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News Article: 2017 Training Camp & Pre-Season Discussion

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TheTakedown said:
All that had to be done was to buy out Staal and there would be no additional issues with this roster. Not only could we have used the cap space but we'd have another d spot open for Holden, and then eventually Pionk
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Thing is after this year Staals no trade becomes limited I believe so they can move him at 50 off. If tbay pays Girardi what he got then Staal is tradeable. Next year both Staal and Holden are out and the Graves , Pionk types can go in

Pionk could use a year in the AHL anyway but Graves has proven it down there so he should be the next in line for a call up
 
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One thing to keep in mind with Staal is that not we're not hurting for cap space right now.

My keeping Staal for at least one more year, we shorten the length of his buyout. 3 years becoming six is better than 4 years becoming 8.

Furthermore, he can't really look worse. Let him play it out. Maybe we can make a sure when the NTC kicks in instead of the NMC.
 
Ola said:
Yeah, and like I looked around some, the amount of games he played from the start of last season until now is just mindboggling, 1 game every other 3 days around the calendar. 117 games in a little more than 12 months. I've checked SKA players, Pittsburg players that also played in the World Cup, the US and Canadian draftees . I can't find anyone that really comes close. Crosby is probably the second highest with around 110 games with both preseasons. Swedish U20 played a ton of games, the WJC, full SHL, CHL some junior games in Sweden etc, crazy amount of games this summer.

I don't think he should have been ready anyway. Not making excuses for him. I don't think it's something that will hurt him down the road, it must be the opposite.

But I am definitely optimistic that we will see a kid that is a lot more explosive and energetic in 12 months.
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Yeah I saw fatigue in the guy, remember he played Swedish U20, Swedish Playoffs, Summer U20s, Champions League, Traverse City, Prospects Camp, and SHL, and NHL Pre-Season plus Training camp. The legs gave out.

Ola said:
Can Chytil& Andersson become our Krejci and Bergeron?

Not as carbon copies, but look at how fast that Boston team came together. I don't have all the details infront of me, but I checked up on it about a year ago. During a very short time period, Marchand, Bergeron, Krejci and Lucic came out of nowhere for them, in a sense. Think all was drafted within 3 years. We have a better platform than Boston had, but we got some interesting players coming in for sure too. Vesey, Skjei and Buch last season. If Chytil, Lias, DeAngelo and Pionk/Graves can make it in the coming two seasons -- they can really really improve this hockey team. We have some good players already on the roster.
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The same guy who built that BOS core is now the Rangers GM.
 
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I am so heartily tired of all the personal criticism of Staal. Yes, he is a shell of what he once was. Yes, the ideal of what makes a top tier NHL defenseman has changed and the game has passed him by. Yes, his contract is a drag on our salary cap. We all know that: even those of us who value what Staal has meant to this team. Criticize his play. certainly. But leave the personal comments out. I am just so sick of them. And you know what? He doesn't deserve it...even in his present state. This guy has been a rock for us. One of the best #1 picks in the modern era of the drafts (better: Leetch, maybe Kovalev, James Patrick?). A guy who lived up to his potential, was a legit first pair D in an era when his skill set was valued. One of the heart and soul leaders of some of the best Ranger teams of the last 40 years. And let's not forget what he has suffered: multiple concussions, a horrific eye injury.

So let's celebrate this guy and not personally berate him. He doesn't deserve it, nor does he merit it.

I'm not sure that he is even a third pair D anymore, but that is beside the point. Perhaps he should have been bought out and maybe he will be next summer. But he is not going anywhere. Repeat: he is not going anywhere. He is not going to be traded. Maybe he starts the year on our third pair. But as much as AV, who (heresy, heresy) I think is one of the best coaches in the league and not the complete idiot that some of you think he is, wants to play him and wants to see him succeed, if Staal doesn't play well he will be relegated to the press box only dressing if there is an injury. We have to much talent on D sitting in Hartford for Staal to play if he proves that he can't. AV will not play him if consistently hurts the team.

