Prospect Info: 2020 Draft #111 - Mitchell Miller (RHD) [Mod Warning post #312]

[Alberta Yote]

Let's hope they keep it that way

 

[The Feckless Puck]

He’s a 4th round pick from Ohio. He doesn’t have a team of PR people. Lol. He doesn’t even have a pro contract.

He's got an agent. That's enough.

 

[hbk]

He's got an agent. That's enough.

College players cant have agents. NCAA rules.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

College players cant have agents. NCAA rules.

Then he's got some kind of "not-an-agent" advisor. A lawyer, perhaps.

The kid has this whopper of a Damoclean Sword hanging over his career and was slated to go in the first couple of rounds without it. There's no way he's going this alone or solely with family.

 

[rt]

The family never received an apology from him. The other party involved notably did show remorse to the judge and apologized to the family, which was accepted.

Mitchell didn't. He apologized to 31 NHL teams before he apologized to the victim. The Coyotes didn't contact the victim or his family. It seems like they didn't really look into it much at all and took the kid at his word.

He never apologized outside of a court mandated letter. Which the families apparently never received.

The victim was beaten bloody and had his head smashed into a wall repeatedly by the convicted. Not to mention being forced to eat something that was pissed on.

It was also caught on surveillance cameras.

The other kid was moved to tears when apologizing in court. Mitchell showed no remorse. And has continued to show no remorse...accept when it would benefit him. Like, when talking to 31 NHL teams who want to make him a millionaire. For his entire life starting at 2nd grade, this kid bullied a mentally disabled one, was racist, and caused physical harm and trauma to another one. No, I don't think he should lose his life for it. Even if he doesn't show remorse. But that's a pretty far cry from being allowed into the NHL and making millions of dollars.

Arizona's response to all of this is incredibly disappointing. They acknowledge that they knew about all of this, but didn't listen to anything the victim's family said? Didn't even contact them? They interviewed him and didn't ask any hard questions or really mention the incident at all. And they took him with their 4th round pick. Their first possible one. Many teams had him on the DND list, but we were evidently eager to draft him. What's the difference between those other teams and us? Are we better judges of character than multiple other teams? Are we better judges of character than the Judge who noted he had no remorse?

I really don't know, but I know that I'm pretty f***ing done with this franchise.

Could have apologized to the victim.
Could have shown remorse to the Judge.
Could have interviewed better.
Could have not bullied someone for nearly 10 years.

Could have, should have, would have. Didn't.

I’m not sticking up for Miller. I suspect that he probably bullied this kid simply because he wanted to be an ass. I expect his current statements of remorse are just as likely to be purely self-serving as they are genuine. I’m not defending him. But I’m seeing what I perceive to be a lot of confusion about timelines and facts in this.

The Harris article is really poorly written. Harris is an ultra biased, sensationalist hatchet man of the worst kind. I’ve never had less respect for any journalist. And I’m going back years on that opinion. He has no integrity and no talent. I’d fight him if I could.

When I read the Ohio article and the Harris article, and I compare them, I see a different timeline than what is being apparently being ratified as the the official narrative on this website.

From what I can see (and I might write up a pretty deep-dive, but I’m sure no one would read it) it happened like this.

Miller befriended Meyer-Crothers in order to force him to do things he didn’t want to do (IMC’s own words) and to bully, abuse, and assault him over the course of several years. This culminated with the CCTV beating and urine candy incident.

IMC’s mother stated that McKie and IMC had an actual friendship. It seems as though it degraded over time into something toxic involving Miller. IMC’s mother made a point of saying that unlike McKie, Miller never had a friendship with IMC (somewhat counter to what IMC said, but neither here nor there)

The day after the juvenile court ruling, the Ohio Blade article comes out. In that article both the judge and the mother are quoted as singling out Miller as having less remorse than McKie. Both boys were ordered to write apology letters.

It is clear that McKie read an apology at the hearing and broke down. This is what IMC’s mother references in the Harris article. He cried and apologized “in-person”- meaning at the hearing. She confirmed the only apology she received from Miller was the court ordered letter.

