EscapedGoat
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- Jun 15, 2012
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Rumor: 2020-21 Trade Rumours and FA Part VIII: Intra-Playoff Edition?
- Thread starter SoundwaveIsCharisma
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Should pay double for a guy with less goals than Jost.
hockeyfish
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This thread is going to be quite insufferable if it's going to be 4 months of complaining about Girard.
Iceberg
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- May 4, 2002
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Still, very rare, and we also have Makar, Toews and Byram (who projects to be a top 4 soon). All under 200 lbs.
Avs_19
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- Jun 28, 2007
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Is there anyone people aren’t complaining about? Saad? LOC?
If you're going by weight... the Hawks in 2015 had 3 of their top 4 under 200. Pens had their runs with Schultz, Letang, and Dailey. Also I'd expect the Avs to bulk Byram up to where he plays at 200-205. Avs certainly are not big on the defensive end, but teams have won without huge players on the backend.
AvalancheSpeedsters
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SoundwaveIsCharisma
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I really think the bigger problem is the forward groups lack of two-way ability. Having some guys back there that can help to break the cycle would have helped a lot. The D got absolutely bombed in the Vegas series, but a lot of that had to do with the forwards floating and waiting for the defensemen to do all the work (break up the Vegas play and then transition the puck).
As I said previously, we could have had Hedman paired with prime Chara and they would get absolutely hammered with the lack of help from the forwards. Size played a role in there, but the bigger issue is the teams dependence on the dmen to do A LOT of the work defensively and to transition it to offense.
Iceberg
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- May 4, 2002
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I think it's a combination of both... The 2015 Hawks had by far the lightest defense to win a Stanley Cup in recent years, and they still had Seabrook and Hjalmarsson (at 6'3") in their top 4.
Right now, as a group, our top 4 is small and light and they (Girard specially) get rattled when teams start hitting them.
AvsCOL
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- Jul 16, 2013
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I think Jost was awesome as a 3C, but he was absolutely horrible at 2C, especially in the Vegas series.
A line of Nuke - Jost - Donskoi is a fantastic third line imo. Problem is when you expect any of those guys to jump into the top-6, you’re going to have a bad time. That’s where another year of development for Newhook helps you.
A line of Nuke - Jost - Donskoi is a fantastic third line imo. Problem is when you expect any of those guys to jump into the top-6, you’re going to have a bad time. That’s where another year of development for Newhook helps you.
Yup definitely need some centers with two way chops, and frankly improve the defense on the wings too. We have plenty of guys that can transition the puck and that is their main contribution to defense. I'd argue only Landy and Nuke are actually good defensive forwards on the wings and Landy pulls a lot of center duty. Jost is solid defensively at center, but can't win a battle to save his life and has no offense (if his role is 4C I'm fine with the offense, but he needs to win more battles). Kadri is too inconsistent defensively and can't be counted. MacK has taken strides, but is still just somewhere between average and good.
There isn't enough offense in that line to work as a 3rd against the best teams. Against bottom level teams, sure... but from the 2nd round to the Finals, it would be a liability offensively.
flyfysher
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- Mar 21, 2012
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Speculative coming from me. I had nothing that I was basing it on other than personal preference.
flyfysher
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I'm not sure that the blame is all on the forwards (meant to reply to one of @Pokecheque's earlier posts. Yes, I noticed some of the other players standing around and I don't think it's out of laziness. More like confusion.
If you have JB switching out players (some of which were relatively new to the other players) in the lineup and then expect them to break discipline and jump in on defense then I'm not sure you're going to get a beautiful defensive play that you hope for or should expect.
One of the things that @Foppa2118 and I criticized Kadri for was breaking discipline when he went for the hit that got him suspended.
I'm not saying the forwards shouldn't help out. Just that I think the criticism really overlooks the original sin of not being able to execute puck possession and initiating the breakout.
Northern Avs Fan
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- May 27, 2019
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I’m not even the biggest Girard fan, but the hate is getting a little out of control.
