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ScoreZeGoals said:
I'd move Toffoli regardless. I just don't trust giving him the type of contract he would want if he has a good season, it's time to move on and get the most that you can.
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Agree. Toffoli isn't a leader, and he has a limited skill set. If he isn't scoring, he isn't really providing anything. Toffoli is too old to fit into the next wave of players we all hope will make up a contending team. Getting another future asset for him in a trade at any point during this season is fine by me.
 
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The good news is that TMac has carte blanche to experiment and really learn these players inside and out since this season is a write-off. Sure, he's going to try to get them to win every game, but unlike Willie D, he doesn't feel death's cold breath on the back of his neck because his career is on the line - so he can take some risks and experiment. He might even get this team going decently as-is by the holidays.
 
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KingsFan7824 said:
They've already turned down Marleau.



I guess if you keep Forbort, Hutton, and Toffoli for over $10m on the cap, all 3 somehow getting raises, you can make anything work. The big issue is, nobody ever wants those guys back. At least 2 of the 3 anyway. Nobody cares about Hutton. Walker at $2m? Plus you haven't said how you plan on getting rid of Carter, Kovalchuk, and Quick.

Again, they didn't take Marleau because the Leafs wouldn't take Carter back to make the money closer, and you've got them paying Forbort $3m to be the 7th D? I'm going to guess that won't happen. If they bring him back at more money, he's playing over Bjornfot and/or Anderson.
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You missed the point completely. You keep saying we need to keep Carter to reach the cap floor. I removed Kovy, Carter and Quick cap hits and easily surpassed the floor with 16 million to spend on upgrades. My point is reaching the cap floor should not even be in consideration when we are trying to move these contracts. Moving these contracts is a whole other issue.
 
Mats26 said:
You missed the point completely. You keep saying we need to keep Carter to reach the cap floor. I removed Kovy, Carter and Quick cap hits and easily surpassed the floor with 16 million to spend on upgrades. My point is reaching the cap floor should not even be in consideration when we are trying to move these contracts. Moving these contracts is a whole other issue.
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As far as reaching the cap floor goes, any move of those guys is going to probably come with some retention. Don't know if that retention cheddar counts towards the floor, but I assume it would.
 
BigKing said:
As far as reaching the cap floor goes, any move of those guys is going to probably come with some retention. Don't know if that retention cheddar counts towards the floor, but I assume it would.
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Good point. These contracts aren't going to magically disappear this year. We have to retain and that amount goes against the cap as well.
 
Mats26 said:
You missed the point completely. You keep saying we need to keep Carter to reach the cap floor. I removed Kovy, Carter and Quick cap hits and easily surpassed the floor with 16 million to spend on upgrades. My point is reaching the cap floor should not even be in consideration when we are trying to move these contracts. Moving these contracts is a whole other issue.
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Because you brought back Toffoli and Forbort, which very few people want to see happen. Unless they're actually getting something for Carter, what's the urgency to move the contract, if you're then also going to give Toffoli a raise? They're not trying to free up cap to bring in someone else anymore. You can just let Toffoli go(maybe even get an asset if he can keep scoring), keep Carter, and you've accomplished the same thing. Blake would have to pay to get rid of Carter. He can't even be a C on this team, so what contender needs an aging winger that can't score? Even at 50% for the next 2 years after this one? I'm sure other teams have their own young guys they could easily put in there instead of a soon to be 35 year old that can't do much.

I understand the want to just be rid of Carter, because we're all tired of the past, but what are you willing to give up with him to get rid of him? Get rid of Toffoli, buy Carter out, and sign some desperate UFA for a couple million(who will have to steal a spot from a young guy that everyone wants in the lineup), and we get the same result, which is perfectly fine. Then at least we wouldn't be watching more of the past with Toffoli. It would be the winger equivalent of Hutton, who we have no emotional attachment to, so no baggage, so it would at least be something new. I just think the path of least resistance does not include trying to figure out a way to dump a guy that nobody wants. If Carter was a UFA this year, everything would be much easier, but he's not.

