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Reaper45

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There was absolutely a run on D that draft so they took Bjornfot at 22 over Kaliyev even though they had AK ranked higher. They figured better to grab a dman now at 22 and take the one they like in Bjornfot than to take Kaliyev at 22 and hope there was still a dman they really liked with the 2nd rounder. Doesnt mean that Bjornfot was BPA at 22 and that's ok.
 
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BigKing

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There was absolutely a run on D that draft so they took Bjornfot at 22 over Kaliyev even though they had AK ranked higher. They figured better to grab a dman now at 22 and take the one they like in Bjornfot than to take Kaliyev at 22 and hope there was still a dman they really liked with the 2nd rounder. Doesnt mean that Bjornfot was BPA at 22 and that's ok.

Exactly. Pretty sure that it was intimated at the time that he wasn't the BPA on their board but was their top D at that point.

I'm not saying AK was the #1 on their board at 22OA either. It's just revisionist history to say they went BPA there because Bjornfot made the opening night roster.

Jon Bernier wasn't the BPA either in his draft. Also made the opening night roster and then looked fantastic against the defending champ Ducks. We all thought we had a future Vezina winner on our hands. Just something to think about before we start rattling off that Bjornfot is an NHL fixture on a top pairing.

I'm really excited about the guy: don't get me wrong. I didn't love the pick at the time because I wanted more of a home run swing but I also didn't have a problem with drafting a guy that seemed to be somewhat of a lock to be a regular NHL defenseman. When your current D corp is horrible, it is hard to hate the idea of having a #4 defenseman on an ELC that brings intangibles. If he proves the scouting reports wrong and is better than a #4--and not just "A top pairing guy" because he plays next to Doughty--then the Kings wound up hitting a home run while choking up on the bat. That's awesome and hope it is the case.
 

kings11

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There was absolutely a run on D that draft so they took Bjornfot at 22 over Kaliyev even though they had AK ranked higher. They figured better to grab a dman now at 22 and take the one they like in Bjornfot than to take Kaliyev at 22 and hope there was still a dman they really liked with the 2nd rounder. Doesnt mean that Bjornfot was BPA at 22 and that's ok.

Where is this coming from? go ahead and find a link for us
 
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Choralone

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Athletic article from Scott Wheeler entitled Wheeler: One prospect from all 31 NHL teams poised for a...

His choice for the LA Kings breakout season? Aidan Dudas
Dudas’ coming-out party is almost set in stone. Hockey Canada is high on him and they’ve made it clear he’s a contender for the world juniors team. He played well at the World Junior Summer Showcase and he’s now finally the go-to guy in Owen Sound, where he is excelling early in the year. The Kings have a lot of high-end NHL prospects (Arthur Kaliyev, Rasmus Kupari, Alex Turcotte, Akil Thomas, etc.) and I expect Dudas will work his way into that conversation this year as a potential piece of the rebuild.
 
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Raccoon Jesus

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Exactly. Pretty sure that it was intimated at the time that he wasn't the BPA on their board but was their top D at that point.

I'm not saying AK was the #1 on their board at 22OA either. It's just revisionist history to say they went BPA there because Bjornfot made the opening night roster.

Jon Bernier wasn't the BPA either in his draft. Also made the opening night roster and then looked fantastic against the defending champ Ducks. We all thought we had a future Vezina winner on our hands. Just something to think about before we start rattling off that Bjornfot is an NHL fixture on a top pairing.

I'm really excited about the guy: don't get me wrong. I didn't love the pick at the time because I wanted more of a home run swing but I also didn't have a problem with drafting a guy that seemed to be somewhat of a lock to be a regular NHL defenseman. When your current D corp is horrible, it is hard to hate the idea of having a #4 defenseman on an ELC that brings intangibles. If he proves the scouting reports wrong and is better than a #4--and not just "A top pairing guy" because he plays next to Doughty--then the Kings wound up hitting a home run while choking up on the bat. That's awesome and hope it is the case.

I know this isn't the point of your post, but wanted to comment on the boldfaced.

Bjornfot earned his way up to playing next to Doughty in the same manner Lizotte worked his way up--he looked excellent individually and in tandem with everyone except Clague, who was a black hole of suck no matter who he was put with.

I have zero doubt Bjornfot could anchor our second pairing and be the Voynov role if he gets fatigued or whatever next to Doughty. I don't feel that way about Forbort, which I'm sure is who you're referencing.
 

