GDT: 2019 Draft Discussion: LA Kings pick 5th, 22nd overall 8 p.m. ET (NBCSN, SN, TVAS)

[KINGS17]

Yawn....what is wrong with skill??? You can get character in the 2nd round and beyond.

Nothing is wrong with skill. Blake is singing from the same hymn book as Dean is all.

 

[No Name The Nameless]

Lavoie seems like the best option. BPA, need and safe.

 

[KingsFan7824]

If you like the Bjornfot pick, that’s perfectly fair. He’s not off the board. I personally don’t understand the reasoning behind passing one of the talented forwards left at #22 today, but whatever. Not the end of the world.

But let’s cut out the constant appeals to authority. Professional scouts don’t have some secret, forbidden knowledge. They have been and consistently are wrong across the board, and the hivemind of the Internet has indeed been proven correct. Half the scouts in 2008 thought Bogosian was a better pick than Doughty. Half the scouts thought Forbort was a solid pick over Tarasenko. And ALL of the scouts thought Nail Yakupov would be a bonafide star.

Scouts are human beings with biases and blind spots and they make mistakes. Period. It’s 2019. Fans have access to thousands of hours of junior and international hockey on their ****ing cell phones.

For ****’s sake, in 2014 Darryl Sutter was obsessed with sitting Tanner Pearson and instead playing Richards next to Carter when literally every fan on this very board was screaming to play Tanner and demote Richards. As soon as Sutter did exactly that, the team looked fantastic.

Sometimes fans are actually right, and the professionals don’t know what the **** they’re doing. I’m not saying Bjornfot over Kaliyev is one of those times, but it’s not unheard of.

Which isn't an issue. It's just the unwavering conviction with the draft, which tends to get random very quickly. Even the guys in the middle of the 1st round aren't guaranteed to ever play a game. People can get so sold on the guy they want. It's fine to disagree with a pick, but to say any given pick is terrible, or even great, nobody can know that. Pro or amateur alike. There were better players to pick than Brown in 2003, and yet he's the only one to captain a team to one Cup, let alone two. Does that mean picking Brown was right, or wrong? If there were better players available, it was objectively the wrong pick, but how could it have been wrong if they won with him? There may be better players than Bjornfot taken after 22, but what happens if the Kings win with him? It's a long shot, but it was a long shot that the Kings win with Brown too. Will we still lament this pick, or will we forget about it? When Parise is putting up 45g/94pts in 08-09, and Brown is sitting at 24g/53pts, are we thinking how much better one would look next to Kopitar than the other? 3 years later, it no longer made any difference, but in 2009, what's going on? I'll guess at least some people thought the Kings screwed up the pick, prior to the golden age. Which could still be true, despite them winning the Cup with the guy they took.

 

[kings11]

I don’t think anyone outside of the top ten will develop into a Richard winning sniper, but Kaliyev did just post 50 in his draft year. Usually players with that stat line go in the top 15, not fall out of the first round.

So who knows. Maybe the kid is just a lazy locker room cancer. Definitely worth taking a risk on at #22 and certainly worth the risk at #33.

Brink looks like a Toffoli clone, Kaliyev is boom or bust... it wouldn’t surprise me if they went the US HS route

 

[KINGS17]

Yes. So why would anyone be getting so upset? If he was rated lower, that could be wrong. He could be good. It's the NHL draft. We all do this every year. We get pissed at picks every year. Yes, most will never see NHL ice. Nobody really knows which ones will, other than the obvious high end guys. I don't get, how after all these years, people still get so emotional about picks minutes after they happen. It's a flip of the coin. Anyone would likely be the wrong pick at 22, and a high skill guy is no more or less likely to succeed or fail than a safe pick. That fact plays itself out draft, after draft, after draft, after draft, after draft. All around the league. Again and again. Year after year. Without fail. Yet here we are again, talking about how awful the pick is guaranteed to be.

There is no bigger crap shoot than the NHL and MLB amateur drafts. Teams are picking 17 and 18 year olds and trying to project where they will be in three to four years.

Teams put a lot of work into the draft, but the real work is just starting.

 

[kingsfan28]

In the end, out of all the US 1st rounders taken, Turcotte seems to be closest to nhl ready after Hughes. Give him a year, the rest probably 2-5.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

If you like the Bjornfot pick, that’s perfectly fair. He’s not off the board. I personally don’t understand the reasoning behind passing one of the talented forwards left at #22 today, but whatever. Not the end of the world.

But let’s cut out the constant appeals to authority. Professional scouts don’t have some secret, forbidden knowledge. They have been and consistently are wrong across the board, and the hivemind of the Internet has indeed been proven correct. Half the scouts in 2008 thought Bogosian was a better pick than Doughty. Half the scouts thought Forbort was a solid pick over Tarasenko. And ALL of the scouts thought Nail Yakupov would be a bonafide star.

Scouts are human beings with biases and blind spots and they make mistakes. Period. It’s 2019. Fans have access to thousands of hours of junior and international hockey on their ****ing cell phones.

