the Avs? Calgary probably wanted to get it done early to help their push for 1st in their division, but Colorado have no such urgency given the healthy lead on the Wild.

 

[Richard88]

I suspect the price to drop, when you have so many teams that are looking to be sellers, Hagel type of players should flood the market decreasing the value.

Who are you thinking of in bold there? I presume you're referring to Lehkonen first and foremost, but other than him I'm not sure there are that many options like Hagel who also have the term and cheap contract he does.

 

[S E P H]

Who are you thinking of in bold there? I presume you're referring to Lehkonen first and foremost, but other than him I'm not sure there are that many options like Hagel who also have the term and cheap contract he does.

I was just generalising with nobody specific in mind, just rhapsodising my viewpoint that Hagel probably won't bring back a 1st when there will be other sellers and GMs with much different values for like-players.

E: Looking at the standings now, I have these teams as sellers...
- Canadiens
- Flyers
- Sabres
- Senators
- Devils
- Blue Jackets
- Coyotes
- Kraken
- Blackhawks
- Sharks
- Canucks

With a good probability of becoming sellers...
- Red Wings
- Islanders (have many games in hand though)
- Jets
- Stars
- One of Oilers or Ducks

Teams who will buyers...
- Hurricanes
- Panthers
- Lightning
- Maple Leafs
- Capitals
- Avalanche
- Golden Knights (might've already made their move with Eichel though)

7 teams versus 11 sellers (with the potential of five more)

 

[Richard88]

To me, it's the reported cost of acquisition. We don't have a lot of trade capital to spend for this TDL, the off-season, and the next TDL, and giving up a 1st rounder and a top prospect for Hagel seems steep.

We also don't have a lot of cap-space going forward (at least not if we intend to re-sign Nichuskin, Kuemper, Francouz, and maybe Burakovsky) and a cheap contract like Hagel's would offer some flexibility to enable us to acquire better 'free' talent in UFA (or cheaper via trade due to cap reasons like Chicago did with Fleury).

For example, Hagel filling the 3LW spot at $1.5m instead of someone at ~$3.5m could be the difference between having to settle for a top 6 forward in the $4.5-5m range, or someone in the $6.5-7m range.

 

[Richard88]

Why are people suddenly so high on Hagel? Never read his name on this board before and now he's like the ultimate guy to get?

Most people (well, me anyways) assumed that a player like that wouldn't be available, but now that Seravalli has mentioned that he could be available it kinda changes things.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Who are you thinking of in bold there? I presume you're referring to Lehkonen first and foremost, but other than him I'm not sure there are that many options like Hagel who also have the term and cheap contract he does.

Mason Appleton would likely qualify as a player of that ilk.

 

[Richard88]

I was just generalising with nobody specific in mind, just rhapsodising my viewpoint that Hagel probably won't bring back a 1st when there will be other sellers and GMs with much different values for like-players.

E: Looking at the standings now, I have these teams as sellers...
- Canadiens
- Flyers
- Sabres
- Senators
- Devils
- Blue Jackets
- Coyotes
- Kraken
- Blackhawks
- Sharks
- Canucks

With a good probability of becoming sellers...
- Red Wings
- Islanders (have many games in hand though)
- Jets
- Stars
- One of Oilers or Ducks

Teams who will buyers...
- Hurricanes
- Panthers
- Lightning
- Maple Leafs
- Capitals
- Avalanche
- Golden Knights (might've already made their move with Eichel though)

7 teams versus 11 sellers (with the potential of five more)

Yeah I don't doubt that there won't be a lot more sellers than buyers. But that doesn't mean that there will be a buffet of middle 6 forwards with $1.5m x 3 year contracts available. Sure, guys like Nick Paul, Lehkonen, Namestnikov, Copp, etc etc will be available, but none of them have the term or low cap-hit that Hagel does. He's unique in this market, and if Chicago don't get an overpayment they could probably still get a 1st++ at next years deadline when he'd still be very valuable with 2 playoff runs left at that caphit.

 

[Richard88]

Mason Appleton would likely qualify as a player of that ilk.