I am certainly capable of being quite critical of our players. In fact, I pride myself in seeing through personal attachment to anyone wearing a Ranger sweater, and accessing play. But I only truly criticize players who underperform or don't have the work ethic to do well. Staal is the opposite of that. By any stretch of the imagination, he has been one of our top defensemen for a long time. Yes, that time is done. But he not someone who is coasting, just collecting his salary. He is in great shape, continues to play hard, and is a locker room leader.

Personal criticism of unwarranted, unfounded, and uncalled for. Criticize his play...certainly. Criticize the man......no. And enough with stating over and over that he should have been bought out. He wasn't. Enough with saying that JG should have found some way of moving him. This is real life, not fantasy hockey. Wishing can't make it so. Staal is here, likely for the whole year. Perhaps for the length of his contract. Moaning and groaning will not change that. I refuse to criticize this player, the epitome of what it means to wear the Ranger sweater with pride.
 
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There's a whole lot of teams that would love to have a Marc Staal on their 3rd pairing..
 
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NYR said:
There's a whole lot of teams that would love to have a Marc Staal on their 3rd pairing..
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CISTC0TUkAA8Pby.jpg
 
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AV mentioned Andersson took a shot off the foot early in preseason. He also took a shot off the same foot the 2nd to last game which is why he was held out of game #6.

Also, his game is predicated on his ability to strip pucks, play a 2-way game and win those 1 on 1 battles. He does that in other leagues. He may not be strong enough to do that with men in this lesgue yet.

Chytil's game is predicated on none of that. It's all skill.
 
Yeah, so many teams would want Staal on the 3rd pair, and yet the Rangers can't give him away even if they retain salary. Gorton is just being stubborn on the what he perceives as Staal's true value.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
A whole lot? Maybe a small handful, and certainly not at his salary.
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I'm not about to claim Staal as any kind of defensive stalwart anymore but I would imagine those very teams are laughing a whole lot harder at Smith on the 2nd pair at his salary..
 
Nope, don't think that's true at all

Smith and Staal both have the same amount of years left on their contracts (4)

I'm pretty sure every team in the league takes Smith before even thinking about Staal
 
NYR said:
I'm not about to claim Staal as any kind of defensive stalwart anymore but I would imagine those very teams are laughing a whole lot harder at Smith on the 2nd pair at his salary..
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Way to deflect. What does Smith have to do with anything? You said a whole lot of teams would love to have Staal, which is just crazy.
 
nyr2k2 said:
What's your view on Pionk's upside? With his mobility and puck moving ability, and a defensive game that's already competent, I see no reason to think he can't become a solid contributor on the second pair. JMO.
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I think he could be a #4 eventually, but the big thing is size, and how his offense might translate to the NHL level.

Pionk, were he in the NHL, would be in the bottom quarter in size for a defenseman. Similar size players are either #1-2 level offensive producers (Krug, Liles, Honka, Gogo, Dumba, Brodie, Klingberg, Ghost) Or they are barely in the NHL. You don't see many two-way defensemen who are 5'11" 190lbs.

Its good that he can skate like Skjei and McDonagh but he simply doesn't have their frame. I think for Pionk to be considered more than a good 3rd pairing guy, he will have to become a good point producer at the pro level.
 
alkurtz said:
I am so heartily tired of all the personal criticism of Staal. Yes, he is a shell of what he once was. Yes, the ideal of what makes a top tier NHL defenseman has changed and the game has passed him by. Yes, his contract is a drag on our salary cap. We all know that: even those of us who value what Staal has meant to this team. Criticize his play. certainly. But leave the personal comments out. I am just so sick of them. And you know what? He doesn't deserve it...even in his present state. This guy has been a rock for us. One of the best #1 picks in the modern era of the drafts (better: Leetch, maybe Kovalev, James Patrick?). A guy who lived up to his potential, was a legit first pair D in an era when his skill set was valued. One of the heart and soul leaders of some of the best Ranger teams of the last 40 years. And let's not forget what he has suffered: multiple concussions, a horrific eye injury.

