Speculation: 2020-21 LA Kings News/Roster/Rumors Discussion Part VI

[johnjm22]

It's kind of a stupid moment to be a "straw that broke the camel's back" thing but Carter's 4 goal game has pushed me to the fire Mclellan line.

But is it coaching? or environment?

Carter has won everything there is to win in his career. You're not going to get his best while he's playing meaningless games for a bottom feeder every night.

Now that he's somewhere with a chance to actually win, he plays better. It's not surprising really.

 

[BigBrown]

To be fair, the Kings were in a playoff hunt where every game mattered and Carter still looked like he couldn't give a shit most nights. Not singling him out though, a lot of guys on the team looked the same.

I'm really not a fan of McLellan so far but at some point you gotta stop just going through coaches.

 

[johnjm22]

It's always frustrating seeing players improve as soon as they leave your team.

Martinez is playing the best hockey of his career. Toffoli is near the top of the league in goal scoring. And now Carter has 8 goals in 13 games.

 

[Docgonzo]

Kings offense hasn’t been good through 2 GMs and 6 coaches. I remember when we used to blame Kompon for the horrible PP. Kompon left and the PP was still horrible. DL and Blake seem to draft more playmakers than scorers.

Also this team is basically an infant minus 4-5 players. Vilardi was being labeled a bust at 21 like 5 days ago. Then there were wishing we were Ottawa, even though they’re behind the Kings in the standings.

Lot of patience and ease in the rookies talk in the offseason to trade everybody and fire everybody!! We’re in a rebuild and we aren’t progressing.....even though we are.

 

[Sparky206]

Kings offense hasn’t been good through 2 GMs and 6 coaches. I remember when we used to blame Kompon for the horrible PP. Kompon left and the PP was still horrible. DL and Blake seem to draft more playmakers than scorers.

Also this team is basically an infant minus 4-5 players. Vilardi was being labeled a bust at 21 like 5 days ago. Then there were wishing we were Ottawa, even though they’re behind the Kings in the standings.

Lot of patience and ease in the rookies talk in the offseason to trade everybody and fire everybody!! We’re in a rebuild and we aren’t progressing.....even though we are.

There are also posters on here who think we should have traded Kopitar and also think he is over paid at 10m. This is
the guy whos lead his team in scoring in 13 of the past 14 seasons (only one other player has ever done that), one of only 91 players EVER to reach 1000 points, never misses a game over his career and has done it all while being the best 2 way center in the league over his career.

Future HOFer guaranteed and people here want to trade him. This place is full of idiot armchair GM's, thankfully the kings rebuild is being handled professionally and is on track.

 

[KingsFan7824]

It's always frustrating seeing players improve as soon as they leave your team.

Martinez is playing the best hockey of his career. Toffoli is near the top of the league in goal scoring. And now Carter has 8 goals in 13 games.

And the question is, why? What happened after June 2014? All of these past loves were here, for years on end, directly involved in making more and more Kings games increasingly meaningless. Yet so many of those guys were here when the games meant the most. This famed culture that DL built, why didn't it sustain?

 

[KingsFan7824]

There are also posters on here who think we should have traded Kopitar and also think he is over paid at 10m. This is
the guy whos lead his team in scoring in 13 of the past 14 seasons (only one other player has ever done that), one of only 91 players EVER to reach 1000 points, never misses a game over his career and has done it all while being the best 2 way center in the league over his career.

Future HOFer guaranteed and people here want to trade him. This place is full of idiot armchair GM's, thankfully the kings rebuild is being handled professionally and is on track.

It's not even that. He won Cups here. He got rewarded for it by the organization. They did it with Quick. They did it with Brown. They weren't stopping with Kopitar or Doughty if they wanted to stay. Call that a country club if you want, but if the Kings are supposed to be an efficient machine, then you don't hand a 10 year contract to a goalie minutes off a Conn Smythe.

 

[YP44]

If those kids are supposed to be that good I don’t want Calgary to get it. Kings facing McJesus/Leon in Edmonton and the next big one in Calgary for the next decade? No thank you.

I really wish the new divisions would have seen Edmonton and Calgary moved to the central and Minnesota, or St. Louis moved to Pacific.

 

[YP44]

It's always frustrating seeing players improve as soon as they leave your team.

Martinez is playing the best hockey of his career. Toffoli is near the top of the league in goal scoring. And now Carter has 8 goals in 13 games.

yup, both happy for them and pissed it is not in LA.

 

[SFKingshomer]

Pay a boatload to Rod Brind'Amour

 

[Fishhead]

And the question is, why? What happened after June 2014? All of these past loves were here, for years on end, directly involved in making more and more Kings games increasingly meaningless. Yet so many of those guys were here when the games meant the most. This famed culture that DL built, why didn't it sustain?

