Speculation: 2021-22 LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread Part VI

[Trash Panda]

At some point, you have to pick one of these roads to go down. It's increase expectations, or hold onto assets. Both can't truly be done.

Had the Richards trade been proposed prior to it happening, how many would've said yes to that? Today, everyone does the trade 1000 times because it all worked out. Right after it happened, it was probably, well, ok, lets go. 2 months beforehand though? After the Kings just took the Sharks to 6 games without Kopitar, and Simmonds did pretty well, and Schenn was still considered to be the next big thing?

Chychrun is not Mike Richards by any metric.

Not even close.

The acquisition of Mike Richards signaled a number of things, that all added up to the expectation of results coupled with the arrival of a proven winner & absolute leader in a position of need.

Paying top dollar for a niche defenseman couldn’t be further from what the Richards trade was.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

So given what Kempe has done so far this season, what’s the current thinking about his ceiling? Is he a legit 30+ goal player?

If hockeydb.com is accurate, his current 17 goals is higher than any of his full season totals on any team he’s played with since his first season with MoDo Jr. at age 16. If you only looked at those numbers you wouldn’t project him to be a big scorer.

But this is the first time in his career where he’s not among the youngest guys on the team, so maybe this is him finally flourishing now that he’s had several seasons to learn to compete at the NHL level.

Yes--if you look at the years he played against his peers, he's more like a 40-50 goal guy, haha. He's always smoked people his age, remember what a PP weapon he was for Sweden in juniors? Look at his teenage stats for any of the non-men levels and he's always like half a goal per game or higher.

I'm not sure anyone projected him to be a 30g guy but certainly 20+ was always part of the higher projections because of that.

Paying top dollar for a niche defenseman couldn’t be further from what the Richards trade was.

I see descriptions like this and I cannot believe some of us are talking about the same player. I'm just out of words at this point.

And again I'm not even saying 'do it'. I'm just seeing a lot of people talking him down unnecessarily.

 

[Fishhead]

Yeah, Chychrun isn't a plug or even a 2nd liner. He's a first-rate defense-first player that any team could use. I think his offensive season was an outlier, but he's still going to see the 20's points-wise at a minimum, in the 30's on a good team. Tossing guys like Turcotte, Clarke, etc into a deal for a durable Chychrun I'd do without a second thought. But even though he's young, he is damaged goods and for me that decreases what I would pay up. The shoulder and upper body stuff aren't a big deal, he's not getting concussed all the time. Knees are scary though, especially for a position that requires mobility. It took him 2 years to really get back from that ACL injury, some of his heel is now in his knee. Injuries are a legitimate concern with him and for whatever reason, he didn't look good before going down with yet another injury. I don't see Blake getting in a bidding war anyways, so it's kind of a moot point.

I think we could get better value in a trade if we go that route. Lindholm would be my ideal target in the offseason if Anaheim doesn't extend him, which they shouldn't. He'd cost nothing but cap, and would be an excellent fit with his size, reach, and puck-moving ability. With Solomon in charge right now I don't think it's out of the question that he would consider a trade at the deadline, either, division or not.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

Would like to see Byfield called up to replace Kupari...who's with me?

 

[KingsFan7824]

Chychrun is not Mike Richards by any metric.

Not even close.

The acquisition of Mike Richards signaled a number of things, that all added up to the expectation of results coupled with the arrival of a proven winner & absolute leader in a position of need.

Paying top dollar for a niche defenseman couldn’t be further from what the Richards trade was.

Technically not true at the pro level. The Flyers didn't make the Final until Pronger got there. Then of course they didn't even win.

My point was, could holes be poked into a theoretical acquisition of Mike Richards months before it happened? Had Schenn and Simmonds for Richards been proposed in Feb 2011, are we jumping at that trade? Even knowing that it would still take at least 2 more huge moves before the Kings weren't more than the same average team as they were before getting Richards?

 

[kings11]

I don’t see us making a play for Chychrun, the cost is too great for a team isn’t a contender to make such a move…

 

[Schmooley]

I don’t see us making a play for Chychrun, the cost is too great for a team isn’t a contender to make such a move…

Chychrun isnt a rental though and could be a king for 10 years if it worked out. The cost will be high though so it may not be worth it in that sense.

 

[kings11]

Chychrun isnt a rental though and could be a king for 10 years if it worked out. The cost will be high though so it may not be worth it in that sense.

He is not but you need to realize that team will start to succeed when the kids overtake Kopi and Drew and by that team his contract will be up as will 3-5 of our top players… We need to take that into consideration, this isn’t the Richards deal as some have pointed to.. We don’t have a Kopitar entering his prime or a Doughty, you make this type of trade when that’s happened

 

[Mats26]

Chychrun is a trade you make if the kids were established. We are 2+ years away for that. Giving up kids in trades now might backfire. I would still kick the tires because he fits in age\salary wise but I will be weary of giving up our top kids right now. A package will have to include an RD, roster player, B level prospect and pick for me. The phone hangs up on QB, Clarke, Arty, Turk, Vilardi. I rather go the UFA route if they are asking for top end pieces.