Rorschach

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Where is this coming from? go ahead and find a link for us

I mean even the commenters at the draft were saying that live as players were getting drafted. Everyone knew Byram was going top five but when Detroit reached, nabbing Moritz Seider, a lot of defensemen started getting drafted ahead of their final rankings on a lot of people's lists. When York got drafted over guys like Krebs and Caufield, it certainly looked like a D run. Then three of the next four picks after Krebs were Harley, Thomson and Heinola before the Kings pick at 22, that certainly looked like a run.
 
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crassbonanza

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Exactly. Pretty sure that it was intimated at the time that he wasn't the BPA on their board but was their top D at that point.

I'm not saying AK was the #1 on their board at 22OA either. It's just revisionist history to say they went BPA there because Bjornfot made the opening night roster.

Can you share where it was intimated that he wasn't the BPA? I don't remember reading that at all, maybe I missed it because it seems like so many are remembering the Kings scouting saying that they chose a worse player because he was a D.

Jon Bernier wasn't the BPA either in his draft. Also made the opening night roster and then looked fantastic against the defending champ Ducks. We all thought we had a future Vezina winner on our hands. Just something to think about before we start rattling off that Bjornfot is an NHL fixture on a top pairing.

Bernier was the consensus best goaltender in his draft and most mocks at the time had him in the 10-15 range(he went 11th so right in range). Not sure why you are mentioning him as reach when there are some actual recent examples.

As for Bernier not panning out, it's really easy to find examples of propects having a hot start and burning out. It is also easy to find examples of a prospect having a hot start and working out.

I'm really excited about the guy: don't get me wrong. I didn't love the pick at the time because I wanted more of a home run swing but I also didn't have a problem with drafting a guy that seemed to be somewhat of a lock to be a regular NHL defenseman. When your current D corp is horrible, it is hard to hate the idea of having a #4 defenseman on an ELC that brings intangibles. If he proves the scouting reports wrong and is better than a #4--and not just "A top pairing guy" because he plays next to Doughty--then the Kings wound up hitting a home run while choking up on the bat. That's awesome and hope it is the case.

Nearly all scouting reports prior to the draft projected him as a top 4 defenseman not a number 4, I don't know where you read that projection. That may explain why you were so against the pick, you must have read a bad scouting report. Therefor, I doubt he will have to prove any scouting reports wrong.
 
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BigKing

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RJ - I'm not saying he can't be a top pairing defenseman but rather it is early to call him one before he plays a real game. I'm sure there is a better defenseman than him on a better team that is on a 2nd pair but I guess that player wouldn't be a "top pairing defenseman". I am referencing Fordork because he is the poster boy for simply calling someone "top pairing" since there are better defenseman on his own team, nevermind around the league.

Are you saying he could anchor the 2nd pairing right now? That would be great but that is still a stretch to say based off of one training camp. The potential is definitely there since he's shown well in pre-season but it is a whole other thing to do it for 82. I mean, I watched pre-season as well and think he looks really good but how much is reality, how much is hoping for anything young and good after nothing for years and then--I guess--how much is me seeing so many highly touted Kings prospects flounder? Probably a mix of all three but I feel like there is a lot of the second part.

Crass - The articles with Blake and Yanetti...they may not have flat out said that he wasn't BPA but they pretty much said they wanted to go defense there and he was the best D on their board. Seems like it would have taken a real tumble by a forward for them to not go defense there. I get it since they used all of their first and second round picks on forwards under Blake up until that point.

I'm not saying Bernier was a reach: I'm saying he wasn't the BPA. Lombardi drafted for need--or what he thought was the need since Quick was already drafted--since he believed in "building from the net out". I was making the point that just because a 1st round pick makes the team out of camp, it doesn't mean the drafting team went BPA or that said player is destined for greatness.

I didn't hate the pick but I would prefer the #2 sniper in the draft when I see a pipeline devoid of any player like AK. With Bjornfot not projected to have much offensive upside, it looked like the Kings settled for a single or possibly a double instead of going for the home run. Many that are high on him now didn't like the pick that much then, believing him to be superfluous compared to what we already had in the pipeline. If Frolov 6'3" loves the kid because he has actually been been watching him play, that's cool. There is another element that pretty much pumps every pick and prospect signing as a great move by the Kings and all of them are going to be good NHL players. When that element wants to change the narrative, that's when I have a problem. If you think everyone is going to be great, you don't get to tell everyone you were right when one of them actually turns out. In the same vein, you could say I am overly negative but I have my guys and I'll admit when I was wrong which, to no surprise, happens often.