I don't think it's so much to do with culture but rather fatigue and physical abuse. Culture is just there to try and put you over the top. The Kings won those cups in physical fashion, it's not like there are generationals on the roster. They probably would have had a couple more years if it wasn't for the Voynov fiasco, but still about 5 years of cup level is all you get.

You have teams like San Jose who made the playoffs every year for a long time, but they never bought in and sacrificed enough to make it happen. The mental toll of winning the cup is pretty draining too, after a while it's difficult to get up to the required level even for a pro athlete. Same reason you see players leave teams and have success elsewhere.

While it was successful, Sutter's reign took a mental toll. Kind of like when you are at a shitty job for a while and even after changes for the better are made, you just associate that job with negative feelings. They are athletes, but also humans and I saw that drained "I'm done" look out of the players even after Sutter was fired.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I really wish the new divisions would have seen Edmonton and Calgary moved to the central and Minnesota, or St. Louis moved to Pacific.

They'll do it for one year under special circumstances, but there's no way a CTZ team was going to come to the Pacific over a MTZ team.

I don't think it's so much to do with culture but rather fatigue and physical abuse. Culture is just there to try and put you over the top. The Kings won those cups in physical fashion, it's not like there are generationals on the roster. They probably would have had a couple more years if it wasn't for the Voynov fiasco, but still about 5 years of cup level is all you get.

You have teams like San Jose who made the playoffs every year for a long time, but they never bought in and sacrificed enough to make it happen. The mental toll of winning the cup is pretty draining too, after a while it's difficult to get up to the required level even for a pro athlete. Same reason you see players leave teams and have success elsewhere.

While it was successful, Sutter's reign took a mental toll. Kind of like when you are at a shitty job for a while and even after changes for the better are made, you just associate that job with negative feelings. They are athletes, but also humans and I saw that drained "I'm done" look out of the players even after Sutter was fired.

A good reason to get rid of the guaranteed contracts then. Everyone should've been gone after 14-15, from Lewis to Lombardi.

Might also be the reason the organization has become much more player friendly.

 

[Fishhead]

A good reason to get rid of the guaranteed contracts then. Everyone should've been gone after 14-15, from Lewis to Lombardi.

It is a good argument against guaranteed contracts, but it's not like that just can be imposed. It would have to be bargained and the tradeoff would be something significant. I'd love to see that visited in the next negotiation but I'm not holding my breath.

Cleaning house can always be done, but good luck selling that to an owner a year or so after a cup when they are finally recouping money on their investment. The NHL is never going to have the TV contracts or revenue of the other 3 majors and the cap is never going away, which means you can't rebuild in short order on the fly like you could 20 years ago. It's just the reality and why you see so many teams just hanging on forever. This isn't Kings specific, all teams do the same thing.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

I've stopped trying to figure out why the Kings were not capable of maintaining their competitiveness over a long period. They clearly had the talent to do so. They just didn't. Some kind of combination of environment, coaching, GMing, system, etc. etc.

I still believe the back to back to back scandals circa 2014 really broke the team mentally, from the players all the way up to Lombardi.

 

[BigKing]

And the question is, why? What happened after June 2014? All of these past loves were here, for years on end, directly involved in making more and more Kings games increasingly meaningless. Yet so many of those guys were here when the games meant the most. This famed culture that DL built, why didn't it sustain?

Well, losing Voynov and Mitchell for the 2015 season is the biggest "loss of talent" piece to look at. They were always kind of fine line for making the playoffs anyways so a down year from Kopitar and an atrocious OT/SO record has them on the outside looking in. Then you lose more leadership in Williams, Stoll, Regher and basically Greene. Add Lucic which is fine but Gaborik dies that year and the blueline depth is still in tatters.

From there, we get to the players being unhappy with Sutter since they don't have the wins anymore to offset it. Everyone that is still here from the Cups seems to get into that thing that Lombardi feared: wanting to play in LA because of the weather etc. These guys already won and are made men...Kings of Manhattan Beach. No prospects worth a salt to come in and help them win and no real money to makes moves because these guys gobbled it all up, except the one bullet they had was used on Kovalchuk who was completely looking for a pay day.

DL's culture went to shit because a lot of the guys that really cultivated left or hit the end of their careers. I didn't even mention Richards who was key in the culture as well.

As for these guys going elsewhere and playing better, well, it is really no surprise. These guys are good players: especially Toffoli who is a guy that seemed real too in to the beach life from the outside looking in. Regardless, we've seen it in the reverse with Gaborik and Lecavalier: guys get energized when they think they have a chance to win.