For ****’s sake, in 2014 Darryl Sutter was obsessed with sitting Tanner Pearson and instead playing Richards next to Carter when literally every fan on this very board was screaming to play Tanner and demote Richards. As soon as Sutter did exactly that, the team looked fantastic.

Sometimes fans are actually right, and the professionals don’t know what the **** they’re doing. I’m not saying Bjornfot over Kaliyev is one of those times, but it’s not unheard of.

Bjornfot is a legit talent and possibly will be better than Clague, Durzi, and any of the D prospects, except Mikey Anderson. Watching the 10 minute Bjornfot clips, he's certainly talented and stronger than Durzi. Durzi is not as strong as Bjornfot or as good as defensively. Just because someone says his offensive upside is limited, that's BS, if you watch all his clips...he's often going end to end and beating most any opponent..."but they are highlight clips" ...no, he's very solid in all aspects of the game and is team captain. Pronmans report on Bjornfot said his offense was excelling in the latter part of the year. Look, Forbort sucks and is not as quick as Bjornfot. Tobias is already probably a better player than Forbort is now.

As far as passing on forward talent? The Kings get the second pick tomorrow and Lavoie, Brink, Hoglander and Kaliyev are there, as is Brett Leason...no one would would have bemoaned if the Kings took Brink or Kalieyev at 22.. And they can still get one of them! Who have they missed out on? Only Tomasino, possibly. Nolan Foote will be fringe at best. McMichael must lack something, as 70 on one list

The Kings did not miss with pick 22 and they have a shot at 1 of: Hoglander (Pronman says BEST HANDS in draft) Kaliyev, Lavoie (who had like 17 playoff goals) Brink, or even Brett Leason.

Yesterday, if you told me the Kings drafted Turcotte and Bjornfot in round one, I would be ecstatic and I certainly am now. 2 leaders that play the game fast and with skill. #3 ranked overall Turcotte and Central Scouting 3rd rated Euro defenseman in Bjornfot. (7th overall Central Scouting Euro)

Talk about missing out on offensive talent? #6 Seider? Wow. They could have had Zegras, Boldy, Newhook, Krebs, Podkolzin, or Cozens. I would be pissed...the Kings taking Bjornfot over Tomasino?
Let's see in 3 years how that looks. The Kings may actually get the next guy on their list after Bjornfot at #33.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

Blake passes on Kaliyev or Lavoie, I’ll really be pissed.

 

[Rekingsfan17]

If they aren't going to pick Kaliyev or Brink then I hope they trade down for an extra pick. The Devils, Redwings, and Hurricanes all have three picks in the second round. hopefully, one of them is desperate to trade up for Kaliyev or Brink and makes us a deal. There is still Nicolas Robertson, Nils Hoglander, Raphael Lavoie, Patrik Puistola and Pavel Dorfeyev even if Kaliyev and Brink are taken early.......tons of talent available if we trade down.

I agree with kings11 about the USHS player route. LaCombe, Huglen, Donovan, and Pioniemi all look like really good players. trading down makes sense to me......

 

[Mats26]

We picked BPA Forward at 5
We picked BPA Defenceman at 22

Still 8 picks left

 

[Peter James Bond II]

John Hoven | The Mayor
‏
@mayorNHL
38m38 minutes ago
More
Few notes on why Kings liked Tobias Bjornfot at 22
- Have to address some of the culture we've lost
- Was captain of every Sweden team in his age group
- Top 4 D, first PK, & plays on PP
- Has intangibles, competitive qualities we value
- Versatile player on both sides of puck

Yannetti on media call - Bjornfot is an elite skating defenseman, mobile, leads with character, less of a creative passer and more of a quick passer -- which we like -- he creates space coming up the ice, both with his feet and quick puck movement
______________________________________________

Love the pick. Kings may have like 8 defensemen prospects, but Mikey Anderson may be the only one as good or better than Bjornfot. Hard to know if Clague and Durzi will be as good or better than him.

 

[cyclones22]

Wut? I left the draft party thinking the Kings did well. I come back here and it's wet blanket city about Bjornfot. Turcotte has always been my most wanted, so I was thrilled he was selected at 5. After that big run of defensemen being selected once Seider went, I was fine with the selection of Bjornfot. I've seen him slotted in the 20s (Pronman's last mock had him going at 21 to the Pens), so I wasn't shocked the Kings selected him because there may not have been any defenders left of pick 33 value tomorrow. I know, passing up sexy forwards is always a lover's lament. But a lot of those forwards are still there for the taking tomorrow and I'm confident they'll select one at 33. Unless of course some other team absolutely must have that 33rd selection and make an offer the Kings can't refuse.

 

[lumbergh]

Blake passes on Kaliyev or Lavoie, I’ll really be pissed.

How about Leason?

 

[kingsfan28]

Rhut Rho...