It’s not clear why McKie was the only boy to apologize at the hearing. We don’t know if Miller was offered that chance and his representation declined or if McKie’s previous relationship with IMC allowed for him to speak more freely to someone whom he previously had a friendship with. We don’t know what happened.

We do know that Miller complies with the court order. He wrote his apology letters. He did his community service for the disabled (as a poster here mentioned he should have).

IMC’s mother gave the quote about feeling that Miller’s chosen rollerblading route being disrespectful the day of the ruling. Prior to his apology letter and prior to his counseling and sensitivity training and community service hours with the disabled.

All of the quotes about his lack of remorse or contrition are previous to any subsequent “work” that went into his “rehabilitation”.

Essentially, the boy that “showed no remorse” was the same boy that demonstrated the monstrous behaviors to begin with.

Tri-City, NoDak, Arizona, and the boy and his family all cite tremendous progress AFTER this time. The statements by the judge and by the victim’s family are further proof that Miller’s overall conduct before the hearing was reprehensible. But these statements are in no way proof of ANYTHING concerning his conduct after April of 2016.

 

[Jakey53]

It's not "charmed lives." It's simply what your personality is and how you approach a mistake - or, in this case, a lengthy pattern of bad behavior stretching over years.

Miller had been torturing this kid for the better part of a decade until he was caught. His first impulse wasn't to apologize, but to sneer at the family and intimidate them by standing outside their house. Absolutely the only thing he has shown since was regret that he got caught.

The other kid involved apparently had a real epiphany, and beyond showing contrition in court, he went and behaved like a man - apologized in person to the boy and his family.

This isn't rocket science or advanced math. This is simply a question whether he buries what happened and hopes people forget it, or if he makes a real change. All the evidence so far is pointing to the former, so that's why a lot of us aren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Miller could solve this whole thing just by doing something genuine, like contacting the family, rather than issuing a blizzard of prepared statements.

I have know, and you probably have also, a few friends or acquaintances while growing up where they always seemed to get themselves into trouble one way or another, and your parents told you to stay away from them and then find out years later they turned their life around. The Coyotes know much more about the character of this young man than you holier than thou blowhards on this forum.

 

[Dead Coyote]

I’m not sticking up for Miller. I suspect that he probably bullied this kid simply because he wanted to be an ass. I expect his current statements of remorse are just as likely to be purely self-serving as they are genuine. I’m not defending him. But I’m seeing what I perceive to be a lot of confusion about timelines and facts in this.

The Harris article is really poorly written. Harris is an ultra biased, sensationalist hatchet man of the worst kind. I’ve never had less respect for any journalist. And I’m going back years on that opinion. He has no integrity and no talent. I’d fight him if I could.

When I read the Ohio article and the Harris article, and I compare them, I see a different timeline than what is being apparently being ratified as the the official narrative on this website.

From what I can see (and I might write up a pretty deep-dive, but I’m sure no one would read it) it happened like this.

Miller befriended Meyer-Crothers in order to force him to do things he didn’t want to do (IMC’s own words) and to bully, abuse, and assault him over the course of several years. This culminated with the CCTV beating and urine candy incident.

IMC’s mother stated that McKie and IMC had an actual friendship. It seems as though it degraded over time into something toxic involving Miller. IMC’s mother made a point of saying that unlike McKie, Miller never had a friendship with IMC (somewhat counter to what IMC said, but neither here nor there)

The day after the juvenile court ruling, the Ohio Blade article comes out. In that article both the judge and the mother are quoted as singling out Miller as having less remorse than McKie. Both boys were ordered to write apology letters.

It is clear that McKie read an apology at the hearing and broke down. This is what IMC’s mother references in the Harris article. He cried and apologized “in-person”- meaning at the hearing. She confirmed the only apology she received from Miller was the court ordered letter.

It’s not clear why McKie was the only boy to apologize at the hearing. We don’t know if Miller was offered that chance and his representation declined or if McKie’s previous relationship with IMC allowed for him to speak more freely to someone whom he previously had a friendship with. We don’t know what happened.