So let's celebrate this guy and not personally berate him. He doesn't deserve it, nor does he merit it.

I'm not sure that he is even a third pair D anymore, but that is beside the point. Perhaps he should have been bought out and maybe he will be next summer. But he is not going anywhere. Repeat: he is not going anywhere. He is not going to be traded. Maybe he starts the year on our third pair. But as much as AV, who (heresy, heresy) I think is one of the best coaches in the league and not the complete idiot that some of you think he is, wants to play him and wants to see him succeed, if Staal doesn't play well he will be relegated to the press box only dressing if there is an injury. We have to much talent on D sitting in Hartford for Staal to play if he proves that he can't. AV will not play him if consistently hurts the team.

I am certainly capable of being quite critical of our players. In fact, I pride myself in seeing through personal attachment to anyone wearing a Ranger sweater, and accessing play. But I only truly criticize players who underperform or don't have the work ethic to do well. Staal is the opposite of that. By any stretch of the imagination, he has been one of our top defensemen for a long time. Yes, that time is done. But he not someone who is coasting, just collecting his salary. He is in great shape, continues to play hard, and is a locker room leader.

Personal criticism of unwarranted, unfounded, and uncalled for. Criticize his play...certainly. Criticize the man......no. And enough with stating over and over that he should have been bought out. He wasn't. Enough with saying that JG should have found some way of moving him. This is real life, not fantasy hockey. Wishing can't make it so. Staal is here, likely for the whole year. Perhaps for the length of his contract. Moaning and groaning will not change that. I refuse to criticize this player, the epitome of what it means to wear the Ranger sweater with pride.
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I agree with your post--at least 98% of it. The truth still remains we should have bought him out. We have better players and he does not merit his spot at least not on his present ability. Another player--for instance Graves would be a much better fit for us on the left side of our D.

And no I don't believe he is going anywhere this season. He'll be on the roster the entire year. And for all the good things he's done over the years for the Rangers he's been recompensed pretty well. In that sense he should have nothing to complain about. Part of the point is he signed a legally binding contract and there are conditions for his employment. There are legally binding ways of buying out that contract that would negate those conditions which IMO very well could hurt the team this year and in the future. That's why I continue to say we should have bought him out.

Apart from all that I have great respect for what he's done in the past for this team.
 
Mittelstadt Nemesis said:
I think he could be a #4 eventually, but the big thing is size, and how his offense might translate to the NHL level.

Pionk, were he in the NHL, would be in the bottom quarter in size for a defenseman. Similar size players are either #1-2 level offensive producers (Krug, Liles, Honka, Gogo, Dumba, Brodie, Klingberg, Ghost) Or they are barely in the NHL. You don't see many two-way defensemen who are 5'11" 190lbs.

Its good that he can skate like Skjei and McDonagh but he simply doesn't have their frame. I think for Pionk to be considered more than a good 3rd pairing guy, he will have to become a good point producer at the pro level.
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It's funny you mention Krug because that's who his game reminded me of in the preseason.
 
If Girardi got 2x3, I suspect a team might give Staal 3x3.

Meaning, if we offered with 50% retained, there is a small chance some team might take him. But I think the 4 year term would cause some discomfort. And you have to deal with the NMC.
 
nyr2k2 said:
Way to deflect. What does Smith have to do with anything? You said a whole lot of teams would love to have Staal, which is just crazy.
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OK..Having Staal on the 3rd is far from the worst thing in the world.
To claim otherwise is a bit beyond crazy..
Does that work for you?
 
Practice was on MSG today.

I thought it was a really good practice and Skjei looked sharp.

It was encouraging to see Fast skating.
 
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