 

[Ollie Weeks]

remember when he said trading Jack Johnson for carter was a HUGE mistake? 3 months later we were lifting the cup.

“I come from the school of thought that you need at least 4 or 5 good defencemen...etc”

 

[Telos]

Sounds like they want to target safer bets than take risks on make or break flashy forwards.

 

[kingsfan28]

Bjornfot is a legit talent and possibly will be better than Clague, Durzi, and any of the D prospects, except Mikey Anderson. Watching the 10 minute Bjornfot clips, he's certainly talented and stronger than Durzi. Durzi is not as strong as Bjornfot or as good as defensively. Just because someone says his offensive upside is limited, that's BS, if you watch all his clips...he's often going end to end and beating most any opponent..."but they are highlight clips" ...no, he's very solid in all aspects of the game and is team captain. Pronmans report on Bjornfot said his offense was excelling in the latter part of the year. Look, Forbort sucks and is not as quick as Bjornfot. Tobias is already probably a better player than Forbort is now.

As far as passing on forward talent? The Kings get the second pick tomorrow and Lavoie, Brink, Hoglander and Kaliyev are there, as is Brett Leason...no one would would have bemoaned if the Kings took Brink or Kalieyev at 22.. And they can still get one of them! Who have they missed out on? Only Tomasino, possibly. Nolan Foote will be fringe at best. McMichael must lack something, as 70 on one list

The Kings did not miss with pick 22 and they have a shot at 1 of: Hoglander (Pronman says BEST HANDS in draft) Kaliyev, Lavoie (who had like 17 playoff goals) Brink, or even Brett Leason.

Yesterday, if you told me the Kings drafted Turcotte and Bjornfot in round one, I would be ecstatic and I certainly am now. 2 leaders that play the game fast and with skill. #3 ranked overall Turcotte and Central Scouting 3rd rated Euro defenseman in Bjornfot. (7th overall Central Scouting Euro)

Talk about missing out on offensive talent? #6 Seider? Wow. They could have had Zegras, Boldy, Newhook, Krebs, Podkolzin, or Cozens. I would be pissed...the Kings taking Bjornfot over Tomasino?
Let's see in 3 years how that looks. The Kings may actually get the next guy on their list after Bjornfot at #33.

The Wings passing up the Russian was a bit of a shock. Falling to 10 wasn't too surprising seeing how he's committed to the KHL.

 

[Herby]

I really didn't think there was much of a chance they were going to get Turcotte, just didn't think both teams would pass on him. Was about 60% Dach, 30% Byram, 10% Turcotte. Happy that I was wrong.

Wasn't crazy about Bjornfoot pick, nothing against the player but the Kings really lack finishers in the farm system (and obviously at the pro level). Although Blake has a great chance to get a guy many of us wanted at 22 so ultimately he made the right call if that happens.

 

[johnjm22]

I wonder what it is about Kaliyev that has put teams off so much. His stats should make him one of the top players in the draft.

I know there's questions about his motivation / work ethic, but there must be something more to it.

On YouTube I could only find one interview Kaliyev. He doesn't come off well. Not as in his attitude is bad or anything like that, but in terms of intelligence. I feel kind of bad saying that. I bet his team interviews went really poorly and that's effecting his draft position.

 

[kingsfan28]

“I come from the school of thought that you need at least 4 or 5 good defencemen...etc”

I guess he never saw Voynov play. He was better than JJ was from the moment he took the ice.

 

[johnjm22]

 

[SlimCharles]

I'm very happy Turcotte fell to us at 5! I thought Chicago was taking him for sure. I was surprised by the Bjornfot pick, but that's because I really didn't know anything about him. After watching some film of him he looks like a really solid defenseman. I'm a big fan of Kaliyev's offensive ability, so I think it would be pretty wise to take a shot at him with pick 33 if Ottawa passes on him. Why not? 33 is a great time to take a chance on talent like that.

 

[kingsfan28]

Sounds like they want to target safer bets than take risks on make or break flashy forwards.

They have some pretty good options.

 

[Herby]

BTW, it wasn't an insane consensus but I would say most people had Byram/Turcotte as being slightly better than Dach so it'll be interesting to see how this plays out for Stan Bowman. The fact that he passed on a hometown kid is also going to sweeten the narrative. If Turcotte turns into a prime-Richards and Dach is RyJo (I think both are possible) he will be heavily criticized.

 

[funky]

After review I am happy thus far. Byram was my ideal choice but I love the Turcotte pick.

Bjornfot was selected right around the time he was targeted. Because we had a few similar dman in the system I did not do a lot of research on him as I thought Blake might try for something a little different. After looking at numerous videos and publications I am happy with the pick. His two years over seas allows us to slowly integrate the defense prospects we have into the system. If you think about it he would be the perfect guy to pair with Durzi if both pan out.

As for day 2 and the rumors the Kings are possibly looking at trading down I do not see a Kaliyev, Brink etc in our future. Maybe Blake trades down a bit and sends a contract out with the pick. Its a crap shoot at this point.