 

[Matt13]

I don’t see us making a play for Chychrun, the cost is too great for a team isn’t a contender to make such a move…

I think this team is showing it is a contender.

It’s beating top teams, has a great goalie tandem, is scoring 5v5 and is in a playoff position with its biggest weakness the D.

Adding a player like this improves the PP and PK which are the the 2 biggest weaknesses.

I say “go for it”.

 

[LAKings88]

Chychrun is a trade you make if the kids were established. We are 2+ years away for that. Giving up kids in trades now might backfire. I would still kick the tires because he fits in age\salary wise but I will be weary of giving up our top kids right now. A package will have to include an RD, roster player, B level prospect and pick for me. The phone hangs up on QB, Clarke, Arty, Turk, Vilardi. I rather go the UFA route if they are asking for top end pieces.

UFAs of that caliber rarely get to free agency.

The organization has made it know it wants a legit LD.

The only ones that may be available the next few years are:
Sergachev(contract)
Lindholm(ufa)
Provorov(contract)
-no guarantee on any being available

Help me out if there are others.
Dahlin possibly???

Biggest question is can a player slot over to the left side?

Walker/Spence/Faber/Clarke/Grans

 

[Mats26]

UFAs of that caliber rarely get to free agency.

The organization has made it know it wants a legit LD.

The only ones that may be available the next few years are:
Sergachev(contract)
Lindholm(ufa)
Provorov(contract)
-no guarantee on any being available

Help me out if there are others.
Dahlin possibly???

Biggest question is can a player slot over to the left side?

Walker/Spence/Faber/Clarke/Grans

Walker played LD with Doughty last year at times.

Was thinking UFA this off season Chiarot, Lindhom or McNabb if available can all plug huge holes. Chychrun seems like another flavor of the month candidate...getting ridiculously overrated. I am all in if it doesn't cost us a ton though.

Under the radar moves, Shea Theodore, Tomas Harley, Soucy, Dunn from the Kraken, if Blake is willing to enquire and spend the assets.

 

[Ghetty Green]

I would gladly take McNabb back as a UFA. He can play with Drew and is extremely physical

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I'm with @Raccoon Jesus reading all this and going WTF....and yea, no worries, I get you guys do the same to me.....

Chycrun is 100% the type of player you go after, young, good, signed long term, does it depend on cost, 100%, do you trade Byfield and Clarke him, of course not, but if the ask is 1st round pick in 2022, Vilardi, Kupari, and Mikey Andersson, you 100% do that, don't think twice,

Hell if the asking price is 1st round pick, Vilardi, FABER and GRANS, you 100% do that, Chycrun is what Faber and Grans HOPES TO BE, and in the NHL, you 100% take the proven player over a what if, Faber could be the next Zboril for anyone knows....

Does Chycrun mean automatic cup, of course not, neither does acquiring McDavid.....but he's a step in the right direction.

 

[kingsfan]

Calling Chychrun a niche defenseman is moronic. The kid is a top pairing guy who was 10th in Norris voting. Injuries or not, not not a niche defenseman.

Given his age, I'd do the deal now, even if we aren't contenders just yet. In two years he'll still be here and we can't just wait for guys like this to come along in a trade at that point. They aren't made available very often.

And I'm not saying we're contenders but after that 1-5-1 start we are 19-8-4. That's a hell of a good winning percentage. Yes, we have holes, but that's a pretty damn good 31 game (and counting) stretch.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Calling Chychrun a niche defenseman is moronic. The kid is a top pairing guy who was 10th in Norris voting. Injuries or not, not not a niche defenseman.

Given his age, I'd do the deal now, even if we aren't contenders just yet. In two years he'll still be here and we can't just wait for guys like this to come along in a trade at that point. They aren't made available very often.

And I'm not saying we're contenders but after that 1-5-1 start we are 19-8-4. That's a hell of a good winning percentage. Yes, we have holes, but that's a pretty damn good 31 game (and counting) stretch.

I can name on one hand, the guys who are like Chyrcun, that have been traded..... Seth Jones - 1st trade, Laine-Dubois, and..............and...........

Guys like Chycrun simply DO NOT become available, unless something drastic happens (ie phoenix wanting to shit the bed) so you 100% go after him, and again, it's all dependent on cost.

 

[kingsfan]

I can name on one hand, the guys who are like Chyrcun, that have been traded..... Seth Jones - 1st trade, Laine-Dubois, and..............and...........