We do know that Miller complies with the court order. He wrote his apology letters. He did his community service for the disabled (as a poster here mentioned he should have).

IMC’s mother gave the quote about feeling that Miller’s chosen rollerblading route being disrespectful the day of the ruling. Prior to his apology letter and prior to his counseling and sensitivity training and community service hours with the disabled.

All of the quotes about his lack of remorse or contrition are previous to any subsequent “work” that went into his “rehabilitation”.

Essentially, the boy that “showed no remorse” was the same boy that demonstrated the monstrous behaviors to begin with.

Tri-City, NoDak, Arizona, and the boy and his family all cite tremendous progress AFTER this time. The statements by the judge and by the victim’s family are further proof that Miller’s overall conduct before the hearing was reprehensible. But these statements are in no way proof of ANYTHING concerning his conduct after April of 2016.

I don't know what Miller's been doing since 2016. I know he did community service. I know he went back to the same school. I know he's in UND right now. But I do know that he never apologized to the family, outside of some letters that were never received. And I know that it doesn't matter worth a shit if you send someone some letters that they never receive. You can't call that squared away. You can't say you feel remorseful if you never own up to what you did. I can say sorry that I bullied that kid to my parents, to the courts, to the NHL, to the janitor, to the president, to whoever the f*** I want, and it doesn't mean SHIT ALL if you can't say it to the victim. And I know that Mitchell never once did that. The other kid did go to his house and apologize in person - that's something the mother directly quoted. And you know what, even if he didn't, he read the apology out and cried in court. He directly apologized. Mitchell didn't. End of story.

 

[Dead Coyote]

And if you don't apologize and own up to your actions, whatever you do in the future isn't gonna change how you handled that. This isn't ancient history. This is 4 years ago. If Mitchell invented the cure for cancer today, I'd applaud him. But he'd still be the same piece of shit who didn't apologize to his victim for nearly a decade of bullying, pain, and trauma.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

The Coyotes know much more about the character of this young man than you holier than thou blowhards on this forum.

I'll bet you a box of your favorite donuts that the Coyotes know absolutely nothing more substantive about this kid than we do.

 

[rt]

I don't know what Miller's been doing since 2016. I know he did community service. I know he went back to the same school. I know he's in UND right now. But I do know that he never apologized to the family, outside of some letters that were never received. And I know that it doesn't matter worth a shit if you send someone some letters that they never receive. You can't call that squared away. You can't say you feel remorseful if you never own up to what you did. I can say sorry that I bullied that kid to my parents, to the courts, to the NHL, to the janitor, to the president, to whoever the f*** I want, and it doesn't mean SHIT ALL if you can't say it to the victim. And I know that Mitchell never once did that. The other kid did go to his house and apologize in person - that's something the mother directly quoted. And you know what, even if he didn't, he read the apology out and cried in court. He directly apologized. Mitchell didn't. End of story.

Incorrect. They did receive the court ordered letter. That’s another false narrative stemming from the way Harris writes.

Joni Meyer-Crothers said the other boy broke down in tears while personally apologizing to her son, yet Miller has never personally apologized, she said, other than the court-mandated letter.

I don't know what Miller has been doing since 2016, either. But here's what he says he's been doing:

“I am extremely sorry about the bullying incident that occurred in 2016 while I was in eighth grade. I was young, immature and feel terrible about my actions. At the time, I did not understand the gravity of my actions and how they can affect other people. I have issued an apology to the family for my behavior, completed cultural diversity and sensitivity training and volunteered within my community with organizations such as Little Miracles. Over the past four years, I have had a lot of time to reflect and grow and I am very grateful to the Arizona Coyotes for taking a chance on me. I promise not to let them down. Moving forward, I want to be a leader for this cause and help end bullying and racism.”