Not the worst suggestion, but he doesn't have the multiple-year cost-certainty that Hagel does, and he's also 3 years older. Not to mention that his career high is lower than Hagel's point total halfway into this season.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Not the worst suggestion, but he doesn't have the multiple-year cost-certainty that Hagel does, and he's also 3 years older. Not to mention that his career high is lower than Hagel's point total halfway into this season.

Depending on what the cost would be, how picky would you be though?

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

We also don't have a lot of cap-space going forward (at least not if we intend to re-sign Nichuskin, Kuemper, Francouz, and maybe Burakovsky) and a cheap contract like Hagel's would offer some flexibility to enable us to acquire better 'free' talent in UFA (or cheaper via trade due to cap reasons like Chicago did with Fleury).

For example, Hagel filling the 3LW spot at $1.5m instead of someone at ~$3.5m could be the difference between having to settle for a top 6 forward in the $4.5-5m range, or someone in the $6.5-7m range.

He’s also a RFA after his contract runs out. So you get him for three years and then still have team control after that too.

Giroux would be a nuclear weapon for one season, but Hagel would be a savvy add. I’m not sure the Hawks would want to deal him in-division though.

 

[John Mandalorian]

He’s also a RFA after his contract runs out. So you get him for three years and then still have team control after that too.

Giroux would be a nuclear weapon for one season, but a guy like Hagen would be a savvy add. I’m not sure the Hawks would want to deal him in-division though.

It wasn't a problem with Saad/Zadorov and that came with Chicago having a greater expectation of contending.

 

[hockeyfish]

I was just generalising with nobody specific in mind, just rhapsodising my viewpoint that Hagel probably won't bring back a 1st when there will be other sellers and GMs with much different values for like-players.

E: Looking at the standings now, I have these teams as sellers...
- Canadiens
- Flyers
- Sabres
- Senators
- Devils
- Blue Jackets
- Coyotes
- Kraken
- Blackhawks
- Sharks
- Canucks

With a good probability of becoming sellers...
- Red Wings
- Islanders (have many games in hand though)
- Jets
- Stars
- One of Oilers or Ducks

Teams who will buyers...
- Hurricanes
- Panthers
- Lightning
- Maple Leafs
- Capitals
- Avalanche
- Golden Knights (might've already made their move with Eichel though)

7 teams versus 11 sellers (with the potential of five more)

Chicago has no incentive to trade him unless their price is met.

 

[Hasbro]

I was

Teams who will buyers...
- Hurricanes
- Panthers
- Lightning
- Maple Leafs
- Capitals
- Avalanche
- Golden Knights (might've already made their move with Eichel though)

Bolded have traded away their ‘22 1st.

I’d be worried about the Blues, they have Bozak + 2nd throw around.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Who would you give up more for in a trade? Hagel, or Giroux?

I know Giroux is clearly better, but the age and contractual status of Hagel are huge benefits.

 

[hughdreamz]

Who would you give up more for in a trade? Hagel, or Giroux?

I know Giroux is clearly better, but the age and contractual status of Hagel are huge benefits.

Win now. Giroux imo.

 

[Richard88]

Bolded have traded away their ‘22 1st.

I’d be worried about the Blues, they have Bozak + 2nd throw around.

With regards to Hagel, Tampa would be the team to be worried about, because they have a GM who has a track record of getting moves like this done.

Hagel's contract also lines up perfectly with Toronto's window given that Matthews/Nylander/Muzzin/Brodie all hit UFA in 2024, so I'd hazard a guess that they'll be in on him as well given their limited capspace.

 

[Richard88]

Depending on what the cost would be, how picky would you be though?

I'd be very picky with getting a player who I think can put the Avs over the top for a cup. Is Appleton that player?... meh

 

[John Mandalorian]

Who would you give up more for in a trade? Hagel, or Giroux?

I know Giroux is clearly better, but the age and contractual status of Hagel are huge benefits.

Giroux. It's not that I don't appreciate the value of Hagel (though I think the ask is a little excessive). But think about what adding Giroux does for the middle six.

 

[hockeyfish]

Who would you give up more for in a trade? Hagel, or Giroux?

I know Giroux is clearly better, but the age and contractual status of Hagel are huge benefits.

 

[Chiarelli]

If Philly wants our spare parts you can have it all my empire of dirt

jost compher bowers sure

 

[Metallo]

Hagel might be nice in vacuum but is it what we need? Another small W?