One game of Brickley at the end of the 2018 season and I had him penciled in as an NHL player
I felt Nic Dowd would be a legit Bottom 6

Those are just recent ones. Been easy to not get too high on any Kings prospects the past few years, although I've always been high on Wagner. Go back to the 00's when we were in a similar shit show and I was certain that Kanko, Lehoux, Grebeshkov, Boyle, Tambellini, Aulin, Moller, Bernier etc...were going to be legit because I was just hoping and they had pedigree. I understand wanting to pump the tires on our prospects, even down to someone ranked towards #20 like Rempal, but we have to remember that we've had good pipelines before but nothing is a guaranty.

I'm all in on AK though. I'm far from a scout, obviously, but his knack for scoring is special. Real scouts have doubts but this desk jockey with YouTube is all in and I'll be the first to admit I was wrong if he flames out. No guarantees, of course, but I am very pleased with Blake walking out with Turcotte/Bjornfot/Kaliyev/Fagemo. I don't want to throw cold water on the excitement because I haven't been this excited about Kings prospects in a long time, but I also cringe when I see a projected D lineup for next season and the next few years of Doughty/Bjornfot/Anderson/Clague/Durzi/Strand or something like that.
 

kilowatt

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Jan 1, 2009
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Where is this coming from? go ahead and find a link for us

I think it comes from this interview with Yanetti:

So, what happens is you look at 22, and we had a dead heat at 22. So, you have a D and a forward that happen to be our dead heat. And then you look at the draft, and if you look at our list – not any independent list – between 22 and 32, we would’ve had two defensemen left on our list, and then between 22 and 33, we had two defensemen but we had four forwards. I know it doesn’t make sense – that’s why it’s the short version. So, the odds of there being a defenseman there at 33 were less than half of what it was with there being a forward. That’s just your numbers. Now, you look at all the independent lists, and we identified two of those forwards we thought would be the ones to fall, so now it checks another box in terms of what may be there. So, what we did is we took a slight calculation of risking maybe losing the forward because if we lose those guys, the difference in depth between the four guys that we lose and the ones that would be available at 33 was much less than what you’d lose between a defenseman. So, if the two defensemen are on a scale of 1-100, the difference is 70. If the forwards go, the next forward, it’s like 20. So we kind of took a calculated risk saying that we wouldn’t get defensive value at 33, but we could still get forward value if our list went wrong. … I can’t tell you how stressful it was watching 27, 28, 29, and then once it got to 31, then we knew we’d get one of the two, and we’re like, ‘oh yeah, we’re geniuses.’ And I’m sitting there the whole time, like, ‘don’t [go poorly].’ I’m telling Rob this is a probability, and if a probability doesn’t happen, then I’d look like an idiot.

Affecting culture through the draft; weighing forwards, defensemen at 22, 33; more from Yannetti - LA Kings Insider

It says Bjornfot and Kaliyev were in a “dead heat”, though, not that one was better or viewed more highly than another.
 
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bland

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I think it comes from this interview with Yanetti:



Affecting culture through the draft; weighing forwards, defensemen at 22, 33; more from Yannetti - LA Kings Insider

It says Bjornfot and Kaliyev were in a “dead heat”, though, not that one was better or viewed more highly than another.

No, it says that the dead heat was between Bjornfot and a forward. That particular forward was one of four options, and by the time the second round pick was made, two of the forwards were left to choose from.

At no point has any Kings official stated that Kaliyev was the forward they wanted. We just know that he was one of four being considered. He could very well have been third on their list of four.

There were ten forwards chosen after Bjornfot, one of which was Kaliyev. We will likely never find out who the other two they wanted were.
 
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kings11

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I mean even the commenters at the draft were saying that live as players were getting drafted. Everyone knew Byram was going top five but when Detroit reached, nabbing Moritz Seider, a lot of defensemen started getting drafted ahead of their final rankings on a lot of people's lists. When York got drafted over guys like Krebs and Caufield, it certainly looked like a D run. Then three of the next four picks after Krebs were Harley, Thomson and Heinola before the Kings pick at 22, that certainly looked like a run.