If he's lying, he's a complete bastard. If he's telling the truth, than he's done exactly what anyone would hope that he would do. He completely the court-mandated actions, including the apology letters and community service. It appears (according to him) that he's taken it upon himself to also complete cultural diversity and sensitivity training. He's also demonstrated whatever behavior he's needed to demonstrate to get the Tri-City Storm, University of North Dakota Sioux and Arizona Coyotes to believe in him. Of course, he might have just tricked them. Or worse, they may all just be so callous that they don't care.

 

[Dead Coyote]

And you know who does know what Mitchell's been up to for the last 4 years? All the teams that put Mitchell on the DND list. Because there's no way that incident didn't come up in interviews and teams didn't probe into it, even if the Arizona Coyotes didn't. 30 teams had the chance to draft Mitchell and 30 teams declined. And the Arizona Coyotes want us to trust that they know better than 30 other teams? That they know better than all of the scouts who have specifically said that Mitchell didn't interview well?

 

[Jakey53]

I'll bet you a box of your favorite donuts that the Coyotes know absolutely nothing more substantive about this kid than we do.

You can't be serious about the Coyotes not knowing more about him than you and I? I will take a dozen apple fritters.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

It's not "charmed lives." It's simply what your personality is and how you approach a mistake - or, in this case, a lengthy pattern of bad behavior stretching over years.

If you've never witnessed, participated in, or been a victim of this type of behavior, it's a charmed life for certain. As for the rest of your judgmental rant: No one here really knows the circumstances that lye beneath the cloak of journalism in this and many other situations. Miller could have been acting out because he himself was physically abused. There is really no way of knowing why this happened, perhaps he was, or is just a rotten kid, time may tell. Thing is we are a nation of laws and the law has been applied. Miller will have to live with this the rest of his life as will his victim, hopefully they can BOTH rise above this ugliness.

Contacting the family may, or may not "solve" anything, it might for you and other posters, but it's not about us.

 

[rt]

And if you don't apologize and own up to your actions, whatever you do in the future isn't gonna change how you handled that. This isn't ancient history. This is 4 years ago. If Mitchell invented the cure for cancer today, I'd applaud him. But he'd still be the same piece of shit who didn't apologize to his victim for nearly a decade of bullying, pain, and trauma.

A 14 year old Mitchell was ordered to write apology letters to his school and his victims. He did so. Neither you nor I know why he didn't, like McKie, give an apology statement at the hearing. We don't know why. I wish we did. But it's absolutely impossible to say that the reason Miller didn't give a statement at the hearing is because he wasn't remorseful. Even if we had proof of that, it doesn't prove that he hasn't, in fact, grown and learned and become remorseful and sensitive in the subsequent years.

The four years between 14 and 18 are incredibly long. It's reverse dog-years. It's why the high-school experience is such a point of fixation in our culture. How many movies, books, shows, etc are about this time? It's the longest, shortest time. That and the years of starting your own very young family are the times people always think about. It's an extremely defining period for many people. Many, many changes occur in this time. It's not like the difference between 30 and 34. It's obviously very different.

This isn't even an opinion. It's a fact. It's why we have a juvenile justice system to begin with. We didn't come up with this for six year olds. It exists because we know that kids between 10 and 18 can be criminals but are also much, much, much different than adult counterparts.

It seems like many here would just as soon do away with that, or lower the age to be tried as an adult to 12. It's absurd and it's driven by emotional bias.

I'll say AGAIN that I am NOT defending Miller. As I've said many times, it's very likely that he's never really be sorry for his victim. I'd say the odds are about even that he's only serving his own self-interest.

But and it's my main point, the BIG BUT, we don't know that. People are speaking in absolutes about this and it's frustrating.

"This kid is a complete piece of shit and should never get to play hockey" or "He's NEVER shown even ONE OUNCE of remorse" or "He's NEVER apologized" or "OBVIOUSLY he doesn't care AT ALL" and there's just not evidence to support this. It's all gut reactions.