As for Carter, he did look energized to start the season since everyone has the same record to start the year. We can say that they've been playing meaningful games but, c'mon, they know they don't have a chance of winning anything even if they were technically in the playoff "race". So at some point in the season they just go out there, punch the clock for their checks and try not to break a nail. Now Carter has a chance to play in real games on a team that has a real chance and there is more effort. He's also going to look better playing on a better team regardless...rising tide raises all boats.

*edit* Forgot to mention that a huge post 2014 problem was hubris. One of the craziest Cup runs in the history of the NHL. They felt invincible and then you get Voynov, "we'll just get in and flip the switch" mentality and then Wet Republic to top it all off. Then Lombardi just tossing in Lucic and thinking that 2015 was an anomaly.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Pay a boatload to Rod Brind'Amour

Word is he’s actually going to be taking less money so that his entire staff can stay intact in Carolina.

Rick Tocchet is going to be available this summer, but the criticisms he faced from Coyotes fans and fans of previous teams he coached echoes the gripes Kings fans have currently with Todd McLellan.

 

[YP44]

Word is he’s actually going to be taking less money so that his entire staff can stay intact in Carolina.

Rick Tocchet is going to be available this summer, but the criticisms he faced from Coyotes fans and fans of previous teams he coached echoes the gripes Kings fans have currently with Todd McLellan.

yup and if Carolina does not take care of the rest of the staff I think he will go to Seattle. Him and Francis have history

 

[driller1]

I really wish the new divisions would have seen Edmonton and Calgary moved to the central and Minnesota, or St. Louis moved to Pacific.

I will miss AZ. It's not so much that I have so much respect for their players. It's more because I think they're a dumpster fire of an organization and always will be, making our competition easier over the long haul.

 

[YP44]

I will miss AZ. It's not so much that I have so much respect for their players. It's more because I think they're a dumpster fire of an organization and always will be, making our competition easier over the long haul.

agreed.

 

[BigKing]

I will miss AZ. It's not so much that I have so much respect for their players. It's more because I think they're a dumpster fire of an organization and always will be, making our competition easier over the long haul.

I will not miss them. Mostly a snooze fest every time we play them for years and years now.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

It's always frustrating seeing players improve as soon as they leave your team.

Martinez is playing the best hockey of his career. Toffoli is near the top of the league in goal scoring. And now Carter has 8 goals in 13 games.

Like I said, it was illogical and mostly an emotional reaction for me.

But it was easy to predict too because every player that leaves enjoys at least the same level of success if not more.

Of course, part of it is better 'roles' on their new squads and competitive games. That part is just getting really, really old to me and makes me want to clean house, burn any bridge to the past.

 

[cyclones22]

Well, losing Voynov and Mitchell for the 2015 season is the biggest "loss of talent" piece to look at. They were always kind of fine line for making the playoffs anyways so a down year from Kopitar and an atrocious OT/SO record has them on the outside looking in. Then you lose more leadership in Williams, Stoll, Regher and basically Greene. Add Lucic which is fine but Gaborik dies that year and the blueline depth is still in tatters.

Voynov and Mitchell were playing 23 and 22 minutes TOI respectively during those 2014 Playoffs. I don't care how good your depth is, but those were massive losses. That was the beginning of the end. It caused a trickle effect of Sutter breaking up the Doughty/Muzzin pairing as well. We still see that impact today. An excellent 2-way second pairing PMD is a difficult find.

 

[Damassk]

CSKA Moscow makes a trade and acquires rights for Lias Andersson from Magnitogorsk. Theу will try to sign him in the summer.

 

[BigKing]

Like I said, it was illogical and mostly an emotional reaction for me.

But it was easy to predict too because every player that leaves enjoys at least the same level of success if not more.

Of course, part of it is better 'roles' on their new squads and competitive games. That part is just getting really, really old to me and makes me want to clean house, burn any bridge to the past.

If Dustin Brown wanted to go to a contender and accept a 11-13 minute 3rd/4th line role with maybe some front net PP time, that team would probably rave about him since he'd probably look to truck people again in his new role and more limited minutes.

Jesus...I just looked at the TOI per game for Kopitar and Doughty. If Management wants these two to still be real good when it is time to compete, cut their minutes for f***s sake. Kopitar's minutes the last few seasons are ridiculous.

 

[YP44]

If Dustin Brown wanted to go to a contender and accept a 11-13 minute 3rd/4th line role with maybe some front net PP time, that team would probably rave about him since he'd probably look to truck people again in his new role and more limited minutes.

Jesus...I just looked at the TOI per game for Kopitar and Doughty. If Management wants these two to still be real good when it is time to compete, cut their minutes for f***s sake. Kopitar's minutes the last few seasons are ridiculous.

need to find someone who win faceoffs and then take Kopitar off the PK.