Thats not answering the question i asked now is it
 

kings11

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I think it comes from this interview with Yanetti:



Affecting culture through the draft; weighing forwards, defensemen at 22, 33; more from Yannetti - LA Kings Insider

It says Bjornfot and Kaliyev were in a “dead heat”, though, not that one was better or viewed more highly than another.

Oh i know what was said and I repeat, at no time did they ever say Kaliyev was ranked higher than Bjornfot. If you really want to interpret that comment, it clearly leans toward placing a higher ranking on the defenseman available aka Bjornfot, Harley, Heinola and Johnson over Kaliyev, Suzuki, Brink and Tomasino.
 

kilowatt

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No, it says that the dead heat was between Bjornfot and a forward. That particular forward was one of four options, and by the time the second round pick was made, two of the forwards were left to choose from.

At no point has any Kings official stated that Kaliyev was the forward they wanted. We just know that he was one of four being considered. He could very well have been third on their list of four.

There were ten forwards chosen after Bjornfot, one of which was Kaliyev. We will likely never find out who the other two they wanted were.

This is all true, but they never said it wasn’t Kaliyev, either. I’m not on either side of this argument because we’re all arguing for no damn reason.

Oh i know what was said and I repeat, at no time did they ever say Kaliyev was ranked higher than Bjornfot. If you really want to interpret that comment, it clearly leans toward placing a higher ranking on the defenseman available aka Bjornfot, Harley, Heinola and Johnson over Kaliyev, Suzuki, Brink and Tomasino.

If you want to interpret it even further, you can see that it says it was a dead heat between a defenseman and a forward.
 
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kings11

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Easy tiger I don't think I need to provide any link. It's obvious or else they wouldnt have talked about how they were sweating bullets about Kaliyev until the 2nd round.

Talking out of your ass aren't you Reaper. Sweating bullets hoping he'd fall to us is a lot different than sweating bullets over having drafted Bjornfot which is the lame argument many have..

Let me put it this way, most of the comments on here about Bjornfot when he was selected were because most on here didn't know who he was and made half-ass comments. If people knew their shit, they'd know he was a top 10 prospect pre-draft year who tumbled over offensive concerns. But lucky for us, scouts tend to be bias with their projections and overlooked the fact that this kid was the best defender in the draft and while his offense didn't translate not goals, his ability to drive/push/carry the puck into the offensive zone was impressive. When we factor all this in and realize that the team went as he went even though it had two teammates drafted before is even more impressive...
 

kings11

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This is all true, but they never said it wasn’t Kaliyev, either. I’m not on either side of this argument because we’re all arguing for no damn reason.



If you want to interpret it even further, you can see that it says it was a dead heat between a defenseman and a forward.

Except it wasn't... it's pretty easy to say the top 3 choices were Bjornfot, Harley and Heinola. In what order IDK but Kaliyev was not in a dead heat with those guys. I honestly didn't think any of those 3 would be available at 22 but we lucked out
 

kilowatt

the vibes are not immaculate
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Except it wasn't... it's pretty easy to say the top 3 choices were Bjornfot, Harley and Heinola. In what order IDK but Kaliyev was not in a dead heat with those guys. I honestly didn't think any of those 3 would be available at 22 but we lucked out

Just because you say it doesn’t make it any more true. Yanetti literally says it was a dead heat between a forward and a defenseman.

But I don’t think anyone here is upset about drafting Bjornfot, and those that were - myself included - were clearly wrong. Hopefully he turns out to be on the top pair with Drew for the next decade! And hopefully Kaliyev is scoring 50 goals alongside Turcotte and Kupari. :D
 

Reaper45

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Talking out of your ass aren't you Reaper. Sweating bullets hoping he'd fall to us is a lot different than sweating bullets over having drafted Bjornfot which is the lame argument many have..

Let me put it this way, most of the comments on here about Bjornfot when he was selected were because most on here didn't know who he was and made half-ass comments. If people knew their ****, they'd know he was a top 10 prospect pre-draft year who tumbled over offensive concerns. But lucky for us, scouts tend to be bias with their projections and overlooked the fact that this kid was the best defender in the draft and while his offense didn't translate not goals, his ability to drive/push/carry the puck into the offensive zone was impressive. When we factor all this in and realize that the team went as he went even though it had two teammates drafted before is even more impressive...
How am I talking out of my ass? You're arguing just to argue. Adios sugar tits.
 
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