 

[rt]

And you know who does know what Mitchell's been up to for the last 4 years? All the teams that put Mitchell on the DND list. Because there's no way that incident didn't come up in interviews and teams didn't probe into it, even if the Arizona Coyotes didn't. 30 teams had the chance to draft Mitchell and 30 teams declined. And the Arizona Coyotes want us to trust that they know better than 30 other teams? That they know better than all of the scouts who have specifically said that Mitchell didn't interview well?

Can you list the teams that had him DND? Citing the fact that 30 teams passed on him proves nothing. Why? Two words; Juho Markkanen. Can you list the scouts who said this very specific thing? Or list the thing that was specific?

EDIT: Here's where I need to say AGAIN that I think it was very stupid for Arizona to draft this player and I never would have done it if I was them.

 

[Jakey53]

And you know who does know what Mitchell's been up to for the last 4 years? All the teams that put Mitchell on the DND list. Because there's no way that incident didn't come up in interviews and teams didn't probe into it, even if the Arizona Coyotes didn't. 30 teams had the chance to draft Mitchell and 30 teams declined. And the Arizona Coyotes want us to trust that they know better than 30 other teams? That they know better than all of the scouts who have specifically said that Mitchell didn't interview well?

You are talking like you have personal direct knowledge of Mitchell about the incident and he daily life since.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

You can't be serious about the Coyotes not knowing more about him than you and I? I will take a dozen apple fritters.

It's hook line and sinker journalism Jakey. After all, it's not like any omissions etc. would sell more papers.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

If you've never witnessed, participated in, or been a victim of this type of behavior, it's a charmed life for certain.

Well, that means I haven't led a charmed life, then.

Thing is we are a nation of laws and none have been broken.

He literally broke the law.

 

[GuelphStormer]

When I was 15, I ... <snip>

Thank you for your heartfelt post. It helps to humanize the topic, and that's important. Thanks.

 

[TheLegend]

Mob mentality is wrong when it's a comment that likely was never even made. We KNOW Miller is a racist who abused a handicapped kid and scared him for life. The kids mother said she easily forgives the other boy as he MADE AN EFFORT to apologize and she can tell he GENUINELY regrets his actions.

Miller the damn psychopath even after all of this made an effort to purposely go outside their house to show them that thru can go to the authorities but he's still going to hang out right outside their house.

I have no idea what you're referring to regarding Ryan reeves in this context. But if I'm a Seth Jones calibre player and one day in the trade market Arizona is now on my don't trade list and the coyotes get to learn why.

Your entire post demonstrates you've already made up your mind about Miller, and nothing is going to change that.

At this point even if Miller apologized you wouldn't accept it because you're already slapping labels on the kid.

You have absolutely ZERO idea what other players in the league will do, but have problem projecting what they will do. Miller won't even get a sniff at getting in the NHL for at least the next couple of years and yet absolutely know what other players will do.... only because that's what YOU would.

I mentioned Ryan Reeves because he's (as YOU put it) a "player of color" who took a targeted running shot at an opponent because he had a different color jersey on. He's not the only one in the league (of any color) who does that.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

I guess in the interest of full disclosure that I should mention that I was bullied like Miller's victim was over a period of years when I was still in junior high and high school. I'm not keen on sharing many details (although I nearly lost an eye and a testicle - in two separate incidents, unfortunately). I will mention for anyone readying the "beta cuck" insult that I challenged the guy to a fight once and he never showed, but it didn't stop anything.

If ever I wished I didn't have bonafides or receipts for something, this is probably the top of my list.

 

[rt]

 

[rt]

Mom now stating Miller taunted IMC as recently as 2 years ago. Yikes.

 

[rt]

JMC’s continued activism in this matter is interesting to me. I’m trying to think about how I would react if I was her. I can’t get myself into those shoes well enough. I can’t figure on whether this kind of campaigning years later is commendable or suspect. Really. I can’t.

 

[TheLegend]

Well, that means I haven't led a charmed life, then.

I've been on both sides of it. More of the receiving end than the giving, but I'm thankful that when I was 14, a fellow high school classmate made me realize I need not go down that latter road.

He literally broke the law.

And he performed everything that was demanded of him for it.