And reaching the floor has to be a consideration. By rule. Doesn't help that they're losing some of the Richards hit after this year either.
 
@KF7824
I think some fans are going to be disappointed when Blake doesn't trade half the roster and immediately replace them with prospects.

This isn't soccer where you can overhaul a roster in 1 or 2 transfer windows. It's a process and will take a few years.

Impending ufa's will likely be moved. I'm thinking Toffoli, 1 of Clifford/Lewis, and 2 of Hutton/Martinez/Forbort/Ryan. Ideally Campbell will play well and be moved. Same for Kovy if we retain 50%. 4 to 6 players max this year. Kovy, Martinez, Campbell and Iafallo can be moved the following year if still around.
 
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verbalkint47 said:
@KF7824
I think some fans are going to be disappointed when Blake doesn't trade half the roster and immediately replace them with prospects.

This isn't soccer where you can overhaul a roster in 1 or 2 transfer windows. It's a process and will take a few years.

Impending ufa's will likely be moved. I'm thinking Toffoli, 1 of Clifford/Lewis, and 2 of Hutton/Martinez/Forbort/Ryan. Ideally Campbell will play well and be moved. Same for Kovy if we retain 50%. 4 to 6 players max this year. Kovy, Martinez, Campbell and Iafallo can be moved the following year if still around.
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What type of real hockey fan woul dexpect a team to trade half its roster?

The forward corps is likely staying the same with the exception of Toffoli and possible Lewis... No one in Ontario will be brought up to be part of this other than Frk, Prokhorkin and Luff.. JAD will get his minutes at C as will Kupari on the farm for the sake of their Development..

Defensively, Bjornfot will be headed back to Sweden, Hutton is a free asset who'll get us something at the TDL, Forbort will likely be out until the TDL so he has zero value, Martinez is likley kept to help mentor unless we're blown away, Ryan, Roy and Walker are plugs and Mikey Anderson is likely to replace Bjornfot in the lineup at some point this season..

Quick and Campbell have looked shakey to say the least, Ifone gets moved its likely Soupy and Cal will split the season with Quick..

That IMHO sums up the fiery disco inferno this franchise is currently in...
 
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kings11 said:
What type of real hockey fan woul dexpect a team to trade half its roster?

The forward corps is likely staying the same with the exception of Toffoli and possible Lewis... No one in Ontario will be brought up to be part of this other than Frk, Prokhorkin and Luff.. JAD will get his minutes at C as will Kupari on the farm for the sake of their Development..

Defensively, Bjornfot will be headed back to Sweden, Hutton is a free asset who'll get us something at the TDL, Forbort will likely be out until the TDL so he has zero value, Martinez is likley kept to help mentor unless we're blown away, Ryan, Roy and Walker are plugs and Mikey Anderson is likely to replace Bjornfot in the lineup at some point this season..

Quick and Campbell have looked shakey to say the least, Ifone gets moved its likely Soupy and Cal will split the season with Quick..

That IMHO sums up the fiery disco inferno this franchise is currently in...
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To be fair, there were several posts like three weeks ago talking about Bjornfot being up all season as a legit #2 defenseman with Mikey Anderson also being on the team shortly as a legit #4.

Going back to last season, Kupari was going to make the team this year as was JAD.

I get it. We all would like the rebuild to be mostly over with at this point and would rather watch new exciting players v. the same old shit we've been watching during the last five years of poor results. The reality is--and has been--that this isn't what is going to happen and reality seems to be setting in for those that hoped otherwise.

Patience. We'll most likely get to see Anderson/JAD/Kupari/Clague etc...at different times throughout the year. Best case is they crush it in Ontario, clinch a spot early and then some of the guys get some NHL minutes in them before going back for a long Calder Cup run. In the meantime, buy the AHL TV package and hope that MacDermid is dressed in LA as much as possible.
 
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BigKing said:
To be fair, there were several posts like three weeks ago talking about Bjornfot being up all season as a legit #2 defenseman with Mikey Anderson also being on the team shortly as a legit #4.