The guy is still really good and I don’t think should be judged solely on the Vegas series.
Also… Brian Rafalski, Dan Boyle, and Brian Campbell come to mind.
Chiarelli
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If we could get Ottawa to send back Tierney + for Kadri and then sign Danault that might just work.
- Jan 18, 2016
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Mack-Danault-Tierney-Jost would be fine by me for next season. Could even try for White instead of Tierney.
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Avs_19
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What exactly does Tierney do for the bottom six? He isn't particularly good on faceoffs, doesn't bring much physicality, and has horrendous possession numbers for his entire career going back to his Sharks days.
edit: He also has a $3.5M cap hit and actually makes more money than Kadri next year. That's unbelievable.
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The team needs to identify Jost's role to him. If he is a centre, they tell him that, and he spends the entire summer working on faceoffs. If he starts winning draws I think he has all the tools to be a solid 3C. Offense included. I think it would be a big and unjustified demotion to Jost to start next year as the 4th line centre given his performance this year. Remember he ended the regular season as 1C (due to injury, but still).
The thing I am unsure about is whether 3C is best for him or the team. I can see it being fine, so I wouldn't hate it, but in my opinion I like him as our swiss-army knife that can move up/down the lineup and from W > C. I'd rather him 'slot in' as a bottom six or even middle-six winger (assuming we spread out our offense to three lines). Probably with some combination of actual centres Kadri/Newhook/Danault/UFA at centre, and if there is an injury Jost can cover it, rather than a guy like Compher, who was okay vs Vegas but seems to be much better at wing than at C. I think this would be a perfect role for Jost rather than just assigning him 3C (or 4C).
The thing I am unsure about is whether 3C is best for him or the team. I can see it being fine, so I wouldn't hate it, but in my opinion I like him as our swiss-army knife that can move up/down the lineup and from W > C. I'd rather him 'slot in' as a bottom six or even middle-six winger (assuming we spread out our offense to three lines). Probably with some combination of actual centres Kadri/Newhook/Danault/UFA at centre, and if there is an injury Jost can cover it, rather than a guy like Compher, who was okay vs Vegas but seems to be much better at wing than at C. I think this would be a perfect role for Jost rather than just assigning him 3C (or 4C).
shadow1
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- Nov 29, 2008
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Just my opinion but I see him as the 3C for next year.
I have been as critical of Jost as anyone over the last few years, but he changed his game this year and the results paid off. Face-offs have been a major sore spot in his career but he was decent in the circle this year (162-184, 46.8%), winning more face-offs and losing fewer than the last two seasons combined (140-261, 34.9%).
I really want to see what his offense looks like a full season playing as a center. His production this year (7 goals, 17 points in 54 games) was subpar, but when considering he had 6 goals and 14 points in his final 28 games (and another 4 points in 10 post-season games), I think there's at least hope that he can flirt with a 30-35 point season.
The Kingslayer
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If Jost wants to win more faceoff he needs to do something he should have done years ago....shorten that damn stick.
My issue(s) with Girard aren't the Vegas series or if he is a good player. He is a very good, Top 4 guys. But I do think the Avs have one too many D in his mold. Makar and, if healthy, Byram. I wouldn't trade him unless it was part of a package for Seth Jones (with an extension), nor would I leave him exposed over Graves.
I am very curious about the rumors that the only team Jones would sign an extension with is Colorado. If that is true it and he were willing to sign on then it increases the return Columbus would expect. Hard to imagine Colorado getting Jones without sending Girard, a 1st, and some other piece as a starting point.
I am very curious about the rumors that the only team Jones would sign an extension with is Colorado. If that is true it and he were willing to sign on then it increases the return Columbus would expect. Hard to imagine Colorado getting Jones without sending Girard, a 1st, and some other piece as a starting point.
BobRossColton
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Do we not have a Cale Makar contract prediction thread?
Kind of found it in the Norris thread .
Kind of found it in the Norris thread .
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