Guys like Chycrun simply DO NOT become available, unless something drastic happens (ie phoenix wanting to shit the bed) so you 100% go after him, and again, it's all dependent on cost.

Agreed. Byfield and Clarke are off the table. After that, you start talking. The undervaluing of Chychrun in here is crazy.

 

[bsu]

I hope you guys keep your prospects and don't trade for chychrun. I want the ducks to unload assets for him he's so f***ing good. People on these forums have a weird infatuation with prospects like they are all going to work out. If any of them turned out anything close to chychrun you would be hitting the lottery. 23 years old, signed for less than half what Nurse makes and way better for the next 3.5 years. Both our teams should be offering the farm. I'm surprised you guys are only willing to give up Turcotre and Bjornfot for him that's never going to happen. I'd personally give up a lot for him players like him don't become available with his age, cap control, ability.... Ever. You have to draft and hope you ever get a player that caliber. If Drysdale turned out to be like him I'd be so happy. I'd give up Clarke in a heartbeat for him.

 

[LAKings88]

I hope you guys keep your prospects and don't trade for chychrun. I want the ducks to unload assets for him he's so f***ing good.

Are you reverse psychologing us?

 

[bsu]

Are you reverse psychologing us?

I hope the kings don't get him.... Him and doughty would be insane.

I really really want the ducks to trade some assets for him. He's a player you open the shop for.

 

[Trash Panda]

Calling Chychrun a niche defenseman is moronic. The kid is a top pairing guy who was 10th in Norris voting. Injuries or not, not not a niche defenseman.

Given his age, I'd do the deal now, even if we aren't contenders just yet. In two years he'll still be here and we can't just wait for guys like this to come along in a trade at that point. They aren't made available very often.

And I'm not saying we're contenders but after that 1-5-1 start we are 19-8-4. That's a hell of a good winning percentage. Yes, we have holes, but that's a pretty damn good 31 game (and counting) stretch.

That same year, Mackenzie Weegar was 8th in Norris voting, and I don’t see anyone advocating trading for him on those grounds.

Chychrun at fair value is a fine defensemen, but he is not worth the ransom being suggested. One good season amidst a career of oft-injured decency isn’t basis for an overpayment on a decent player.

 

[bsu]

That same year, Mackenzie Weegar was 8th in Norris voting, and I don’t see anyone advocating trading for him on those ground.

Chychrun at fair value is a fine defensemen, but he is not worth the ransom being suggested. One good season amidst a career of oft-injured decency isn’t basis for an overpayment on a decent player.

He literally was going to make team Canada, which is the most stacked D in the tournament. If he was on an actual NHL roster he would be regarded as one of then best D men in the league imo. He's literally playing on a dumpster fire. I think you and others are really underrated how good he is (some people on the Ducks forum are doing the same)

 

[LAKings88]

That same year, Mackenzie Weegar was 8th in Norris voting, and I don’t see anyone advocating trading for him on those ground.

Chychrun at fair value is a fine defensemen, but he is not worth the ransom being suggested. One good season amidst a career of oft-injured decency isn’t basis for an overpayment on a decent player.

I actually heard a lot of talk for Weegar on Canada. If he was available people might be talking, cept he is a righty.

 

[KINGS17]

Would like to see Byfield called up to replace Kupari...who's with me?

Byfield showed the patience of a goal scorer there, understanding he had plenty of time and space. In that situation, if the goalie moves first it's over, and Byfield got him moving immediately with a nice stick handle.

That is exactly what we should expect from the #2 pick overall.

 

[Fishhead]

Chychrun is good, but he's not Seth Jones level. I actually think he is overvalued here. You would think that he would see the toughest assignments on the ice - he does not. You would also think he would dominate weaker competition - he doesn't do that either.

Here is his CF% against quality of competition. He's always gotten easy starts, yet can't even get over 50% with his possession numbers.



Here is his GF% vs. QOC. Middling at best. Notice that his one good season offensively he faced the second weakest competition in his career.



Here is his DFF% (dangerous fenwick) vs QOC. Average, nothing special. Barely generating more danger than allowing it against middling to low competition doesn't say much.



If you look at graphs like this for Seth Jones, outside of his first two years in Nashville where he was a young guy on a stacked defense, his points are at the top of the graph (elite competition) and shifted to the right just about all seasons.

Between the injuries and underlying metrics there are a lot of red flags with Chychrun and a ton of risk. There is a very good chance whoever gives up a big package for him is going to be disappointed in what he brings. Fun fact: Mikey Anderson's danger%, CF%, and GF% are better this year than ANY of Chychrun's seasons, and he does it against absolute top competition. He's been amazing with Doughty, they have great synergy. I absolutely wouldn't include him in a deal.