Going back to last season, Kupari was going to make the team this year as was JAD.

I get it. We all would like the rebuild to be mostly over with at this point and would rather watch new exciting players v. the same old **** we've been watching during the last five years of poor results. The reality is--and has been--that this isn't what is going to happen and reality seems to be setting in for those that hoped otherwise.

Patience. We'll most likely get to see Anderson/JAD/Kupari/Clague etc...at different times throughout the year. Best case is they crush it in Ontario, clinch a spot early and then some of the guys get some NHL minutes in them before going back for a long Calder Cup run. In the meantime, buy the AHL TV package and hope that MacDermid is dressed in LA as much as possible.
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I'd be shocked if Ontario doesn't get a playoff birth.. Hell, I expect Turcotte to make an appearance possibly with either Dudas or Kaliyev on a a tryout ... and of course we still have the Vilardi longshot..

dont think we'll be as bad as last season but i hope we finally get some draft luck and pick top 3 though i'd really love Laffy or Quinton
 
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BigKing said:
To be fair, there were several posts like three weeks ago talking about Bjornfot being up all season as a legit #2 defenseman with Mikey Anderson also being on the team shortly as a legit #4.

Going back to last season, Kupari was going to make the team this year as was JAD.

I get it. We all would like the rebuild to be mostly over with at this point and would rather watch new exciting players v. the same old **** we've been watching during the last five years of poor results. The reality is--and has been--that this isn't what is going to happen and reality seems to be setting in for those that hoped otherwise.

Patience. We'll most likely get to see Anderson/JAD/Kupari/Clague etc...at different times throughout the year. Best case is they crush it in Ontario, clinch a spot early and then some of the guys get some NHL minutes in them before going back for a long Calder Cup run. In the meantime, buy the AHL TV package and hope that MacDermid is dressed in LA as much as possible.
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Based on Bjornfot's preseason play and praise from inside and outside the organization, I don't think people were reaching when they said he could play up the whole year. He hasn't played "bad" by any stretch. But if Sweden will do the most for him, Sweden it should be then.
 
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Choralone said:
Based on Bjornfot's preseason play and praise from inside and outside the organization, I don't think people were reaching when they said he could play up the whole year. He hasn't played "bad" by any stretch. But if Sweden will do the most for him, Sweden it should be then.
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Anderson played better than everyone but Doughty but Bjornfot stayed up because he was headed back to Sweden whereas Mikey is 45min away.. At least thats the way I see it, the kid is getting rewarded for a great camp and the Dman most ready to step in is marinating in Onatrio waiting for the call
 
Choralone said:
Based on Bjornfot's preseason play and praise from inside and outside the organization, I don't think people were reaching when they said he could play up the whole year. He hasn't played "bad" by any stretch. But if Sweden will do the most for him, Sweden it should be then.
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But they were reaching simply because of the contract issue. He would have needed to be 18 year old Drew Doughty to have them blow a year of his ELC on this season and, as good as his pre-season was, he was not and is not 18 year old Drew Doughty.

Rosen cautioned everyone that he was most likely going back after the ninth game because of the contract. Just another brick in the "this season doesn't matter" wall. Blake is playing the long game at this point.
 
Bandit said:
I feel bad for Amadio.
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He had really good chemistry with Kovy and this season with Lewis.. wouldn't surprise me to see kovy get a few more points over the weekend.. I mean, what could possibly happen when you pair a passer, a shooter and a guy that does dirty work on a line :sarcasm:
 
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kings11 said:
He had really good chemistry with Kovy and this season with Lewis.. wouldn't surprise me to see kovy get a few more points over the weekend.. I mean, what could possibly happen when you pair a passer, a shooter and a guy that does dirty work on a line :sarcasm:
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I hope you're right, but Kovalchuck seems a might bit unpredictable at best, and that's being kind.
 
Bandit said:
I hope you're right, but Kovalchuck seems a might bit unpredictable at best, and that's being kind.
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You'd be surprised just how hard a shooter will work to get open when he notices that linemates can get passes through to him in prime spots..
 
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